I just got my first set of R-compounds - new, full-tread RA-1s. I heat-cycled them two weeks ago using a mix of the two common techniques... well actually I did one pretty hard lap of a local parking lot first (that was probably dumb, and I feel stupid, but it was only a minute at most of driving), took an hour break for dinner, then did 20 minutes of freeway driving, then 4-5 minutes of hard driving in the parking lot... tried to go progressively harder but I don't think I did a good job - I just kinda went hard... no burnouts or super-huge under/oversteer cornering though. I then immediately took them off the car and let them sit unloaded until today.

Well I was loading them into my car today for the auto-X on Sunday, when I noticed that the outer edges of the middle tread blocks on my front tires were kind of peeling away. It's kind of like a pencil eraser, when the edges start to kind of peel away and roll up. I took some pics but I don't have my USB cable up here at home (doh!). I'd say it's the outer ~1mm perimeter of each tread block, maybe 0.5mm thickness, mainly on the outer edge (of the car, which gets the most cornering force). The outer and inner tread blocks look fine however, and the rear tires only have trace amounts of this peeling, not worried really.

My question is, did I f@ck up? Are my new tires screwed now? What did I do wrong? And what can I do to "save" or make these tires last? Please help an R-compound noob before my race on Sunday. Thanks.

 

Normal deal for those tires. I think it is more severe with full tread tires than shavers, but nothing to get excited about.

Thawley

 

Hmm..i would have to look to really see what you are talking about..but what i will say is that i think it would be pretty hard to "F" up a set of those. (short of stabbing the sidewalls with a knife)

The RA-1s for me have always been pretty good tires for abuse.

My first set were take offs from an ITB car and then i put them through 36 autocrosses, one of which was a 28 run autocross.

My second set after a year and a half and probably 45 autocrosses...two of which were the aformentioned couple dozen run autocrosses, i finally felt like they had fallen off.

I would watch your tire pressures, maybe its rolling over, or not rolling over and thats causing the weird wear pattern.

Jon K
http://www.seat-time.com

 

They're fine. Have fun.

 

Everything I have heard about heat cycling tires has said, run them at highway speeds for half an hour or so with no hard cornering loads. As to what kind of shape your tires are in know I don't know, but the RA1's seem to be a tough tire.

 

They are ruined, send them to me, I will recycle them for you and save you the environmental surcharge fee.

 

I have Never heat cycled my RA-1s. Toyo says it is not needed. I take them right onto the track new. They are a little slick on the first session. Fast after that. I have never had a problem, and as stated before, you couldn't have messed them up.

I think what you are seeing is "worming". So you did get them hot. Melted rubber collects on the ridges of the tire where it can't get scrubbed off. Go to the track and scrub them off.

 

Ok thanks guys. That's part of why I got the RA-1s... they seemed to be pretty tough from other people's experiences - even know a guy on his third year on the same set - of course they're not quite in their prime, but still decent.

I'm concerned of that layer getting fully peeled off this weekend - probably will happen... that would the amount of rubber contacting the ground much smaller, no? Hopefully not - when I was getting done heat-cycling they were still sticky as all hell if that means anything.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gotocrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have Never heat cycled my RA-1s. Toyo says it is not needed. I take them right onto the track new. They are a little slick on the first session. Fast after that. I have never had a problem, and as stated before, you couldn't have messed them up.

I think what you are seeing is "worming". So you did get them hot. Melted rubber collects on the ridges of the tire where it can't get scrubbed off. Go to the track and scrub them off.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Toyou really says that? I thought all race tire manufacturers recommended it? Hmm, well, good to know.

As for scrubbing them off, during the scrubbing period wouldn't it be pretty slick? I guess I'm asking, should I scrub them off before I race this weekend or not worry and let them do their thing during the runs?

