Last Sunday I ran my 92 civic hatch with gsr motor at the dc auto-x. after 2 turns my brake pedal went mushy. the brakes were almost useless throughout the whole run. this happened on every run. the only thing i did different was start running with r-compound tires (victoracers).

My car has 4 wheel disc brakes from a 95 civic si. Im not sure what kind of pads are on the fronts. Pep boys ceramic pads on rears. And I bled all 4 corners and run dot 4 valvoline synthetic fluid.

What can I do to fix this? Am I boiling the brake fluid? Will new front pads help this? Any reccommendation on pads for auto-x? Please help.

thanks

scott

 

i wll give you a bump. Ireccomend better brakes and fluid but by the way my brakes dont work at all uless they are slammed to the floor. need to find out the problem

brakes suck i will take electrical work over them any day.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by joenationwide &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Last Sunday I ran my 92 civic hatch with gsr motor at the dc auto-x. after 2 turns my brake pedal went mushy. the brakes were almost useless throughout the whole run. this happened on every run. the only thing i did different was start running with r-compound tires (victoracers).

My car has 4 wheel disc brakes from a 95 civic si. Im not sure what kind of pads are on the fronts. Pep boys ceramic pads on rears. And I bled all 4 corners and run dot 4 valvoline synthetic fluid.

What can I do to fix this? Am I boiling the brake fluid? Will new front pads help this? Any reccommendation on pads for auto-x? Please help.

thanks

scott</TD></TR></TABLE>

Unless you're autocrossing on the sun (or in my backyard in AZ) there's little chance you boiled your fluid after two turns at an autocross. Odds are better that your brakes were already functioning poorly and you just didn't notice until you really put them to the test. If you don't know what kind of pads you're running in the front, that tells me they haven't been inspected very well. Take a look at them to make sure they are in good shape. Once you're sure all of your pads and rotors are in good shape, rebleed until you get a firm pedal or another problem shows itself.

 

look into some axxis ultimates, or cobalt gt-sport pads

 

Actually, since I bought the car in April the brakes have sucked. I drove it hard the first day and the pedal went soft very quickly.

That week I found one of my rear calipers was frozen (stuck), so I replaced it. After that I bled the entire system with valvoline synthetic fluid until all i saw was clean fluid coming out w/no bubbles. Problem still exists.

I have a 92 gsr hatch with 95 si 4 wheel disc brakes. What is the cause of the pedal getting soft so quick? Anyone have this problem before? Need more info please and thank you.

 

If you're not leaking any brake fluid, could it be bad brake master cylinder? I don't know much about brake systems, but it sounds like something is not holding pressure

 

Rebleed while tapping caliper.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by djsolution &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you're not leaking any brake fluid, could it be bad brake master cylinder? I don't know much about brake systems, but it sounds like something is not holding pressure </TD></TR></TABLE>

it couldnt hurt to replace the MC... same thing happened to me. felt the brakes get mushy, inspected pads and rotors, bled the system and nothing worked. then i replaced the MC and the brakes felt great.

 

yep the pads are all fine, and not leaking any fluid.

i guess i will change the master cylinder. thanks a lot for the help.

scott

 

i think your front brakes are too small for the extra weight up front

 

The brakes off the 5th Gen Civic Si are the usually the exact same ones as the 3rd Gen Integra.

added in edit: please see my next post down. the above info assumes the abs option.

The rotors front & rear are the same. The rear calipers are the same. The front calipers are the variable. They use either the D617 (size) pad or the D273. If it uses the D617, it is the same front caliper. The difference is that the D617 pad is larger ie more surface area.

Did you swap over all the brake parts to include the m/c & proportioning valve? I hope so. If not, they won't work as well. If we assume that you did, I would check all the calipers for proper function. You already said they don' leak. Do they slide easily on the pins? If not, get some new pins.

Before you just get a m/c, you might want to do some test. With the engine running, does the pedal move under constant pressure? How about with the engine off? Any signs of leakage on the m/c in the engine compartment or under the dash? Are you sure the system has a good bleed?


Modified by civicrr at 7:13 PM 8/15/2004

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civicrr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The brakes off the 5th Gen Civic Si are the usually the exact same ones as the 3rd Gen Integra.

