Anyone here have any insight on getting this started? I have been racking my brain trying to come up with a way to fire my boss. I keep coming back to this idea to build a racetrack.

I am VERY serious and I know that it will take Millions and alot of work, we are ready to take on investors and I am ready for the hard work ahead.

I just want to hear about the process if you all can contribute some insight.


There is a track (Thunder Hill, owned by SCCA) about 250 or so miles north and Sears Point about 50 miles south from here. I plan to attempt to offer the excitement and technicality of Sears Point and the safety of Thunder Hill. Thunder Hill is boring (IMO) but has a TON of runnoff....and Sears Point is real fun, but I always here how people shy away from it because of all the walls.


Thanks.....any ideas? A friend with a buisness major is going in in this with me.

 

Fly me out to CA and I'm in...only 1.5yrs left of school!!

 

hmmm.....kitkatR has been asking the same questions lately...i think the first thing(and hardest) is finding the land and zoning for a race track..very hard in california...after that insurance is just a matter of money..haha..but just like golf courses..get one professionally designed.....and the easy part is getting it built..
im sure our company would love to donate a few bucks..
as long as we get a corner named after us..haha

 

Up here land is still relatively cheap, and right now money is cheap too.

The land should be the easier part. The financial backing will be the hardest.

 

I am actually going to design one for my Thesis project when I get into Grad. school next Fall.

It is just like any other project in my business (architecture). You need a design scheme, proposal for the land, track, and building support, then approach investors for cashflow.

After you have the money lined up, you need to find an appropriate location that will pass zoning and code issues, schematically develop the design of the track and all the supporting buildings, making sure they comply with all local and state codes. It will probably take you close to a year just to get through site zoning, probably much longer ........

When you finally get zoning approval, you will need to finalize the site design, track design, and building design. Then you will have to get all the plans permitted (1 month - 1 year depending on where you are).

There is a hell of a lot more involved than that, but you get the general idea .....

 

Actually, I have an MBA in finance if you need some help in that area. I also took an MBA course in entrepreneurship, so I know a bit about starting a business like this.

First and foremost is location. You have to consider accessibility, travel distances, availability of utilities, proximity of hotels, distance from other similar tracks, the strength of the sport in that particular area, weather fluctuations, elevation changes, geological stability (ask the people from Rausch Creek about that one!), presense of auto-related clubs, etc.

You also have to worry about your neighbors. For some reason, a lot of people object to having unmuffled cars racing around all day, less than a mile away from their homes. If you notice, most tracks are in the middle of nowhere - where land is very cheap, and the people are less likely to make a big deal about the noise. If you can find an economically depressed area, you could receive a lot of local support (and possibly even capital) if you can prove to them how the addition of the track to the area would benefit local hotels, restaurants, gas stations, etc.

To get investors, you are probably going to have to hire a professional to design the track. Copying an existing layout won't work unless your geography is identical.

Another possible source of capital to consider is sponsorship. Sponsorship could be in the form of the more obvious things - oil companies and car manufacturers that want the honor of advertising their product to the number of people coming to your track, or less obvious things like like a placement fee for an outside individual to run gas pumps at the track (start with Sunoco Race Fuels for that one) or food services on the premises. They would be guaranteed a LOT of business, so you could create a bidding war for who gets to operate there.

Another avenue to explore would be a strategic partnership with a racing school looking to expand their operations to a new location. Skip Barber already has many sites, but what about Bondaurant, Derek Daily, Panoz, etc? They could help you fund the track out of their own pockets, and also lend legitimacy to the plan to help you find other sources of money.

Insurance is going to be a major expense, and you are going to need a lawyer to handle all of that. You will also need a lawyer's help to incorporate. The advantage of that approach is that if you declare yourself as an S-Corp or C-Corp (depending on the number of investors you want to pursue), you can pay the lawyer and/or track designer in stock instead of cash. This will help you keep the cash for what you really need - building the track and facilities.

I can't really take a guess on the overall cost without knowing the extent of land modifications required, and whether or not utilities are already sufficient in that area. My guess is that the utilities will pose a MAJOR problem though. You are probably looking at around $3-5 million. Hey, look at that, I guess I can take a guess on it afterall.

Hopefully that will help you get started in the right direction. Let me know if you have more questions.

Matt

 

This is EXACTLY what Im looking for! Thanks very much...keep it coming!

And Im not discouraged yet!

 

3-5 mill???

Jesus, your construction cost for the buildings required ALONE will be over that!!!! Some of our big box clients build over 100,000 s.f. buildings at only $30.s.f., and they top 3 million ........ Typical building construction is closer to $100.s.f.

You will need garage facilities (about 50,000 s.f.), operations facilities (press boxes, offices, management, maintainence, etc. - another 30,000), stands and rest room facilities, etc.

Average cost of land (you will need well over 4 square miles probably) for large acreage is around $10-$20 grand per acre.

Your design costs alone (and you will need a professional design team - civil engineer, architect, structural engineer, m/p/e engineer) will probably be in the 3-5 million range.

Think more in the $30 - $35 million range for a realistic price.

