what is the best intake manifold+Throttle body combo for GSR head...
And list the price also friend.... *very limited budget *

 

well that really depends if your running a gsr ecu if you are you need the butterflyvalve style intake but if you can get around that and your on a budget i like the ITR intake and trottlebody or if you want after market i like the eldabroke performer x

 

skunk2 intake manifold and erick's racing tb

 

performer x is too big for most peoples na cars, turbo it does well, skunk2 is an ok choice, although some dynos dont show much improvement over the stock manifold, if you really want something that performs, get your gsr im professionally "worked on" by some one that knows what they are doing (RLZ does it, i know some other people do it, alaniz maybe, just check around) its not going to be cheap but it will kick the other im's butts

EDIT: just saw you are on a limited budget...go with skunk2 if you want, id just as soon keep the stock one, or port it yourself like i did

 

the performer x has shorter runners for better upper rpm hp...so what do you want? torque or horsepower? if you want hp you stay in the 3-5" runner length, and if you want torque its around 11-13"

sell the gsr head and buy a real head, a pr3 head.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Carlo Gambino &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">what is the best intake manifold+Throttle body combo for GSR head...
And list the price also friend.... *very limited budget *</TD></TR></TABLE>

i would check out an-r.com and dynamics autosports or wicked industries same if not better then skunk2 and cheaper that is wut i am goin with

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RABHonda &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the performer x has shorter runners for better upper rpm hp...so what do you want? torque or horsepower? if you want hp you stay in the 3-5" runner length, and if you want torque its around 11-13"

sell the gsr head and buy a real head, a pr3 head.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

how is the GSR head not a real head? erick runs a GSR head in his car...

 

who cares what ericks is runnin. youre not gonna put all the work into the head that they did. they filled that head back in with aluminum then slapped it onto a cnc machine and had it milled back down for the best runners possible. hell, he might be runnin laser injectors. well they did all of this if they know what theyre doing.

 

RAB, would you care to explain why the b16 head is superior to the GSR head?

can anyone?

 

"because honda uses the b16 head casting on the type r, y0!"

who gives a ****.

People have been making power with both heads. Dont make me break out the flowchart that shows the p72 head flowing slightly better down down and within 5% of a pr3 head up top.

oh and another thing, if the pr3 heads are so great, then how come everyone sesriously running them is getting their combustion chambers squared out like a gsr?

 

exactly, in stock form, they are practically the same..

different story when they are ported though..

but a lot of people say flow charts mean jack. i wanna hear what RAB has to say about it...

 

why is it a different story when theyre ported? All things being equal, wouldnt an equal port on both heads yeild very very similar results?

i chose a p72 head for my ls/vtec setup for a few reasons:

1. slight bump in compression

2. better combustion chambers

3. more flow down low (i do NOT rev to 9k all the time.)

4. cost was not an issue, pr3 heads are more available and cheaper.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DefiantGSR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">exactly, in stock form, they are practically the same..

different story when they are ported though..

but a lot of people say flow charts mean jack. i wanna hear what RAB has to say about it...</TD></TR></TABLE>

word.

 

I just got my AN-R piece from FedEx. I'll let you know how it goes when I put it on. It costs significantly less than the Skunk2 IM and I've been told it works better. Check it out at http://www.an-r.com.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LsVtec92Hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

oh and another thing, if the pr3 heads are so great, then how come everyone sesriously running them is getting their combustion chambers squared out like a gsr?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Good point I was all about the B16 heads but now I prefer the GSR head

 

the gsr head is ****, simple and plain. the ports are entirely different, and the bolt pattern for the IM is oddball. every IM for the gsr head is comparitively more expensive. the gsr might flow slightly better down low, but what are vtec cams grinded for? high rpm hp, and everyone knows the pr3 flows better on the top end, giving you better breathing. the head flows more on the top because the b16 breathes better at high rpm than the gsr does due to slower piston speed.

but this becomes moot when porting comes into the picture. none of you really know what a true port job is. youre ignorant when it comes to real engine building. when a head is ported they add aluminum to the head; the ports, chamber, valve seats. they do this so they can create the exact port they want, or chamber with quench to match their intake charge/piston face.

whoever says flow charts dont mean jack dont know **** themselves. entire engines are built around flow charts of the engine itself, including the cylinder/piston, as well as the head/ports. a flow chart will tell you exactly where your engine will be its most efficient, this is the basis for the cam grind. if you have an engine that flows its best between 6100-9350 rpms, that is where you base your lift/duration along with compression, tranny gearing, shift points. if it shows your engine will make its majority hp at high rpms, you will fab an intake manifold with shorter runners to take advantage of the engines breathing.
*f1 actually created a way to take advantage of long intake runners for low end torque without having to sacrifice high rpm hp, which they are primarily made for, thats why they run pneumatic valves, long rods with r/s ratios in the high 1.7:1-low 1.8:1 to slow down the piston speed for better breating, and 7 short gears. F1 engines have variable length intake runners that adjust from 11" down to 3".
if the head flows very well at higher rpms, ie:9-12k rpm, an engine builder will increase the r/s ratio to slow piston speeds so the cylinder can take advantage of the heads ability to breathe well at high rpms. even though it narrows the torque band slightly. since the piston speed gets slowed down, they can run more lift/duration to get more air into the cylnder.

lsvtech...take notes cause even when ive been drinkin i still know more than you.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DEVIOUS_EF* &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">skunk2 intake manifold and erick's racing tb </TD></TR></TABLE>

sounds good to me......

