B18C5-EH2

I acquired a really clean 1990 STD hatch from my sister a few months back. It was to be a "beater" of sorts and I was planning on leaving it stock as to not pull funds from my other car (see sig.) but I guess plans changed as of last night.

I put the car on the freeway for the first time since I got it, and it rode great despite being 100% stock since it was brand new in 1990 (my mom's the original owner ) but I was worried about the car for some reason.

I thought "you know it needs a timing belt and wouldn't it be just great to break one on the freeway" and sure enough on my way home from Atlanta (I was 20 miles from home) the car lost power at 70mph on the freeway. I took it out of gear, hit the hazards, and coasted to the right shoulder. This was at 1:00am y0!

Luckily I had someone pick me up that had not left the place that I was on my way home from, and a towtruck just dropped the car home a few hours ago.

I have not narrowed the problem down yet, but i'm sure it was either the timing belt that snapped or the motor just finally let go after 190K+ beat-on miles.

This was my first car, and I know that it took 2 years of the worst possible driving/abuse and never let me down or my mom or sis that owned it before and afterwards.

Anyways here's a quick pic of the car and then a few more things:



I guess the old 70hp motor will be swapped in favor of a D16A6 with a 5-speed tranny as opposed to the old 4-speed STD tranny.

I'm thinking of perhaps taking an old D16A6 from the shelves at the shop I work at and dropping in some 1989 Integra RS pistons and using a 1996-up D-Series metal head gasket too just to bump up the performance and reliability a bit.

I need this to be a reliable car first and foremost, and it also needs to be cheap too.

A few questions and then I'm done:

Has anyone here ever out together a D16A6 like I'm talking about? Integra pistons and a metal headgasket and a refreshed overall build?

What kind of dyno numbers have you guys seen from such a set-up? What kind of CR does this set-up usually yield?

Later down the road I'd love to build a hybrid tranny with the ZC 1-5 gearset and a Si FD set, and maybe even add a junkyard turbo.

Thanks for reading!

What kind of junkyard turbo numbers have you guys seen?

TRE_

damn that hatch looks really clean. instead of building the d16a6 i'd just do a zc swap. they are cheap and great motors in my opinion. not high horsepower machines by any means but a nice, simple and cheap swap.
good luck.

B18C5-EH2

Well the ZC isn't my cup of tea for various reasons. The main one is that it's like $650.00 which is out of my price range and I'd still need axles with the ZC tranny.

Not enough aftermarket support IMO, and the cost will outweigh the parts to rebuild a D16A6.

If anything I'd LOVE a good D16Z6, D16Y8, or SOHC VTEC ZC motor.

...but my budget is too strict for that stuff.

altoid

you'll have something around 11.3:1 comp with the pistons and theoretically you'll be pushing about 125 assuming everything is constant.

B18C5-EH2

Holy **** are you for real?

11.3:1 might not be my idea of a good old cheap "beater" motor.

Damn I already run premium in my B16A2 hatch and B18C5 hatch!



I thought it'd be more around 10.5:1 at most - is 11.3:1 for sure?

..and 125whp - are you serious? i didn't think it;d be THAT strong.

I was thinking around 100-119whp at most.

Are there any sites, links, etc. to dyno pages for such set-ups?

Anyone here know an H-T member woth such a set-up that can tell me from experience what to expect in all aspects?

Drumwurks

If you got MSN/ICQ/AOL, I'll add you up man...

I got the same set-up already built, that you're describing.

Louie B.

For a daily driver, you probably want to do either the A1 pistons OR the head gasket, I probably wouldn't recomend both. I know the D16A1 pistons bump compression 1 full point over stock, I forget the #'s for the gasket. And if you're thinking of going turbo later, don't do either!! just do a basic rebuild, and start adding bolt-ons down the road.

Si 1-5 with a ZC final? for highway cruising that would be allright, but if you're trying to make the car quicker, it's the other way around.

If it's just a broken t-belt, you could just replace it and put the A6 head and I.M. on it, those D15B1's really come to life with the A6 cam and MPFI. and my B1 has over 225k miles on it and it's still running strong.

BTW, nice clean hatch there.

B18C5-EH2

Yeah I had the tranny crapola backwards.



Hey drumworks I'm interested in your set-up. I mean I already would probably need pistons and a head gasket, and why not upgrade, right?

Rydaddy

After my mini-me is together, I am getting a ZC tranny w/LSD and swapping in the Si 5th gear and final drive. With the ZC 5th, 80mph = 4300rpm's. I would feel sorry for my poor motor!

bryant

http://www.nippon-motors.com. They have some really decent prices for stock motors.

