I put a JDM H22A in my 4th Gen H23.

The car runs OK, but after warm-up acceleration pulses and right when I speed into 3rd gear the engine jerks pretty bad like its not getting enough air or fuel or something.

I have done complete tune-up, ie. NGK wires, plugs, cap & rotor, fuel filter etc... as well as set the timing.

My only suspicion now is possibly the throttle body? I used the one off of my H23 because the H22 one was damaged. Anyone know if they are the same? The only difference I can see is a sticker on both, on the H23 it says "10B0" and on the H22 it says "11A0". I didnt mic the two to see if the bore was the same, but would it cause this?

Suggestions?



The TB pictured here was damaged in shipment, throttle mechanism was bent, I have bent it back to where it looks like it was originally, but it changed the open/close placement of the butterly, when I bent it back to where it looked like it was supposed to be, the butterfly appears to be completely closed. Is the way it should be? If no one knows, I can just eyeball it against the other one.

At first I thought the jerky acceleration was caused by the using the H23 injectors, I swapped them out and I get the same response. I am also using the H23 distributor with the external coil as opposed to the H22 dizzy with the internal coil. Could this be a culpret?




[Modified by CaNaBiS, 7:09 PM 9/14/2002]

 

The Butterfly(throttle plate) is supposed to be completly closed.I just replaced my throttle body today with my old H23a1, and they both use the same Throttle plate(Same # on both) I noticed NO problems with the h23a1 TB. How long ago did you change the plugs,and did you use any kind of octane boosters in your fuel? Pull your plugs and see what color they are, if the tips of the plugs have a REDish(rusty) tint to them, they are lead fouled. I went through 2 sets of plugs in 1 month, cause they were missing real bad(mostly in vtec range)and the problem was the 104 octane booster I was putting in my tank.
So I say check your plugs, and If they are all right then I would check the o2 senser


[Modified by Cottonwoodz, 3:18 AM 9/15/2002]

 

sounds like this to me

 

did you ever fix the tranny problem?

 

Nope, never got the tranny problem fixed. My mount simply in no way will fit the tranny that came on my H22.

I did pull the plugs today to look at them, they did look real dry and rusty around the arch towards the ceramic end. I did run an Octane booster when I first ran the engine, I have only ran the engine about 700 miles so far.

I will replace them tommorow, but I just put them in there when I put the engine in, but they could have gotten ruined when I drove it a few miles with improper timing and the wrong ecu.

Is there any way to test the O2 sensor w/o having to just all-out replace it?

Also, I feel like I am getting real bad gas mileage...on my H23 I would be able to squeeze 350 miles out of a tank if I drove like a normal citizen, but usually closer to 320 miles or so....right now my tank is near empty and have gotten about 280 miles and that is mostly highway miles. What kind of gas mileage are you guys getting on H22?


[Modified by CaNaBiS, 12:06 AM 9/15/2002]

 

Well, I put new plugs in...I thought it fixed the problem...ran good for about 10 minutes then went back to the same hesitation problem on acceleration...

Can the Vtec go bad? What actually happens when the vtec kicks in? Is it all electronic? Is there any kind of shaft that engages into position upon 5,000 RPM's?

Also, I thought it might be the 02 sensor...I am using the O2 sensor from my H23; I looked at the part numbers on hondaautomotiveparts.com and on carparts.com and they both have the same part number, but I went down to my local Advance Auto and they show two different Bosch part numbers. What gives?


[Modified by CaNaBiS, 5:58 PM 9/15/2002]


[Modified by CaNaBiS, 6:38 PM 9/15/2002]

 

yea check that O2. O2s are bastards...

 

Is it still hesitating in VTEC(and only in vtec)? If so, check if the Vtec solnoid filter is cloged,or the spool valve filter.


basically,You have to take the whole spool valve off(#12 in diagrame)It is the part the Oil pressure switch is screwed into.
Their are 2 filters #12(solnoid filter) and #13 #16 (Spool valve filter).
If these are cloged it will hesitate, or fall flat on its face when in VTEC.
I have a bud of mine who ordered a JDM B16A, and when Vtec engaged it always hesitated or just cut-out, and that was the problem.
Hope this helps


[Modified by Cottonwoodz, 12:17 AM 9/16/2002]

 

This pic isnt the best in the world, but its the best still shot my video camera would get. This is the pic of the spark plug before replacement:



[Modified by CaNaBiS, 6:41 PM 9/15/2002]

 

The redish color is from the octane boosters, that will foul your plugs out.
I dont get it though, because my plugs do the same thing with boosters, but my old H23A1 I could run anykind of octane booster, any amount,and it never glazed my plugs. But with my JDM H22A it fouls the plugs out qwicker then ****. I wonder if the heat range of the plug has anything to do with it. What Heat range were them plugs, Im using NGK's Heat range of 6, I also tryed heat range 7, but no differance.

