whats better for hp the vortec (centrifugal sc) or a turbo. there the same thing essentially but the vortec is belt driven right? i seen a write up about it before in SCC but it was just about the sc and it doesnt comepare the 2. i think i know the best thing to do for a ls motor is turbo not sc bc with a jrsc you will only get as much hp as a stock gsr but what can the vortec produce?

 

I believe the Vortech and JRSC produce similiar numbers. What do you plan to do with the car? Road race? Drag race only?

You'll make more peak power with a turbo, but the supercharger is nice if you want low end power as well (great for road courses, etc).

 

well my gsr is turbo as my screen name and sig says but my project car is a auto ls 98. i know autos suck in some opinion BUT i have huge plans for this little b18b. i just want others opinion. only educated posts please no post ****** please

 

From the reviews i have read, it sounds like you'll get more fun out of a turbo than a SC on a b18b. Read the testimonials on the integra / itr and forced induction forum. [search]

 

The vortech has a shitty powerband, it doesnt make any power until high rpm, woops then its time to shift

Turbo wins in all perpectives, but please do a search this is the most beaten to death topic on honda-tech...

 

Get a procharger. Go to procharger.com

intercooled, and much better in terms of quality than any other SC.

 

turbo without a doubt

and search.....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by spoolinvtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...sc bc with a jrsc you will only get as much hp as a stock gsr but what can the vortec produce?</TD></TR></TABLE>

are you serious?

 

<FONT SIZE="8">TURBO!</FONT>
get my drift?

the vortec sucks; its like a really shitty trade off for peak turbo power with instantaneous sc boost. either jrsc or turbo, and for an ls: TURBO. you lookin into level 10 to beef up that tranny?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jabroni95gsr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Get a procharger. Go to procharger.com

intercooled, and much better in terms of quality than any other SC.</TD></TR></TABLE>

if its so much better, than why is jackson racing and vortec so much more popular and chosen over procharger almost every time?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Re: vortec supercharger or turbo? (Hites)
if its so much better, than why is jackson racing and vortec so much more popular and chosen over procharger almost every time?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I believe that reason is because Vortech and Jackson Racing are well known than ProCharger. Seeing Mustang SC dyno numbers, would vote for going ProCharger over a Vortech or JRSC as well. Cooler intake air temps, more torque across the powerband, and its a self contained unit.

Between a turbo and supercharger....turbo without a doubt. When the turbo spools you get a **** load of torque, instead of waiting for power to build with a blower. Also, with a blower you only see peak boost at high RPM's, unlike a turbo which can hold peak boost over an extended RPM range for not only more torque, but more peak power.

I'm an idiot, btw, so don't listen to me.

 

don't even option the vortec.

imo, you get the worst part of a turbo and the worst part of a SC.

you get the parasitic drag of a SC, and the lag of a turbo.

get either the JRSC, or a turbo.

it really depends on what you want to do. if you want more power, but not too much, go SC, it is much more managable, and easier for upkeep. not to mention it is very drivable on the streets.

if you want more power, and then more power later, go turbo. the more power, and bigger the turbo the less drivable it becomes and the more upkeep you will need to perform.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nihilation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I believe that reason is because Vortech and Jackson Racing are well known than ProCharger. Seeing Mustang SC dyno numbers, would vote for going ProCharger over a Vortech or JRSC as well. Cooler intake air temps, more torque across the powerband, and its a self contained unit.

Between a turbo and supercharger....turbo without a doubt. When the turbo spools you get a **** load of torque, instead of waiting for power to build with a blower. Also, with a blower you only see peak boost at high RPM's, unlike a turbo which can hold peak boost over an extended RPM range for not only more torque, but more peak power.

I'm an idiot, btw, so don't listen to me.</TD></TR></TABLE>

it was my understanding that its the other way around, thats why they call it turbo lag ?

turbo, especially if your driving an LS.

i havent read anything about the vortec sc but i know the jrsc will give you nice torque/hp at lower rpms than any turbo. although you dont have the lag, you dont get quite as much peak. my .02

 

Knew this recent topic would come in handy

shows back to back comparison between JRSC and Turbo!
See for yourself

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=688120

 

Exactly, notice more TQ from the turbo, and I dunno about "turbo lag" cause I've never really driven a turbo car...but with a centrifigal blower like a Vortech or Procharger, both have to spool-up as well. Turbos will make more power with the same amount of bo0st when compared to blowers, to0.

Winner:
Turbo, hands down. IMO

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nihilation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Exactly, notice more TQ from the turbo, and I dunno about "turbo lag" cause I've never really driven a turbo car...but with a centrifigal blower like a Vortech or Procharger, both have to spool-up as well.

Winner:
Turbo, hands down. IMO</TD></TR></TABLE>

turbo lag is interesting.....though it all depends on what size snail you slap on. my friend has a t3/4 on his 98 LS boosting 6psi (on the street) and he's let me drive it and get on it a bit...and it's like....nothing nothing nothing (needle hits ~3500) and BOOST......you're gone! it would def. take some getting used to, but nothing horrible.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nihilation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I believe that reason is because Vortech and Jackson Racing are well known than ProCharger. Seeing Mustang SC dyno numbers, would vote for going ProCharger over a Vortech or JRSC as well. Cooler intake air temps, more torque across the powerband, and its a self contained unit.

