F23 NA BUILD
09-26-2008, 04:53 AM
#26
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (michaelprice83)
275/195cfm at what lifts? That's not too bad.
These are the flow numbers I've seen for the F22A and F22B2 heads:
All F22 heads benefit a lot from a little porting. But really the F22A is the place to start.
Good luck on the build. I'd like to see a dynagraph sometime.
-Pirate
These are the flow numbers I've seen for the F22A and F22B2 heads:
All F22 heads benefit a lot from a little porting. But really the F22A is the place to start.
Good luck on the build. I'd like to see a dynagraph sometime.
-Pirate
09-26-2008, 08:05 AM
#27
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (PirateMcFred)
Going to the shop today. I'll bring back the specifics of my flowtest. Also I've been told that this head will hit 300cfm with a little more work, valves etc. Whats the highest we've seen an F22a head flow? Also, really would like this question answered, if two heads flow the same cfm wouldn't the one with the smaller ports be flowing with more velocity?
09-26-2008, 04:26 PM
#28
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: maryville, tn., usa
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
once upon a time that question was asked. Brad from RLZ(one of the top porters in the industry as far as i'm concerned) said he had done i believe 309cfm on stock sized valves.
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 400whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential. Unfortunately something tells me square ports and 2k dollar custom rockers aren t exactly streetable
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 400whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential. Unfortunately something tells me square ports and 2k dollar custom rockers aren t exactly streetable
09-27-2008, 03:18 PM
#30
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
"Nice Pics" come on......they'll come soon enough. I have plenty of pics of my headwork posted in my other threads. Will post flowtest later.
09-28-2008, 05:59 AM
#31
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Ontario, Ca, USA
Posts: 1,792
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (civdx94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civdx94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">once upon a time that question was asked. Brad from RLZ(one of the top porters in the industry as far as i'm concerned) said he had done i believe 309cfm on stock sized valves.
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 400whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential. Unfortunately something tells me square ports and 2k dollar custom rockers aren t exactly streetable</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually, the $1600 rockers are fully streetable, as they have extended rocker pads. They are a necessity for over 0.500" lift.
Mild porting, we have seen over 320cfm, on the F22Ax heads. With larger 36mm valves, we have seen over 340cfm with decent porting, at 28"; and for full race, over 360cfm. I <3 portflow!
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 400whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential. Unfortunately something tells me square ports and 2k dollar custom rockers aren t exactly streetable</TD></TR></TABLE>
Actually, the $1600 rockers are fully streetable, as they have extended rocker pads. They are a necessity for over 0.500" lift.
Mild porting, we have seen over 320cfm, on the F22Ax heads. With larger 36mm valves, we have seen over 340cfm with decent porting, at 28"; and for full race, over 360cfm. I <3 portflow!
09-28-2008, 02:35 PM
#32
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
bisi- can u comment on the small port with 300cfm being more ideal than a large port flowing 300cfm? i was told that by a very reputable guy
09-28-2008, 04:02 PM
#33
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: mi
Posts: 1,466
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (civdx94)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civdx94 »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 500 whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Let me fix that for you.
Honestly i'm to lazy to look through archives, but the fact that Bisi makes close to 500 whp on this cylinder head says they have alot of potential.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Let me fix that for you.
09-28-2008, 05:22 PM
#34
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: maryville, tn., usa
Posts: 286
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (Bisimoto)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bisimoto »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Actually, the $1600 rockers are fully streetable, as they have extended rocker pads. They are a necessity for over 0.500" lift.
Mild porting, we have seen over 320cfm, on the F22Ax heads. With larger 36mm valves, we have seen over 340cfm with decent porting, at 28"; and for full race, over 360cfm. I <3 portflow!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Bisi wasn't knocking the setup at all just a rare few individuals i would imagine are running those rockers at this point in time. Plus for this guys goals i would imagine he could make his desired power with one of your cams with less than .500 lift. Thank you for FINALLY putting and end to the F series head flow questions. I have been interested to hear numbers for years
Actually, the $1600 rockers are fully streetable, as they have extended rocker pads. They are a necessity for over 0.500" lift.