The rotors front & rear are the same. The rear calipers are the same. The front calipers are the variable. They use either the D617 (size) pad or the D273. If it uses the D617, it is the same front caliper. The difference is that the D617 pad is larger ie more surface area.

Did you swap over all the brake parts to include the m/c & proportioning valve? I hope so. If not, they won't work as well. If we assume that you did, I would check all the calipers for proper function. You already said they don' leak. Do they slide easily on the pins? If not, get some new pins.

Before you just get a m/c, you might want to do some test. With the engine running, does the pedal move under constant pressure? How about with the engine off? Any signs of leakage on the m/c in the engine compartment or under the dash? Are you sure the system has a good bleed? </TD></TR></TABLE>


i thought the Si's front brakes were 9.5"?

 

Nope. Civic EX/Si (with rear disc & ABS) & Integra share the same front & rear rotors.

added in edit: actually, you are right too. it is possible to have the 9.5" front rotors if you didn't get the abs.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civicrr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Nope. Civic EX/Si (with rear disc & ABS) & Integra share the same front & rear rotors.

added in edit: actually, you are right too. it is possible to have the 9.5" front rotors if you didn't get the abs.</TD></TR></TABLE>


he said 95 civic SI, not 99 civic Si

 

Yep. That is what I am talking about. The 5th Gen Civic was produced from model years 1992-1995. The model designations I posted are correct: EX & Si.

Once again, the 5th Gen Civic EX & Si (with rear disc & abs) used the same size front rotor & pad fitment (D617) as the 3rd Gen Integra (except ITR). This rotor is commonly refered to as being 10.2" in diameter. The rear caliper & rotors are also indentical.

As a side note, the 6th Gen Civic Si also used the same size front rotor. The caliper & pad fitment are different. The pad fitment is the D465.

Here, look up the fitments on this website. http://www.pdqmotorsports.net
While you are there, order up some pads. I will be happy to sell them to you.

 

If your overheating, or boiling brake fluid during an autocross, you need to learn how to use your brakes better.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by civicrr &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yep. That is what I am talking about. The 5th Gen Civic was produced from model years 1992-1995. The model designations I posted are correct: EX & Si.

Once again, the 5th Gen Civic EX & Si (with rear disc & abs) used the same size front rotor & pad fitment (D617) as the 3rd Gen Integra (except ITR). This rotor is commonly refered to as being 10.2" in diameter. The rear caliper & rotors are also indentical.

As a side note, the 6th Gen Civic Si also used the same size front rotor. The caliper & pad fitment are different. The pad fitment is the D465.

Here, look up the fitments on this website. http://www.pdqmotorsports.net
While you are there, order up some pads. I will be happy to sell them to you.</TD></TR></TABLE>


hehe just checkin

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by NightCrawlerGsR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If your overheating, or boiling brake fluid during an autocross, you need to learn how to use your brakes better.</TD></TR></TABLE>

i was going to mention something about that. I was at that auto-x and i didn't brake very hard in most of those corners, quick course with good transitions. I doubt it was the boiling of brake fluid, you might want to change it anyway if you purchased the car in April and haven't changed it to date ( assuming total neglegence of previous owner )

not sure what kind of pads you have, but i was runnin axxis ultimates, great pads

 

How closely have you checked out the front calipers?

This sounds about how mine acted when I found one of the sliding pins up front had seized.

 

It looks like my master cylinder is the stock civic vx part. i guess this could be causing some problems with the Si rear discs. not sure about the proportioning valve. so it sounds like i should get the m/c and proportioning valve from a 95 si?

Im not sure if mine has ABS. i doubt it does, because i can lock the brakes up and i dont get that intermittant ABS brake pulsing. how can i tell if it has ABS, is there some controller mounted somewhere? Does it matter which M/C and proportioning valve i get from an Si?

 

I am honestly not sure if there is a different m/c & pro. valve for the two different cars. I don't think so.

Here is what I would do. Find out if there is different part numbers (@ a Honda parts counter) for the 95 Si w/ABS & w/o ABS.

If that doesn't work, find out if you have the D617 front pad or the D273. D617 = ABS & D273 = no ABS.

BTW, going to the correct m/c & pro valve will make a world of difference. The rod will move the correct amount of fluid & the valve will send it correctly. The difference @ the limit is huge.