somehow I've found myself starting to use this on the street just for kicks. i have noticed it that is nice to be able to get back on the gas right when letting off the brakes. my question (which you can probably deduce from the title ) is:

do any of you use left foot braking on the track? do you feel it is worth picking up? i haven't been to any tracks since i've been doing it but i'm guessing it would be a good technique going into turns that you don't have to downshift for. Anyways, thoughts? opinions?
thanks

-jeff, who did a search

 

Good question, Sir Jeff. And I'd be grateful for someone to show me how it's properly! I've only tried it a few times during an autocross run and have no clue if I'm close to doing it right...

 

I was trying it a bit on the track at Willow springs this, but I was power braking at the same time to come out of turns quicker...not good for the car. I didn't do it much, but I guess it's like heel-toe sorta.

 

it seems like it would be more beneficial for rallying. Makes for a good tool to get the rear end loose.

SCC had some articles on rally schools with some good info on left foot braking in last months issue. They didnt mention much on use on tracking, but good info nonetheless

Mike D

 

I use it in road racing all the time. I try to keeps the revs up by not lifitng the throttle and adding smmooothh left foot braking. For autocross, I dunno. Try a little lift and a heavier left foot brake.

 

But left foot braking can get you in a heap of trouble really quick if you are just learning/not comfortable with it...

The one drawback (at least for me) is that I find that Im harder on the brakes. I have a tendancy to start braking while still slightly on the gas / start giving it gas while coming off the brakes. Warped a rotor or two in the process.

But I think it can make a difference on a few corners when properly executed. Oh, and in the snow...

 

I use it for turns where I don't need do downshift
or when I need help getting the rear end around

 

I've never used... the left foot, IMO, is there to help me downshift.

 

I use it in autocrossing the same as Crazy Dave. If I am not downshifting, I am left foot braking. I find I can smooth the transition from acceleration to deceleration to acceleration much more smoothly. It also helps a lot in corners that you can not do at full throttle, but do not need to slow much for. I will just keep the gas planted and gently drag the brake slightly. If done correctly, it does not upset the car like a throttle lift can incertain situations.


[Modified by Crosser, 6:12 AM 6/11/2002]

 

I use it an AutoX if I need the car to rotate more. I have changed to a better suspension setup, which once I get it dialed in, should be a ton looser then the sport springs I had before. In theory I would like to trail brake more with the new setup and not have to left foot brake mid turn.

On a road course, I don't use it much at all except in places where you REALLY don't need to brake but it is nice to get the front end to bite and give me a little more confidence. I never let off the gas, just give it a little brake with the left foot. Turn 10 at CMP is a good example. You don't have to brake there, but I am a ***** so I tap the brake a bit with the left foot.

 

No problems with the rotors for you guys?

 

There you have it folks. You don't really need it. (in terms of road racing)

 

I use it in a few specific cases. The best example is Turn 6A at Summit Point (the entry to the carousel, which is a double apex right hander).

Getting the front end to bite is essential at this turn, or you cannot make the complete carousel with one steering input. So, I tap the brake with the left foot without lifting the throttle.

The other option is to not brake, push, and use more steering input between the apexes. Or brake with the right foot, which means lifting off the throttle, which I am convinced is slower.

HOWEVER, left foot braking does take a bit of practice. Don't go out and do it in a race situation - practice during a test/tune session. Most people have a tendancy to over brake with the left foot (and usually a very abrupt over brake).

 

This can be learned on the street very easily. I just used my left foor in my driver for about a week straight. That was enough to teach the left foot how to brake gently.

 

I learned the technique at CMP at month or so ago. I used it upon entering Turn 4. For those of you that don't know this track, Turn 3 is a long left sweeping at full throttle. The track barely straightens out as you enter Turn 4, a right hander. My instructor taught me to use the left-foot to settle the suspension before Turn 4 turn-in. Worked like a charm for me. Also learned to use it at Turn 5 the end of the weekend. Helped me scrub just a bit of speed so the car wouldn't plow.

 

I use it in autox at any turn where there's no downshift. It is however more beneficial in the Talon than it was in the ITR since I don't downshift nearly as much and keeping the boost up is a good thing in a turbo car. I find the quicker transition and control of being able to go back and forth between the gas and brake helpful.