 

Cotton,

Thanks for the info on cleaning that Vtec spooler. It doesnt hesitate only in Vtec, but it does hesitate during Vtec a little bit. I may take it apart and clean it anyway. It is possible that there is some build-up in it being that it is a JDM and has probably been sitting on a warehouse pallet for a long time.

I get a really loud noice when Vtec engages. It honestly sounds like an entirely different exhaust system. It has to be a vibration, but it doesnt really sound like a heatshield or a bolt rattling, I have racked my witts end trying to figure out what it is. If I slowly accelerate through Vtec it doesnt happen, but if a accelerate hard it will make the noise all the way through vtec mode.

Also, I have noticed that when I first start the engine and get on it heavy before it is warmed up at all that Vtec doesnt kick in. Is this normal? I know its not good to drive a car hard when its cold, but it was all a part of the diagnosis process.

 

When Vtec engages(around 5000-5200 RPMS) The Engine will get louder, Sounds like a 4 barrel carb opening up, thats normal.
Vtec will only work when car is warmed up to right operating temp, usually 1 bar on the temp gauge. And will not work at all if you dont have enough oil pressure(low on oil,so check oil level) Also have to be going faster then 13 or so MPH, so it will not work, when sitting reving your engine.

I think with the engine sitting for god knows how long, the oil is going to harden and get sludgy. I did a valve adjustment last week, and when I pulled off my valve cover and their was alittle sludge of oil (harden little chunks) here and their on the cover.Also when I first did my install the EGR valve was stuck and through code 12, had to clean that out(probably froze up from sitting around.


[Modified by Cottonwoodz, 2:09 AM 9/16/2002]


[Modified by Cottonwoodz, 2:09 AM 9/16/2002]

 

Thanks! That answers a lot of questions! I didnt realize that VTEC made that much noise, it is definately pretty frigiin load, it almost sounds like cans or a Nascar circuit, it really surprises me that with stock exhaust that it is this loud. You also just explained why it wont make that noise when I rev it up in my driveway.

I read on one page that NSX's would experience this hestitation after warm-up due to corrosion build-up on the coil...tommorow after work I will put my H22 distributor in and see if that fixes the problem. Do you have a NGK part number? The local parts store only shows up the OEM plug replacement when I request plugs. BTW, they were out of stock on the NGK's so I settled for Denso's

I have a Jacobs Pro Street ignition sitting in my closet, I may hook it up to the H22 and see if it helps any.

 

i was going to say check the coil, cause i had a bad blaster 2 coil and it would hestaite. mainly below 2k but a little all the way up. i dont know anything about that internal coil crap. if i was you id see about switchintg to a usdm h22 distributor and external coil. have you checked the injectors or fuel pump. how bout the fuel filter?

 

Use a 5. That's probably your problems holmes...

 

I was getting ready to put the H22 dizzy in and noticed that the connector on the H22 has one less wire than the H23 dizzy. Anyone know if I should be concerned about this? Is it safe to just go ahead and put the H22 internal coil dizzy on my H22 with my H23 harness?

 

This is the H23 diistributor connector that I am using with my H22:


This is the connector that is on the H22 distributor:


Will the H22 dizzy work if I plug into my existing H23 harness?

 

I thought Vtec engaged around 4500, or am i thinking of B16?....anyway, if you are still having problems after trying everything listed, maybe go back and check your vacuum lines. Sometimes its the dumbest things that drive you crazy.

 

Dont think it will work. Thats why most people use their H23A1 Dizzy, cause the H23A1 wire harness you use with the H22a, Does not support a internal coil dizzy.

 

Ahhh...makes sense. Does the H23 dizzy ever give much of a problem? There was a recall on them wasnt there?

 

YO,
avatar is HOOKED UP
peace

 

Dont know on a recall, but I had to replace the housing about 3 years ago, thats a common problem with Honda distributors. The bearing in the housing goes bad.
You will know if that happends, your dizzy will make a loud screcthing noise(like mixing dirt and sand in a blender)

Most of the time if your distriburtor is messed, your car wont start, or will run for sometime and die on you. (A Bad igniter will do that)

The next thing I would do is check you Fuel Pressure, and see if your getting the right PSI of fuel when it starts jerkin and stuttering. You could possably have a weak fuel pump, or bad Fuel Pressure Regulator.

 

Cottonwoodz,

I think you might have a point there about the distributor. I think maybe in fact I do have a bad distributor. My car always starts right up with no problems just like any Honda, but yesterday when I went out to my car it would turn over fast but wouldnt start, wouldnt even try to fire up. I opened the hood, just took a plug wire off and put it back on and the car started right up (I know taking the plug wire off had nothing to do with it starting...it was coincidence). BTW, plug wires are are NGK & brand new. My H23 would do the same thing once in a blue moon, but on it I had a Jacobs Pro Street Ignition System, if it wouldnt start I would bypass the Jacobs and the car would start right up....now I wonder if it wasnt the distributor the whole time.

Does an ignitor either work or not work? Would it be causing my loss of power and hesitation after warm-up?