Modifications worth the trouble?
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From: las vegas, nv, clark
is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock?
I want to add performance to my R as many of you have. I/H/E and then cams but every day I come here to learn and look it seems that reliability is an issue. I know that we are seeing the problems and many of you have no trouble at all but in your opinions was it worth it to add the performance upgrades to your cars?
I have built many V8s back in the day but all this computer stuff is a bit intimidating. Is it as hard as it seems to build a N/A R engine with that great Honda reliability.
Thanks for all your opinions. I read and appreciate them all!
P.S. My goal would be to have 200 whp N/A and drive it daily thanks again.
I have built many V8s back in the day but all this computer stuff is a bit intimidating. Is it as hard as it seems to build a N/A R engine with that great Honda reliability.
Thanks for all your opinions. I read and appreciate them all!
P.S. My goal would be to have 200 whp N/A and drive it daily thanks again.
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From: USA
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (PY 01-0972)
The reliablity is all in the care and effort in to the installation of the parts you are adding to your car. Oh yeah... and the other half of reliablity is in the tuning 
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From: kuidaore
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (Bbasso)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Bbasso »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The reliablity is all in the care and effort in to the installation of the parts you are adding to your car. Oh yeah... and the other half of reliablity is in the tuning </TD></TR></TABLE>
Just ask BlueR (Marc) who had his stuff installed and tuned correctly and Still had catastrophic failure.
Reliability comes into play all the time with modding and especially with the motor.
The safest bet is to stay as close to stock as possible.
The next bet is to research and use the best components and install correctly/professionally or have them installed by an experienced professional.
Flying by the seat of your pants with motor work is a recipe for disaster.
As I said, Marc had it all done right and Still had some major issues. Not that it might have been the same reuslt if he was stock but the odds are raised when modding comes into play.
Maybe Marc would care to contribute here?
</TD></TR></TABLE>Just ask BlueR (Marc) who had his stuff installed and tuned correctly and Still had catastrophic failure.
Reliability comes into play all the time with modding and especially with the motor.
The safest bet is to stay as close to stock as possible.
The next bet is to research and use the best components and install correctly/professionally or have them installed by an experienced professional.
Flying by the seat of your pants with motor work is a recipe for disaster.
As I said, Marc had it all done right and Still had some major issues. Not that it might have been the same reuslt if he was stock but the odds are raised when modding comes into play.
Maybe Marc would care to contribute here?
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From: kuidaore
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (davidnyc)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by davidnyc »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Anton,
Actually, you are not exactly correct, but I will let Marc give info.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Okie, I actually did IM him to get back here to this post. Not only to provide some helpful information but also since I knew there was a major failure but didn't exactly hear the results.
Actually, you are not exactly correct, but I will let Marc give info.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Okie, I actually did IM him to get back here to this post. Not only to provide some helpful information but also since I knew there was a major failure but didn't exactly hear the results.
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: BC, Canada
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (1GreyTeg)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 1GreyTeg »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Just ask BlueR (Marc) who had his stuff installed and tuned correctly and Still had catastrophic failure.
Reliability comes into play all the time with modding and especially with the motor.
The safest bet is to stay as close to stock as possible.
The next bet is to research and use the best components and install correctly/professionally or have them installed by an experienced professional.
Flying by the seat of your pants with motor work is a recipe for disaster.
As I said, Marc had it all done right and Still had some major issues. Not that it might have been the same reuslt if he was stock but the odds are raised when modding comes into play.
Maybe Marc would care to contribute here?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?
Just ask BlueR (Marc) who had his stuff installed and tuned correctly and Still had catastrophic failure.
Reliability comes into play all the time with modding and especially with the motor.
The safest bet is to stay as close to stock as possible.
The next bet is to research and use the best components and install correctly/professionally or have them installed by an experienced professional.
Flying by the seat of your pants with motor work is a recipe for disaster.
As I said, Marc had it all done right and Still had some major issues. Not that it might have been the same reuslt if he was stock but the odds are raised when modding comes into play.
Maybe Marc would care to contribute here?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?
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From: Austin, TX
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (bcrl)
i have had jun 3's for about 25k or more miles with not one single thing going wrong. Of course I had a good tuner witch I am sure help a lot.
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From: Austin, TX
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (kitkatR)
haha speaking of that here is a clip of my R driving to the first expo, damn I forgot how the stock rims looked
http://www.corner3.com/kitkatr.mpg
that is from like a 70 mph roll I think
http://www.corner3.com/kitkatr.mpg
that is from like a 70 mph roll I think
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From: Fairbanks
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (PY 01-0972)
leave it stock... if it's your only car.
if you have another car to drive, mod it, if you want.
-IMHO, the most "reliable" and "potent" I/H/C/E setup is:
1. Mugen Intake (~$650)
2. Toda 4-2-1 header (~$900)
3. JDM ITR catalytic converter + custom secondary O2 sensor hole (~$200)
4. Stock exhaust or Fujitsubo RM-01 (~$600)
Definitely not cheap and you won't get that much gain with or w/o tuning. You got to decide if the price can be justified by the gain you make. For me, it's a "NO". Stock is fine... rather put the money towards my Elise downpayment fund.
if you have another car to drive, mod it, if you want.
-IMHO, the most "reliable" and "potent" I/H/C/E setup is:
1. Mugen Intake (~$650)
2. Toda 4-2-1 header (~$900)
3. JDM ITR catalytic converter + custom secondary O2 sensor hole (~$200)
4. Stock exhaust or Fujitsubo RM-01 (~$600)
Definitely not cheap and you won't get that much gain with or w/o tuning. You got to decide if the price can be justified by the gain you make. For me, it's a "NO". Stock is fine... rather put the money towards my Elise downpayment fund.
