Shawn's "Magic Intake" ???
02-25-2004, 08:32 AM
#104
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AND ABOUT FILTER
Search http://www.summitracing.com for "Velocity Stack" and it comes up with alot more than just the RS Akimoto piece...I don't know if I'm right yet, but theres velocity stacks with filters on them on there....so if you wanna do that on the street it might really work better than just our normal SRI's with big K&N filters on them and what not...I dunno...but running a filter on a velocity stack kind of ruins the point which is uninterupted airflow like on ITB's but just going through a single TB which makes power and throttle response.
03-15-2004, 05:34 PM
#105
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Re: (C_A_T)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by C_A_T »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Not necessarily.
The pipe length will determine the resonant frequencies. These frequencies determine which rpm points you'll get "humps" in the torque curve at due to resonant supercharging. The pipe diameter is a little harder to describe, but basically, the larger it is, the more biased it will be toward high rpm output.
For several race cars we've done testing with multiple lengths of pipe that allow us to create intakes anywhere from 12" to 48" long. As you step down in length, you'll see the primary resonant peak begin to move higher and higher 24"-36" will create a peak in approximately the 5000-6000 rpm range (you can actually run simple physics calcs and determine the exact frequency - search on Helmholtz), but curvature, etc. do play a role.
On a street car, the typical AEM system length is pretty good. You get a nice bump in torque down low with good top end power - its a nice compromise. For a road racing car, I usually like to get the intake length such that we can broaden the power band and lower VTEC. I really don't care about performance below 3000-4000 rpm when the car is spending all its time above those points. This usually requires that we shorten the intake up to move the torque peak higher and then dropping the VTEC transition to take advantage of the resonance supercharging.
However, often such an intake length, for reasons I can't fully explain, will compromise top end power a bit. Perhaps the shorter pipe length doesn't build enough flow velocity, or the flow isn't smooth enough. Thus, for a drag car, something a bit longer, focused on power on the top end, might be preferable.
You can do these experiments yourself. Simply get several sections of 3" tubing, some silicone connectors and an airhorn. You'll probably need at least one curved piece to get the pipe to easily clear obstructions in the engine bay. There is no need to fit it under the hood for testing (although keep in mind that more curves will reduce flow/power). When you find your optimum length, keep in mind that if it places the intake opening under the hood, you'll lose power from hot air. You may need to design a sealed (large) airbox with a cold air duct - which provides a chance for some additional resonance tuning plus ram air supercharging....
Anyways, it doesn't take many dyno runs if you prepare in advance, just be prepared to do a little retuning as the resonance peaks will create lean spots.
C_A_T</TD></TR></TABLE>
Nice to find you on honda-tech C_A_T.
The pipe length will determine the resonant frequencies. These frequencies determine which rpm points you'll get "humps" in the torque curve at due to resonant supercharging. The pipe diameter is a little harder to describe, but basically, the larger it is, the more biased it will be toward high rpm output.
For several race cars we've done testing with multiple lengths of pipe that allow us to create intakes anywhere from 12" to 48" long. As you step down in length, you'll see the primary resonant peak begin to move higher and higher 24"-36" will create a peak in approximately the 5000-6000 rpm range (you can actually run simple physics calcs and determine the exact frequency - search on Helmholtz), but curvature, etc. do play a role.
On a street car, the typical AEM system length is pretty good. You get a nice bump in torque down low with good top end power - its a nice compromise. For a road racing car, I usually like to get the intake length such that we can broaden the power band and lower VTEC. I really don't care about performance below 3000-4000 rpm when the car is spending all its time above those points. This usually requires that we shorten the intake up to move the torque peak higher and then dropping the VTEC transition to take advantage of the resonance supercharging.
However, often such an intake length, for reasons I can't fully explain, will compromise top end power a bit. Perhaps the shorter pipe length doesn't build enough flow velocity, or the flow isn't smooth enough. Thus, for a drag car, something a bit longer, focused on power on the top end, might be preferable.
You can do these experiments yourself. Simply get several sections of 3" tubing, some silicone connectors and an airhorn. You'll probably need at least one curved piece to get the pipe to easily clear obstructions in the engine bay. There is no need to fit it under the hood for testing (although keep in mind that more curves will reduce flow/power). When you find your optimum length, keep in mind that if it places the intake opening under the hood, you'll lose power from hot air. You may need to design a sealed (large) airbox with a cold air duct - which provides a chance for some additional resonance tuning plus ram air supercharging....
Anyways, it doesn't take many dyno runs if you prepare in advance, just be prepared to do a little retuning as the resonance peaks will create lean spots.
C_A_T</TD></TR></TABLE>
Nice to find you on honda-tech C_A_T.
12-01-2004, 09:42 PM
#107
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Re: (Rocket)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Rocket »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've seen the results too on a friends car. Gained 10whp over the J's. 
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Really? You got a dyno graph? Was it mostly peak power or was it throughout the curve?
</TD></TR></TABLE>Really? You got a dyno graph? Was it mostly peak power or was it throughout the curve?
12-02-2004, 09:42 AM
#109
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Re: Shawn's "Magic Intake" ??? (b20ek)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by b20ek »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">You could use some screen our wrap some panty hose over the end to keep out some of the dirt.</TD></TR></TABLE>
panty hose? lol crazy.
i think i'd still put a filter over that and just take it off on track days
panty hose? lol crazy.
i think i'd still put a filter over that and just take it off on track days
05-09-2005, 10:49 PM
#111
Re: Shawn's "Magic Intake" ??? (WAFFLES)
what would happen if you use that velocity stack @ where the AEM CAI's filter is
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?
05-10-2005, 08:56 AM
#113
Re: Shawn's "Magic Intake" ??? (itr1244)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by itr1244 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what would happen if you use that velocity stack @ where the AEM CAI's filter is
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?</TD></TR></TABLE>
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?</TD></TR></TABLE>
05-10-2005, 08:06 PM
#116
Re: Shawn's "Magic Intake" ??? (itr1244)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by itr1244 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what would happen if you use that velocity stack @ where the AEM CAI's filter is
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?</TD></TR></TABLE>
and how about making the velocity stack to fit j's intake
wouldnt it make the air flow in faster? or is it better to use it as "short ram" style?</TD></TR></TABLE>
and how about making the velocity stack to fit j's intake
05-10-2005, 08:22 PM
#117
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Re: Shawn's "Magic Intake" ??? (itr1244)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by itr1244 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
and how about making the velocity stack to fit j's intake</TD></TR></TABLE>
test it out and dyno it and let us know
and how about making the velocity stack to fit j's intake</TD></TR></TABLE>
test it out and dyno it and let us know
10-05-2005, 10:00 PM
#121
Member
it makes me laugh seeing all the people in this thread that need exact step by step instructions to figure out how to hook a velocity stack to a piece of pipe
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