BTW I also know a guy (kind of a dumbass, but whatever) who runs RA-1s daily - gets 8-10k out of them on his Integra. Definitely tough for a race tire. I also could have sworn that the treadwear rating (as if that means much of anything) was 60 on the RA-1s... but when I got mine I noticed mine were 100... is that right? Seems rather high compared to the 40-60 of normal race tires, but they do last long... I just remember "60" somehow.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by White98LS &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
BTW I also know a guy (kind of a dumbass, but whatever) who runs RA-1s daily - gets 8-10k out of them on his Integra.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Racing Tires on a Street Car= hard core.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by D.CACO &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Racing Tires on a Street Car= hard core. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Yeah, especially on one with maybe 155whp. He liked them for street racing... I asked him why he just doesn't have drag radials, and he said he liked their handling too. Guess I can't deny that, but $600 on tires every 8-10k?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by gotocrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I have Never heat cycled my RA-1s. Toyo says it is not needed. I take them right onto the track new. They are a little slick on the first session. Fast after that. I have never had a problem, and as stated before, you couldn't have messed them up.

I think what you are seeing is "worming". So you did get them hot. Melted rubber collects on the ridges of the tire where it can't get scrubbed off. Go to the track and scrub them off.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Bingo, the reason Toyo says that is b/c our cars are light enough where we wont really need to heat cycle them. They are quickest on the 2nd or 3rd session and when near the end of their life, they are equal to grip to a victoracer.

The reason the RA-1's are such a good tire to run is the abuse you can give them. They keep taking it and don't fail. Victoracers on the other hand can get pretty greasy on hot days when pushed too hard and will need cool down to get back into it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vapor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The reason the RA-1's are such a good tire to run is the abuse you can give them. They keep taking it and don't fail. Victoracers on the other hand can get pretty greasy on hot days when pushed too hard and will need cool down to get back into it. </TD></TR></TABLE>

My experience exactly

Also, I dont necessarily consider Victo's as a true street tire. Every time I drive them on the street, I pick up a nail from SOMEWHERE! I have lost atleast 4 victoracers on my NSX this way....

Unlike the RA-1's. These are real "street tires" in my opinion, and get serious treadlife on the street, and I have yet to pick up a nail... And they are also great in the rain, like a real street tire should (better IMO than victs and A-032R's).

I'm still shocked that the treadlife is 60 cause it seems like it should be 200 treadwear based on the amount of miles I get on the street set for our CRX and Integra.

Toyo RA-1's

 

yep, they do last long on the street. Where the victo's are softer as they are a choice tire for auto-x and wear rather quickly when driven on the street and stupid cops will give tickets b/c the outter tread bank goes smooth. Arg, I got a ticket from last year that I'm still fighting b/c the victoracers where not shaven but you know how the outside tread block will lose it's tread and for some reason is no longer street legal.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by vapor &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They are equal to grip to a victoracer. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Close but not quite. I've seen the back to back lap times. 2-3 seconds/lap at T-hill in a 140HP Integra. Still a good tire and a ton more durable/long lasting. Probably the best choice out there for anyone on a budget or just doing HPDE. Also a good choice for Enduros were a few seconds a lap is still faster than a tire swap every 3 hours (unless there is a mandatory 5 min pit stop time).

 

I heat cycled my new RA-1's in the 140 degree bake cycle of a paint booth.

 

Well I just raced, the tires were excellent. I placed 3rd out of 5 in my class and probably in the top 5-6 out of 69 overall. I can't stand street tires now.

One thing that's funny is that on street tires in auto-x (Kumho 712s) I used to need an LSD really really bad - almost any time I was on the gas in either 1st or 2nd, there was wheelspin on the inside front, ALL THE TIME.... now hardly any at all, even in 1st it's pretty manageable. The Quaife LSD just got booted way further down on the "things to get" list.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by jpl95si &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Close but not quite. I've seen the back to back lap times. 2-3 seconds/lap at T-hill in a 140HP Integra. Still a good tire and a ton more durable/long lasting. Probably the best choice out there for anyone on a budget or just doing HPDE. Also a good choice for Enduros were a few seconds a lap is still faster than a tire swap every 3 hours (unless there is a mandatory 5 min pit stop time).</TD></TR></TABLE>

indeed however I've found as the RA1s get worn down to a treadless "slick" appearing, they grip just as well as a victoracer and are a hell of a lot friendlier on hot days.