there's a few h22's with around 180-190 ft lbs of torque
but most of them are pushing around 250 hp.

with the h23 it's a different scenario.
the hp to torque ratio seems to be quite
a bit closer.

we all know there is not much out there for the
h23 as far as all motor applies, but it seems there is
starting to be more stuff availible like crower cams,
custom headers supposedly, etc.

with more custom stuff like maybe itb's, good tuning
and higher compression pistons i think it's possibile
that an h23 could hit that mark in the near future.

this has been going through my mind for a while.
put it this way, there are plenty of h22's out there
pushing 220+ hp. If you could get an h23 to that
amount of hp n/a, then it would be much closer to
putting out as much torque, vs an h22 with the same hp.

so what do you guys think????

 

Hell yeah, it's an ambitious plan and money makes anything possible....

-Cams+CG's+tuning
-Head work+IM+TB work OR ITB's
-Custom header+exhaust
-UR pulley, no PS or A/C
-Full ignition and fuel setups+tuning
-Built and lightened bottom end+all the extras
-High comp pistons...maybe even bored out....
-Standalone EMS
-IM heatshield gasket...
-Shitload of tuning

^^a few things I could think of...

 

it would be tough but i think it could be done.
+bore block to 89mm. be like ~2.5
+raise comp. to 11.5
+head work
+light flywheel
+better clutch
+no balancer shaft belt
+crower stage 2 camshafts, springs and retainers.
+hondata.
+custom header and 2.5 ex. piping
more that i cant think of

im not sure about ITB, dont they work best for high reving motors?
but whos knows till it has been tried.

 

what's the compression for a stock h23?

 

9.8:1

 

We know that there's no chance of hitting that
with stock compression.
but if we bump it up to 11-11.5:1
bigger cams, some headwork, port matching the im,
sleeving, crower rods etc. i see no reason it can't be accomplished.

i'm just suprised that no one has tried this yet

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there's a few h22's with around 180-190 ft lbs of torque
but most of them are pushing around 250 hp.

with the h23 it's a different scenario.
the hp to torque ratio seems to be quite
a bit closer.

we all know there is not much out there for the
h23 as far as all motor applies, but it seems there is
starting to be more stuff availible like crower cams,
custom headers supposedly, etc.

with more custom stuff like maybe itb's, good tuning
and higher compression pistons i think it's possibile
that an h23 could hit that mark in the near future.

this has been going through my mind for a while.
put it this way, there are plenty of h22's out there
pushing 220+ hp. If you could get an h23 to that
amount of hp n/a, then it would be much closer to
putting out as much torque, vs an h22 with the same hp.

so what do you guys think????</TD></TR></TABLE>

i think its definatly possible, the hard part will be finding parts that will work with the h23 .

here is a really stupid idea, but whats the possibility of h23 cams fitting in a h22 head, obviously disable vtec .. hmm? then you could use all parts that bolt to an h22 head, unless you want to stick with an h23 head..

but the setups posted above would probably get you close, i get with the right cams and high compresion you could do it. but now that i think of it, i don't know of many/any people on this board with all motor h23 setups

 

i remember a guy selling a NA auto lude that made 200+whp. i dont recall what kind of tq he made though. but my lude stock or w/ nitrous makes more tq then hp. the key, i think, is boring the block.

 

outside of a lot of custom intake/exhaust tubing length tuning I think that it will have to be HIGH compression/displacement and specific cam work. Also where do you want the torque? Low end or top? probably kinda low/mid since there is not that much H series gearing support.

the Pirate

 

with enough compression and enough flow chester, anything will work.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PirateMcFred &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">outside of a lot of custom intake/exhaust tubing length tuning I think that it will have to be HIGH compression/displacement and specific cam work. Also where do you want the torque? Low end or top? probably kinda low/mid since there is not that much H series gearing support.

the Pirate</TD></TR></TABLE>

low end and midrange
i love having instant torque when i hit the throttle
(well it's no v8 )
plus we all know the h23 handles at HIGH rpms

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by see_our_vtec &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">with enough compression and enough flow chester, anything will work.</TD></TR></TABLE>

thanks for the input, Gus

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
low end and midrange
</TD></TR></TABLE>

well then you probably want a high lift low overlap cam to aid the low rpm intake charge and match that with a fairly long straight narrow runner as well as a header that has longer primaries to keep up gas velocity. That, of course will screw any chance for the top end. BUT you said