On the track I always lfb in traffic no matter what or where, at the start and usually for at least the first lap. I personally just feel better always covering the brake with the left foot while around other cars. I just noticed that in traffic even if I need to downshift I only right foot brake for those moments of the gear change and after that I switch feet. I can't remember when I first started doing this, since I just kind of noticed it lately. In qualifying sometimes I use it in some turns to keep on the gas as late as I can, although the benefits of not wasting time in between gas to brake are probably all in my head anyway!

If you want to learn lfb, don't force it at first by lfb at every turn. If you'll start using it, it is because it grows on you.


[Modified by Hracer, 6:37 PM 6/10/2002]

 

I have had very good luck with it in AUTOX, but be carefull. Like previously stated if you get "gunshy" with the front end bite, can actually reduce the confidence in the car, and you'll find yourself going slower by using this "crutch"..

I would find it very busy trying to tap dance with left foot braking, hell/toe and threshold braking with left foot. I'd save the left foot braking for autox to keep it simple when downshifting.. This way your not mistaking the brake pedal for the clutch and chucking yourself against your belts!!

Jeff

 

Jeff, you should've been at the Ted on Saturday... there was this gentlemen driving a '99-'01 Civic Si, stock accept for 15" SSR rims and Azenis. WOW, he's car looked more like a rwd car through every turn than any fwd Honda Si! His times definitely showed it too! He's advice was to use LFB when you don't have to downshift/upshift a lot in autoX... otherwise, it's a mess trying to LFB, then use clutch, then LFB, etc.

Also, as Alex said himself, he uses left foot braking a lot. I was amazed with Alex's LFB when he piloted my R on my first autoX event last summer.

Last but not least, I believe Mr. Ken Rupp uses left foot braking, no? He was generous enough to help me out at the novice school during my first 2 hot laps on Saturday... he gave me many pointers and asked me if I know how to do LFB. I told him, not really and he said, "it's something you can work on down the road."

I'm definitely practicing LFB... I think it's a very good tool for us, fwd Honda people.

 

Mark Daddio actually showed me the technique at an Evolution school about 5 years ago. Every time he "stabbed" the brakes, the belts on my Del Sol snapped and I actually cught myself 2 or 3 times going "hoooh" as the wind was compressed out of my chest!!!

At the end of the day, I pretty much had the basics down, but have been working on it religiously ever since. I've taught many people how to use it, but have had many discussions with people over why it slows you down in some instances.
With the right amount of left foot, and the right amount of right foot, you can slide wiggle the car through a slalom, rotae the car and power out of corners with relatively low understeer.

The 22mm rear bar helps also..
Jeff

Whats "The Ted"?? and where is it???

Jeff

 

I don't understand how left foot braking can be slower in any situation where you are not downshifting. The time it takes for your foot to go from gas to brake is eliminated. Instead of that nanosecond of zero input you have gas or brake. I have driven at Limerock more than anywhere else and I know that the really fast guys left foot everywhere around there except for where they have to downshift. Eric Curran is an example, 5th on Memorial day in a Z06 in WC GT that is not as nearly well developed as the full-time guys, left foot everywhere.

 

You can actually use it too much. Like when you are entering a slalom, you would normal lift slightly (crack the throttle to set the front end) with the left foot braking technique, you "might" squeeze too much and loose a tenth or 2.

Has happened, actually came in once thinking I had the smoothest run of the day, and both rotors were smoked blue. Was half a second slower..

Works great, but need to moderate the usage..

 

I am speaking of left foot braking with the feel and touch of normal right foot braking. If you are competent enough at it there should be no difference in your abilities right or left foot. If this is the case you left foot has to be faster due to the time differential between on throttle and on brake is reduced. This is the advantage of left foot.
Those people who think that it keeps the revs up are wrong, as the wheels slow down the rpms have to come down, if you are still on throttle all you are doing is increasing your stopping distances and cooking brakes.

 

I use LFB everyday of my life in my cars.

At work... the tractors have a left side breaking pedal & the right side braking pedal. Works wonderfully around tight corners.

Pete

 

heh.. for one of the events back when I first started using LFB for autox, I noticed some brake fade at the last braking zone on the course.. oops..

 

Maybe you don't need to brake there at all. The next time I touch the brake after 5 is 10. Not saying I'm faster, just something to consider.