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From: Austin, TX
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (Cosworth)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Cosworth »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Definitely not cheap and you won't get that much gain with or w/o tuning. You got to decide if the price can be justified by the gain you make. For me, it's a "NO". Stock is fine... rather put the money towards my Elise downpayment fund.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I little OT here but what trim Elise where you planing on getting? A guy I know works for and exotic car company and said highest trim was $44k and they had about 150 people waiting but they where only getting one. Also he said the top trim level weighed only 1300 lbs
</TD></TR></TABLE>
I little OT here but what trim Elise where you planing on getting? A guy I know works for and exotic car company and said highest trim was $44k and they had about 150 people waiting but they where only getting one. Also he said the top trim level weighed only 1300 lbs
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From: Ohhhhhh yeaaaa, NY, USA
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (bcrl)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bcrl »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've never heard of i/h/e affecting reliablilty. An intake it making the engine cooler... if anything it might help it. I could be wrong though.
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I've never heard of i/h/e affecting reliablilty. An intake it making the engine cooler... if anything it might help it. I could be wrong though.
Joined: Jan 2003
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From: BC, Canada
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (Integra4lyfe)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Integra4lyfe »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Quote, originally posted by bcrl »
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?
I've never heard of i/h/e affecting reliablilty. An intake it making the engine cooler... if anything it might help it. I could be wrong though.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Anyone can confirm?
Quote, originally posted by bcrl »
Even you only have bolt on like I/H/E, it will affect the reliability as well?
I've never heard of i/h/e affecting reliablilty. An intake it making the engine cooler... if anything it might help it. I could be wrong though.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Anyone can confirm?
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From: Fairbanks
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (bcrl)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bcrl »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Anyone can confirm?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Of course, it is going to change the reliability. Is it going to be a huge change? Probably not. But, there is a reason why cars come with conservative factory I/H/E... to be as reliable as possible without introducing any side effects. So, think it out before you haphazardly change out parts.
Anyone can confirm?
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Of course, it is going to change the reliability. Is it going to be a huge change? Probably not. But, there is a reason why cars come with conservative factory I/H/E... to be as reliable as possible without introducing any side effects. So, think it out before you haphazardly change out parts.
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From: PA
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (Cosworth)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Cosworth »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Of course, it is going to change the reliability. Is it going to be a huge change? Probably not. But, there is a reason why cars come with conservative factory I/H/E... to be as reliable as possible without introducing any side effects. So, think it out before you haphazardly change out parts. </TD></TR></TABLE>
How would I/h/e affect reliability? I/H/C/E simply improve the breathing characteristics of your engine....which is a good thing.
The reason "cars come with conservative factory i/h/e" is mostly because the average consumer does not want a loud, obnoxious car.
Of course, it is going to change the reliability. Is it going to be a huge change? Probably not. But, there is a reason why cars come with conservative factory I/H/E... to be as reliable as possible without introducing any side effects. So, think it out before you haphazardly change out parts. </TD></TR></TABLE>
How would I/h/e affect reliability? I/H/C/E simply improve the breathing characteristics of your engine....which is a good thing.
The reason "cars come with conservative factory i/h/e" is mostly because the average consumer does not want a loud, obnoxious car.
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (Justin Klemgold)
By changing the air/fuel ratio that was factory designed for the car, it affects the car's reliability in the long term.
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From: kuidaore
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (B2FiNiTY)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B2FiNiTY »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">By changing the air/fuel ratio that was factory designed for the car, it affects the car's reliability in the long term. </TD></TR></TABLE>
As well as emissions and ULV or ULEV standards qualification and gas mileage.
As well as emissions and ULV or ULEV standards qualification and gas mileage.
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From: BC, Canada
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (B2FiNiTY)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B2FiNiTY »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">By changing the air/fuel ratio that was factory designed for the car, it affects the car's reliability in the long term. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Normally ITR with bolt on I/H/E, is there a need to change to aftermarket ECU like Mugen N1 or JDM ITR ECU or Hondata instead of using the USDM stock ECU?
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (bcrl)
Depends what you want to do. There are many options from piggy backs such as Apex VAFC, Greddy E-manage, or full systems such as hondata, aem ems, etc.
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From: Edmonton, AB, Canada
Re: is it just me or is there alot of problems when you take your car from stock? (B2FiNiTY)
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by B2FiNiTY »</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'd put my money on gas mileage being better assuming the driver drives the same. </TD></TR></TABLE>
I would agree with that since a good I/H/E will improve volumetric efficiency. I would also agrre with the statement that the I/H/E will alter a/f ratios, thereby affecting long-term reliability. Myself, i am only planning I/H/E and Hondata to tune the a/f ratio and timing etc. which should allow optimum reliability, if installed and tuned correctly. I would think the standard bolt-ons (I/H/E) should be pretty safe. As for going with internal mods ie) cams, pistons etc. that's where you can really lose reliability, especially if not installed and tuned by an expert. Also changing cams and then the valvetrain parts to allow for higher revving will wear down the motor that much faster. No matter what you do, the higher the engine revs above stock redline, the faster it will wear.
I would agree with that since a good I/H/E will improve volumetric efficiency. I would also agrre with the statement that the I/H/E will alter a/f ratios, thereby affecting long-term reliability. Myself, i am only planning I/H/E and Hondata to tune the a/f ratio and timing etc. which should allow optimum reliability, if installed and tuned correctly. I would think the standard bolt-ons (I/H/E) should be pretty safe. As for going with internal mods ie) cams, pistons etc. that's where you can really lose reliability, especially if not installed and tuned by an expert. Also changing cams and then the valvetrain parts to allow for higher revving will wear down the motor that much faster. No matter what you do, the higher the engine revs above stock redline, the faster it will wear.