Broken Gearbox

Find a use D16A6 in good condition and drop it in there
Put some bolt-ons, a cam, and redo the suspension

civbeater90

yeah def stay away from the zc

altoid

Sorry to burst your bubble but 125 hp at the crank

Ham'ed Hatch

i don't understand why you'd be worried about aftermarket support when you said you just want a reliable setup with the possibility of junkyard turbo later on. very little aftermarket is needed for a junkyard turbo setup, and what is needed, is most likely gonna be universal.

i'm so sick of people saying there's no aftermarket support for ZCs. bull-*******-****. it's 95% an Si motor. there isn't much you CAN'T find for it...

my suggestion (like it even matters) would be to just replace the belt, install an Si cam with the mpfi like somebody suggested above. can't get any cheaper and easier than that.

B18C5-EH2

Well you're not bursting any bubble of mine really. Again I said I was thinking like 100-110whp at the MOST.

If I wanted an all-out car trust me I'd take a D16Y8 and put a nice turbo set-up on it, but again this needs to be first of all CHEAP and more so reliable.

I really do appreciate all of the help and suggestions though - nice to see good tech here y0!

I'm pretty much decideing a few things left here, so please hear me out. Here's the plan with some options:

Take a basically FREE D16A6 motor that was moking and rebuild it. When I say rebuild I mean pistons, rings, hone and possibly bore slightly over and use STOCK pistons regardless - STOCK Honda pistons for sure!

I'd also be replacing the head gasket, so again a choice would be made there too. This means either the stock head gasket which I don't like because it's a fiber/paper one, right? I like the 1996-up head gasket because it's metal, but here's my question - how much does the CR go up with the metal gasket alone? I was wanting it for strength purposes alone, but if it bumps up CR then that's great.

At this point the only real money I'd have in it would be the Honda parts brand new and machine work as in slight bore/hone and milling of the head.

I'm kicking the idea around of what CR I want in this motor, because again it is a BEATER first and foremost, meaning it NEEDS to be cheap and reliable. I'd almost not want to NEED premium fuel in the "beater" you know?

Who's got some links to some good old SOHC spec pages. CR ratios stock, etc. would be great. It's been forever since I've looked this stuff up, and any shortcuts would be great - that's what H-T is for, right?

B18C5-EH2

Let me rephrase and add some things here:

Locally here in ATL ZCs are becoming nearly impossible to find. They are more expensive too. I have 3 or 4 D16A6 motors lying around the shop I work at.

Okay so where can I get some hot cams for the ZC?

What about cam gears?

Thanks in advance.



Well I do appreciate the input but I'm not even sure if the T-Belt broke or the bottom end finally **** out.

Again this is a 200K motor pretty much and it has been beat to hell and back - I would not trust this bottom end at all. Not because of the 1.5L itself, but THIS particular one has been beat on and was already smoking slightly.

Broken Gearbox

i gotta better idea....SELL IT to me!!!

TRE_

there are a couple different companys that make cams for the ZC, and aem tru-time(i'm sure skunk2, etc will fit too) cam gears for a b16 work on ZC's.

B18C5-EH2

Hit me with some links where I can get some cams shipped to me tomorrow and we'll talk.

I can find 3-5 different cam makers for the SOHC stuff - very easy to find and cheap too!

TRE_

are you trying to prove a point that its "hard" to find parts for a ZC or are you being serious? sorry my internet-sarcastic meter isnt working right now.

edit: btw, companys that make cams for the ZC: hks(no longer produced), gude, webcam, crower, and JG. there may be more but those are the only ones i can think of off the top of my head.


[Modified by glowing_rotors, 8:10 PM 1/26/2003]

Louie B.

http://dseries.org/
there's some excelent techs on this board that really know their stuff when it comes to the "D"

http://www.kb-silvolite.com/calc.phtml
here's a CR calculator, there's info on the folowing link that list some of the known specs to enter in the blanks:
http://www.muller.net/sonny/crx/pistons/crchart.gif

I came up with 10.7-1 with that calculator, but I'm not good at it, you may want to double check me.

edit: oops did it wrong... got a 9.3:1 with just the gasket swap, 11.35:1 with just the pistons and 11.7:1 with pistons and gasket.


[Modified by thumpu77, 10:33 PM 1/26/2003]

CHRIS 1.8

I would just throw in a B16 and a junkyard turbo.

johnzm

sorry to hear tom, oh well, alot of people in here said they had no probs when the timing belts brone on their SOHC's so maby eu can get it back together.. a d16a6 requires a little bit of work on that harness, and new knucles if im not mistaken
u need to take me for a spin when ur done, trinity said she ran 15.5 on her slightly modded d16a6 in a stripped DX hatch. have fun!

Trinity

jeesus john it isn't a DX its a STANDARD. for the love of god get this **** right lol. as far as the zc i thought about buying one and putting it on while i build my a6. tom you gonne get back to me about the ATL meet?

owen_the_soyboy

wow, true beauty of a hatch, we dont see any like that in NY state nowadays, too much roadsalt used up here.
sure would make a nice car with a freshened up motor, dont go too deep fianacially... keep your plans minimal if it is really a beater car.