Me and my friend are having an argument. Ive already heard that b20 sleevesare much weaker than ls, but he told me he saw a picture of both and the b20's were much thicker. anyone know the answer?

thanks

 

try searching...
But the b20 sleeves have a siamese bore instead of individual sleeves. I would think they would be much easier to crack, but thats my opinion. Many people are running successful high comp. bottom ends on stock B20 sleeves though.
I believe many people prefer a sleeved block if going B20 or sleeved LS to 84 if they are going to try to build a strong reliable motor. So that may tell ya somethin....

 

teh b20 sleeves are different to all other Honda sleves...

i have an excellent page on them, but will have to get the link from my work PC...

give me 12hrs...

i have posted it in otehr B20 debate threads, so please search...

t..

 

here is some objective info on the B20 sleeves:

http://dwolsten.tripod.com/articles/jan96a.html

t..

 

you always write good stuff ...

my opinion on why sleeves crack is not the inherent sleeve design but the fact that a bigger bore piston have more weight, i.e. more side-load and so high RPM is ever more stressed. You can actually see this if you compare the thrust washer's abuse on LS vs. b20 block after they were both used to 9krpm. the girdle, or absence of, is another weak leak, more detrimental on the 84mm blcok than the 81mm

greg

 

Ahhh good stuff
Maybe my thinking here is incorrect, but I would figure that the siamese bore would have problems withstaining stress from just one cylinder, because it would not only take the stress from that one but disperse it among the other three. Like Cheetah said- throw in 8.5-9k RPM and you're getting some serious sideloads and stress going on there. But then again maybe my thinking is off.


[Modified by ill phil, 4:48 PM 11/12/2002]

 

are these concerns reduced by using the lightest pistons and rods?

and you have seen/used B20's revved to 9k? what do the piston walls look like when compared to a b18? in terms of scuffing?

ever seen/put a piston through hte wall of a B20 at high revs?

has hte use of girdles assisted in reducing fatigue on high rev b20's?

lots of q's eh?! sorry, but i do know you actually race cars!!!

t..

PS i am one of the only people to run a B20vtec engine in my country...

(well i will be again by next week...)

 

yes, lighter helps and coating skirts helps even more.

yes, my b20's that I build go to 9500 with the girdle (z10/gsr conversion)

no, never seen one from b20, I have also never put a piston thru the wall at high revs, partial cause I'm not one to try for high pistons speeds/low CRR

Yes, absolutely the girdle has helped, inspected before and after many times. Night and day ...

yes, I race cars and build race and street motors ... this is the part time job, full time job is changing diapers on twin 19 month old boys during the week nights and weekends and working for a bank ...


Greg

 

So can you actually see damage to the crank or stress on the girdle? I can certainly understand why, just curious where the stress from high RPM is most evident when you can tell from the girdle. Thanks

-Brent

 

i doubt you could see stress on the girdle with out a Magnaflux (a process like x-raying),

i *think* CHEETAH is refering to the condition of the crankshaft and associated bearings...

and that there is a difference in this condition when comparing girdled and un-girdled blocks...

but i might be wrong?

t..

 

Yeah, I see what you are saying. I wasn't quite sure what he meant about being able to see the "night and day". I hadn't thought about being able to tell from bearings, but logically I see how that would apply to the condition of the crank. Thanks already haha

 

hello, the thrust washers actually counteract crank shifting. they are two half moon shaped bearings that take up play on the crankshaft. The girdle helps to fight this, i was talking about running high rpm without the girdle adn seeing the difference between another 1.54 rod ratio block with the girdle, the thrust washers or bearingstake a beating.

The main bearings dont tell too much unless you had slight oil deprivation and themains were scarred so you see the lines cut across the bearings (mostlyat journals away from the oil pump side), this hints that there was high thrust on the crank.


greg

 

Thanks guys- you learn something new everyday

 

So what about revving to only the B20 rev-limit? around 7000 rpms I believe.

I have the Z10 block girdle and I planned on new bearings/seals before I installed the engine, but now I'm being told that I should leave the engine closed for now (only 74000 kms on it) and fully build the engine when I can do so....

I'll also be using a 98 JDM Type R tranny....

 

when building a motor you prepare it based on the cam/header rpm power range.
greg

 

hmmm, so if you are sticking to a lower redline, eg 7000

there will certainly be no problems with the integrity of the block, or head, or gearbox, or most of the engine parts...

until you pull it apart and 'build' it, i suggest you dont need to install the girdle, as it is unnecessary at this Stage of your build up.

i hope that i have addresed your question?

t..

 

yup, i agree too, dont gt girdle for this stage

greg

 

Word on the street is that the B20 sleeves are the strongest out of all the B-series. not as strong as aftermarkets but a little stronger then any other B-series...

im considering getting the z10 girdle, worth getting for high RPM's, 8.5K~9K???

EDIT: if your gonna resleeve anyways, just get LS block, resleeve and bore to 84~85mm, and theres your 2.0 litter with aftermarket strenght...


[Modified by 10K2HVN, 2:21 AM 11/14/2002]

 

Yes, you have answered my questions guys. Thanks!

When I REALLY build the engine, I'll add everything then