Between a turbo and supercharger....turbo without a doubt. When the turbo spools you get a **** load of torque, instead of waiting for power to build with a blower. Also, with a blower you only see peak boost at high RPM's, unlike a turbo which can hold peak boost over an extended RPM range for not only more torque, but more peak power.

I'm an idiot, btw, so don't listen to me.</TD></TR></TABLE>

whoopdi-do, that mustang is a dyno queen. i guess you never noticed that the stock jrsc runs at 6 psi and the stock procharger runs at 8 psi. from the pictures of the procharger kit ive seen, it looks to have just as many parts as a turbo setup; while the jrsc is basically a blower, pulleys, and belts. btw, turbos pull out bigger numbers because they have no parasitic loss of power, not because they hold a continuous boost pressure over a set rpm range.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Nihilation &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Exactly, notice more TQ from the turbo, and I dunno about "turbo lag" cause I've never really driven a turbo car...but with a centrifigal blower like a Vortech or Procharger, both have to spool-up as well. Turbos will make more power with the same amount of bo0st when compared to blowers, to0.

Winner:
Turbo, hands down. IMO</TD></TR></TABLE>

winner of what? a cookie? pit a car with a big turbo and another with a big sc on a road course and then well see who the winner is.

drag = turbo
autox = sc

 

Seems to be that when you are road racing you would always want to be in your powerband, and wouldn't a turbo give near instant boost as long as you stay within your powerband at all times? I don't see how you can say a blower is better than a turbo in any application. Even when pitted against a roots type blower, I think a turbo will always produce more torque.

 

Turbo IMO i just wanted to post before this gets locked

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Hites &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
drag = turbo
autox = sc</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats what would be assumed...but check the dyno man. The turbo curve overtakes the sc at 3800RPM. From then on its curtains for the jrsc.

I think the real issue with that is turbo lag...for autox, you want to be able to hit the gas and go. If you have the right size turbo, its not an issue. Lag really is way overstated. The JRSCs linear powerband and instant boost makes it easier to drive on an autox course, but not necessarily faster I would say.

As for the Procharger...Im not a fan. Vortech has a cooling system as well...its just the design I dont dig. If you want the driveability of a centrifugal charger, you should just go turbo. Here is a dyno posted recently in FI at 7.5PSI, Procharged GSR:



Compare that to a similar turbo setup at 7.5PSI, you get more power all over the powerband. Still a cool car, nonetheless, but if you want that driveability, may as well go turbo.

What I was most shocked with was how similar my Drag powerband was to the JRSC in terms of when/where power was made.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by newgsrdriver &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thats what would be assumed...but check the dyno man. The turbo curve overtakes the sc at 3800RPM. From then on its curtains for the jrsc.

I think the real issue with that is turbo lag...for autox, you want to be able to hit the gas and go. If you have the right size turbo, its not an issue. Lag really is way overstated. The JRSCs linear powerband and instant boost makes it easier to drive on an autox course, but not necessarily faster I would say.

As for the Procharger...Im not a fan. Vortech has a cooling system as well...its just the design I dont dig. If you want the driveability of a centrifugal charger, you should just go turbo. Here is a dyno posted recently in FI at 7.5PSI, Procharged GSR:

Compare that to a similar turbo setup at 7.5PSI, you get more power all over the powerband. Still a cool car, nonetheless, but if you want that driveability, may as well go turbo.

What I was most shocked with was how similar my Drag powerband was to the JRSC in terms of when/where power was made.</TD></TR></TABLE>

on a small turbo (t25) lag is almost irrelevant and not noticeable, but on some of the larger turbos (t3/t4) and others that reach peak boost at 3500 rpm or above when that boost kicks in, YOU NOTICE. i totally agree on the statement that if you want a centrifugal you should just go turbo. i think that the jrsc is a good "lesson" in forced induction. for someone whos totally new to forced induced hondas, the jrsc is simpler than piecing together a turbo kit; it also teaches fuel management and such. once they think they know what theyre doing, sell that jrsc, put together a nice turbo setup, and head to the strip

 

Hites avatar intimidates me.


Modified by Nihilation at 9:08 PM 11/25/2003

 

I hate the word Turbo Lag, yes it exist, but turbo kits are customizable, thats the beauty. Sure an sc61 on 1.8 is laggy, reaches full boost around 5500, but it makes huge power up top. Now you can also run a small quick spooling turbo, .48 a/r for quicker spool, ect... it goes on and on thats the beaty of turbo, so many options to satisfy everyones goals

My opinon on the autoxcross, road course is use small quick spoooling turbo, turbo is proven to make more power, so what does a s/c have over a turbo that provides instance boost and more power???????

I dont want to argue about the whole autox vs drag issue, but keep in mind theres isnt only one size turbo

Most of the poeple that use and throw around the word turbo lag, have never owned a Turbo honda, they only speak from the ricer myths they hear on the street and read in superstreet while taking a ****


Modified by quikB18B at 6:07 AM 11/26/2003

 

After going from the charger to this setup...I am now going to be the "anti-lag" spokesperson

I have a t3/t04e...and I dont notice lag. It simply isnt an issue. I dont know how it got to be such a big deal? Maybe from the early 90s when dudes were running any T78 they could find on SOHC civics?