Mild porting, we have seen over 320cfm, on the F22Ax heads. With larger 36mm valves, we have seen over 340cfm with decent porting, at 28"; and for full race, over 360cfm. I <3 portflow!</TD></TR></TABLE>
Bisi wasn't knocking the setup at all just a rare few individuals i would imagine are running those rockers at this point in time. Plus for this guys goals i would imagine he could make his desired power with one of your cams with less than .500 lift. Thank you for FINALLY putting and end to the F series head flow questions. I have been interested to hear numbers for years
09-28-2008, 05:35 PM
#35
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
F22a head sounds like fun, maybe for my next build. i'm moving forward with the F23 head, its probably going to hit 300cfm, we'll find out in a week or so. but for now I'm going to take a pic of my current flowsheet. brb.
09-28-2008, 05:48 PM
#36
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (michaelprice83)
ok here are some pics of flowsheet and cam card. please let me know how everything looks. also, do my cam specs more or less dictate how high this engine will be revving? assuming everything else checks out. i wanted the cam to make more top end power. if someone could make sense of the specs and give me some clues as to my potential power band range that would be great.
09-28-2008, 07:19 PM
#37
Member
Re: (michaelprice83)
After seeing that cam card that cam isn't as aggressive as I thought. Crower is measuring it 0.050" for duration. They get 207* on the intake and 178* on the exhaust.
For comparison a Bisi stage 2 cam is measured at only 0.040" and has 230* on the intake and exhaust w/ 0.410" lift on the intake and 0.370" on the exhaust.
That crower cam is OK but you will deff. need something more aggressive then what you have.
For comparison a Bisi stage 2 cam is measured at only 0.040" and has 230* on the intake and exhaust w/ 0.410" lift on the intake and 0.370" on the exhaust.
That crower cam is OK but you will deff. need something more aggressive then what you have.
09-29-2008, 03:44 AM
#39
Honda-Tech Member
Re: (michaelprice83)
Looks like you'll need some retainers for a little extra clearance at those lift numbers.
I think it depends on your induction systems now. That cam is not terribly aggressive for a "VTEC" cam. My SWAG is that your power will peak around 6300 rpm. Higher if the exhaust and intake systems are up to the task.
I think it depends on your induction systems now. That cam is not terribly aggressive for a "VTEC" cam. My SWAG is that your power will peak around 6300 rpm. Higher if the exhaust and intake systems are up to the task.
09-29-2008, 09:33 AM
#41
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Re: (michaelprice83)
So for now lets say I have a 300cfm head stage 1.5 maybe cam maxi lite rods 11.5 compression or so with forged pistons high flow tb im and exhaust balance shaft removal any idea on the numbers with a good hondata tune? 87 bore 97 stroke. I'd like to be realistic about it but also see good potential. Maybe eventually change cam.
09-30-2008, 04:52 PM
#43
Honda-Tech Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Apr 2008
Location: Hebron, IL, usa
Posts: 215
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
well.....i didn't get one comment like that yet. interesting. i think with more work and bigger valves 300cfm is doable and is really a remarkable achievement over the stock 230-240 range. dave hickman's port work apparently did quite a bit and thank god cause he's horrible to deal with.
10-22-2008, 04:24 PM
#46
Honda-Tech Member
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Cuyahoga Falls, Ohio, USA
Posts: 558
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes
on
0 Posts
Nice to see someone else trying the N/A route.
I'm aiming for 11.5:1 compression and Bisi's stage 2 cam and valvetrain. 86.5mm bore. Could probably use a bit more porting on my head though and some larger intake valves, it just has a mild street port on it now.
I'm aiming for 11.5:1 compression and Bisi's stage 2 cam and valvetrain. 86.5mm bore. Could probably use a bit more porting on my head though and some larger intake valves, it just has a mild street port on it now.