Business/MBA help is one thing, but take it from someone who builds/designs things for a living, it ain't as cheap as people make it out to be.

 

as a comment on your post TypeR0207: you are correct that buildings are expensive to build, and utilities, etc. But you also have to decide how you want to start: do you really want to start out building huge, world-class facilities on a race track if you are a novice to this game? Or would you rather start smaller?
IMO, it's better to start with a good track layout for a club-racing type of environment, with minimal facilities. If it is successful, then you can build track #2 (maybe re-using parts of track #1) with stands, press-boxes, etc. IF you can attract the kind of races that will get spectators in along with camera crews. It is my slightly educated opinion that it is better to start out trying to build track like Summit Point than to shoot for a Suzuka, right out of the gate. Then again, I could be wrong.

 

Im thinking to start out simple..pre-manufactured garages and a few small offices. As time goes by, then maybe we will be able to develop into a world class facility.

Small steps. Thunder Hill is owned by SCCA and is basically a track out in the middle of nowhere, and has minimal facilities.

First make the most important part..the track!!

 

Chris, I want you to do this!!!

But could you do it within a 2 hour drive of central North Carolina please???

Seriously though, see if you can get up with the guys that did Carolina Motorsports Park. They pretty much built a track in BFE about 5 miles away from a one-stop light town (you think I'm kidding?). If you talk to them and convince them that you're serious, they might tell you how they did it.

Matt

 

I am making formal proposals now... I am also trying to contact SCCA about the T-Hill track.

I would very much appreciate contact information for the people who made Carolina Motorsports Park.

This is getting me all excited..I KNOW I can do this.

 

Here's their web page with contact info.
http://www.cmpracetrack.com/

Good luck!

 

I was basing that estimate on the estimated construction cost of $15mil I received for building a 125 room hotel on 3 achres or so. Assuming that the track is in the middle of nowhere where land is cheap, and the buildings are kept to a minimum (like CMP as suggested before), I still think that $5mil is within reason...

Matt

 

The first time I went to CMP, they had a trailer at the gate for registration, a booth at the gate for access/egress, a trailer for timing trackside, a covered concrete pad for tech and port-a-jons lining the gate every 30 feet or so. The next time I was there, they had poured a concrete pad for what was to be showers/bathrooms and another trailer at the opposite end of the paddock. The next time, a building outside the gates and the bathrooms were complete (and most of the port-a-jons were gone). Can't wait for the next visit to see what our patronage has yeilded.

 

Leave it to the architect to think of the Malaysia level track design .......

 

Phat-s,

Thats what im talking about. You cant start with Disneyland...first start out like a local fair!

Keep it coming! Thank all of you.

 

dont forget that you are going to need to fence the entire track and property
don't forget about insurance too
paving....
at least some sort of a tower
and please make a hot pit with air and electricity!
Building bathrooms will help support it too
and an oil dump
you could build an stock car track and dragstrip to further diverisfy your customer
base and attendance
as much as people hate it.. ..
NASCAR is the fastest growing sport in the US
build a short track for people to race at..
I think Altamont is the only one in Northern CA.
Build a highbank 1/2 mile oval

Convice racing vendors to house their shops at your facilities

Take a look at Buttonwillow or Willowsprings

[Modified by Crazydave, 9:59 PM 12/4/2001]


[Modified by Crazydave, 10:01 PM 12/4/2001]

 

Thanks. I am studying all the Tracks in California. I am attempting to find where they lack, and build on that, so I can convince potential investors that they will make their money back!

 

Also hit up the county offices.. and research what permits they have on file
because you will need them too

 

How about buying and re-vamping an existing facility? Maybe the SCCA would be willing to get out from under Thunder Hill. You could go in and make the necessary design changes to create a more "satisfying" driving experience. It may be a less expensive way to "get your feet wet" in the business. Then, if it works out, take the next step. Just an idea...

 

Hmmm...thats one hell of an Idea.

 

What kind of profits do racetracks make? You're looking at enormous fixed costs (for developing and building the track), and you have to find some way to convince investors and sponsors to take that load. Finding investors is going to become more than just having a track designed, you're going to have to show them that they will make money on their investment. So I would try to find some financial infomation about a comparable track, but that step is probably still aways in the future.
Just out of curiosity, what does it cost to pave a 2-2.5 mile track? Anyone know roughly? I think that cost will far eclipse any other kinds of structures you would build. Besides, what's really necessary...PIR is a well established track and they have basically a tower with offices, bathrooms, and stands. No garage spaces or any of that stuff.
I would seriously look at the costs in the first few years associated with getting a track running and then go from there.
It would be cool to see a real small-scale, grassroots based track.



[Modified by fast-R, 3:14 PM 12/4/2001]

 

an expensive idea. is to pave 1/2 square mile completely..
then you can have swap meets, autocrosses, rv sales, bake sales, auto-swaps,
etc. you can also hold concerts... etc

 

You will also want to secure HPDE couses with speedtrial open-track
and SCCA, and NASA Races
or make your track the Honda-Challange West Coast Hometrack
bring in the spec miatas