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
plus we all know the h23 handles at HIGH rpms
</TD></TR></TABLE>

the way the torque drops off (not to say that it isn't drastic) has a hell of a lot to do with the stock cams. It is not entirely that the head can't flow.

this would be a fun project, too bad i have not even finished my current one.

the Pirate

 

If i every get my hondata tuned i'm gonna give it my best.... check the sig for setup

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there's a few h22's with around 180-190 ft lbs of torque
but most of them are pushing around 250 hp.

with the h23 it's a different scenario.
the hp to torque ratio seems to be quite</TD></TR></TABLE>

The problem you're looking at is the high end. If you could increase the flow in the higher end you'll get your HP #'s up (since HP is just the relation of torque to RPM). Different cams and a better air flow should fix that up, though you still have to watch out for reving the H23 up too high

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93ludeSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">93 prelude Si .... GE 88mm sleeves, wisco ultralights, CL 77's, clay smith cams, JG gears, P+P head, portmatched intake mani (secondaries removed), portmatched JG throttle body, AEM fuel rail, B&M FPR, AEM cold air, DC CC 4-2-1, test pipe, thermal R&D, Quaife LSD, ACT clutch, fidanza flywheel, 17" rota sub's w/ yoko 100's ..... who needs vtec when you have low end</TD></TR></TABLE>

^^^ nice setup... do you know how much whp & wtq the engine is producing right now?

 

are we talking at the wheels?


Pfft it's not possible unless you're running a 16:1 race motor

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by satan_srv &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">are we talking at the wheels?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

yep, yep have faith bro

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93ludeSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If i every get my hondata tuned i'm gonna give it my best.... check the sig for setup</TD></TR></TABLE>

what compression pistons are you running?
best of luck to ya

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

yep, yep have faith bro

what compression pistons are you running?
best of luck to ya

</TD></TR></TABLE>


compression is upwards of 12:1, wasn't supposed to be that high, but well, the wrong pistons got put in the motor is really what it gets down to....... its in need of serious tuning but there is hope for pump gas.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SUB-0 H23 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

^^^ nice setup... do you know how much whp & wtq the engine is producing right now?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'd like to know, too...This could give us something to go by

 

I'll let you guys know real soon (i hope) i should be getting this thing tuned in the next week or too

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 93ludeSi &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'll let you guys know real soon (i hope) i should be getting this thing tuned in the next week or too</TD></TR></TABLE>

You are not even gonna come close withthat crapy dc header you have.

And I have never seen any motor with that much internal work come close to 200wtq.

I agree with satan...but try try try, because it will be a fast bitch anyway

 

maybe with some 90 mm pistons, some super high compression, a good flowing header(most likely would have to be custom), and some BEEFY cams and you could possibly do it, or get damn close...

 

Yeah you can do, throw a turbo on it

In all seriousness, a 12:1 motor is not going to do it.

And an h23 had no major advantage over an h22. If you are shooting for 200wtq you are going to tear the whole thing apart anyway, so which block you are starting with wont make a huge difference, either way you will end up with close to 2.5l and living on the ragged edge with compression higher than 14:1.

Someone probably has done it before, there are alot of crazy NA motors out there. But for a street car, NA seems like a waste to me, especially something as big and heavy like a prelude.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SKDRCR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there's a few h22's with around 180-190 ft lbs of torque
but most of them are pushing around 250 hp.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

well on the dynos page 2point6 has a custom 98mm crank at 2.44liter displacement and is puching 247hp at the wheels and he only hits about 182ft/lbs @ 6800rpm. And that is with the arguably best header around: SMSP 4-2-1 prototype #3, Accord euro manifold, big TB and 12:1 compression and webcams.

here are his cam specs:
Intake .468 lift and 260@.50 duration
Exaust .460 lift and 250@.50 duration
The cam gear settings ar at 0 degrees.

specs are similar to crower stage 3's but not too drastic IMO. of course those ar VTEC cams. if you made the same profile for H23 it'd run like poo until about 4000 rpm or higher. So it's a bad Profile for low end.

with an 89 bore and 95 stroke you get pretty close to 2.4 liters. Looks like it won't be easy though...
the Pirate

 

haha I was just tinking about the stock prelude vtec lobe. Anyone ever set the VTEC cross over to 2K rpms? It is freekin hilarious. It bogs like a mother but picks up later when the thing can finally breathe right. And that is like 230° duration @1mm and 20° overlap. Really mild but still crappy for low end. I guess that I am still trying to visualize what low rpm cam profiles look like...

the Pirate