 

im pretty sure you calling everyone ignorant shows how ignorant you are yourself.

please stop comparing 10 cylinder 3.0l f1 motors to our 4 cylinder 1.6-1.8l honda motors.

Im glad you realize the importance of flow charts. Heres one for you.



<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RABHonda &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
lsvtech...take notes cause even when ive been drinkin i still know more than you.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Please learn how to spell VTEC. Theres no H at the end.

How are those for notes?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by LsVtec92Hatch &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">im pretty sure you calling everyone ignorant shows how ignorant you are yourself.

please stop comparing 10 cylinder 3.0l f1 motors to our 4 cylinder 1.6-1.8l honda motors.

Please learn how to spell VTEC. Theres no H at the end.

How are those for notes? </TD></TR></TABLE>


Comparing...? Not much to compare...

10 cyl or 2 cyl, they all work the same.

Its obvious you don't know much, do you have any comment to him talking about slowing down piston speeds?

Everyone is posting up their "Fully built" motors... when 80% of them are stilll running "shelf products". I don't consider that "fully built".

A long rod setup for a b-series would be great, with slower piston speed you can also run higher compression(13+:1) and still run on pump gas. Highe compression can also feed the large lift/ High duration cams.

Sit down, relax, and read. Don't need to get offensive.

Maybe he wrote VTECH on purpose to clown on your name?

You post up a chart against what he wrote... and you're trying to talk down on him.. LOL!!...

Tell us.. in your eyes.. what do you see from that chart?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by RABHonda &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">the gsr head is ****, simple and plain. the ports are entirely different, and the bolt pattern for the IM is oddball. every IM for the gsr head is comparitively more expensive. the gsr might flow slightly better down low, but what are vtec cams grinded for? high rpm hp, and everyone knows the pr3 flows better on the top end, giving you better breathing. the head flows more on the top because the b16 breathes better at high rpm than the gsr does due to slower piston speed.

but this becomes moot when porting comes into the picture. none of you really know what a true port job is. youre ignorant when it comes to real engine building. when a head is ported they add aluminum to the head; the ports, chamber, valve seats. they do this so they can create the exact port they want, or chamber with quench to match their intake charge/piston face.

whoever says flow charts dont mean jack dont know **** themselves. entire engines are built around flow charts of the engine itself, including the cylinder/piston, as well as the head/ports. a flow chart will tell you exactly where your engine will be its most efficient, this is the basis for the cam grind. if you have an engine that flows its best between 6100-9350 rpms, that is where you base your lift/duration along with compression, tranny gearing, shift points. if it shows your engine will make its majority hp at high rpms, you will fab an intake manifold with shorter runners to take advantage of the engines breathing.
*f1 actually created a way to take advantage of long intake runners for low end torque without having to sacrifice high rpm hp, which they are primarily made for, thats why they run pneumatic valves, long rods with r/s ratios in the high 1.7:1-low 1.8:1 to slow down the piston speed for better breating, and 7 short gears. F1 engines have variable length intake runners that adjust from 11" down to 3".
if the head flows very well at higher rpms, ie:9-12k rpm, an engine builder will increase the r/s ratio to slow piston speeds so the cylinder can take advantage of the heads ability to breathe well at high rpms. even though it narrows the torque band slightly. since the piston speed gets slowed down, they can run more lift/duration to get more air into the cylnder.

lsvtech...take notes cause even when ive been drinkin i still know more than you.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

http://www.importreview.com/re....html

 

And if by working the same you mean they both mix air and fuel and ignite the combination with a spark to produce power then yes. but thats where the similarities end.

Why would i have to comment on him mentioning high end cylinder head flowing and its relationship to piston speeds? These facts are nothing new. Did you know a stock chevy 350 has a r/s ratio of about 1.62 : 1? Not exactly a 'top end motor' though is it. Rod to stroke ratio dictates more than just where the motor makes its power.

You tell me im getting offensive but make no reference to him posting that 'none of you know what a true port job is' . ignorance is bliss i guess.

Maybe he wrote VTECH to "clown" on my name or maybe he was just drunk. That would explain his other ramblings as well.

The chart wasnt against what he wrote, genuis. He said himself "entire engines are built around flow charts of the engine itself, including the cylinder/piston, as well as the head/ports" so i was posting up a chart showing his precious pr3 head being against a "****" p72 head.

Ill say it again, the higher compression and better flow numbers down low are a good reason for people to choose a p72 head for their ls/vtec setup. That way they dont have to spin the b18a/b 1.54:1 bottom ends to 9000rpm just to get that pr3 advantage.

Oh and to me that chart says the p72 head outflows the pr3 downlow, loses a tad in the mid range and outflows again up high. What does the chart say to you?

 

Good link, EVOL. Hopefully this can help the mis-informed.

 

Sorry for the useless comment, but get this RABHonda guy the **** outta here It's cool to have knowledge, it's not cool to command superiority because of it.

 

rabi just cause you got a good deal on a pr3 head and couldnt afford a p72 head doesnt give you the right to say its ****,most people put down the p72 head just cause they went with a pr3 head and think is the best while they never even tried or want to understand why the gsr head is better.

 

i prefer the PR3 casting over the P72 casting based PURELY on the choices for IM right now. There is NO good manifold for the GSR, as of right now, for N/A...

the pr3 has the ITR manifold going for it...and that's enough to go with the pr3 head if the choice is avaible.

if you have a GSR head, stick with it. No need to change somethign that works as good as it does....but if you have the choice, go pr3/itr.

and the best manifold for the GSR right now, is either a FULLY ported skunk2 (to fix their big **** up of the wrong runner design) or the stock mani that's been ported as well.