I have searched, read and researched. I have a 91 DA, and I am going to dial in the suspension here soon. Currently I have cheap KYB dampers and the bronze colored Tein springs. I hate this setup, the front end is waaaaaay to low and the back end is up a little high, not to mention there is still to much roll. I put the cheap stuff on last year when most of the car was being rebuilt and I HAD to redo the suspension, but now I want to get it right.

I have read everything I could find about spring/coilover options. For better or worse, Tein is so hot right now, that they are the ones being most talked about right now. My car is still dailey driven, and will only see limited track action this year, in fact it may not be retired from street driving for a couple more years. I just want to get my drop so that all the fenders are about .5" above the tires, making things look good, but still leaving some clearance. I also of course want to minimize body roll, while not making the thing ride like a wagon.

I know I am asking a lot from whatever I pick, which is why I am trying to make sure I pick the correct setup. I have considered just picking some other kind of springs with less drop in the front, maybe H & R, also thought about GC with some Konis. Of course coilovers other than Tein would be a consideration if there are some out there with a bigger bang for the buck, but I cant find anyone that will admit this.

Sorry for running on, but I would really appreciate any response from folks that have driven or tuned cars with some of the above mentioned ideas. As always thanks ahead of time.

 

Well, let me tell you my setup, and why I like it.

I have a 93 LS that I daily drive and autocross once a month. I run Neuspeed Sports, Koni Yellows, and a Progress 22mm rear sway bar. I love the setup. It rides comfortably (it's all relative here: its a little worse than stock, but not much). If it's mostly a street car, my advice to you is get sport springs (Eibach, Neuspeed, H&R, it probably makes little difference) and good shocks. I love my Koni's, although I got them used for $325, not the full price of ~$550). This will make your car handle well, and most importantly for a daily driver, it won't be too harsh.

The next step is key: get a good rear roll bar. I love my Progress piece, although if you don't autocross, I'd recommend something a little smaller and easier to install. Lots of DA people like the Suspension Techniques 19mm unit. This will give your car the nice, balanced feel you want. The rear sway bar makes a HUGE difference in your handling. It turned my car from a understeering plow at the limit to a very well-balanced car. And yes, the back will come around on you if you push too hard. It happened to me twice the first time I autocrossed with the Progress bar.

In my opinion, unless you have a lot of money that you really want to spend on your car, the Tein's are probably overkill. I haven't used them, but I have used my Koni's and I'm absolutely happy with them for daily driving / autocross use. Unless you're one hell of a driver, it's unlikely you'll see much difference between the two as far as lap times, and if it's mostly a street car anyway, save your money man, it's overkill.

That's my $0.02!

- Jim

 

It will be cheaper and at least as effective to run a Koni/Ground Control setup. Tein makes some great suspension components, but there is a lot of hype surrounding their cheaper models. The Tein Basic, SS, and Flex aren't built to be "track worthy" out of the box. They were built to offer a comparably slight handling upgrade combined with lowering the vehicle while keeping ride quality bearable. You'll save a lot of money going with a Koni/Ground Control setup, and can even get a shock spring combination that will be perfectly bearable on the street while offering the benefits of a suspension upgrade and a lowered vehicle.

 

completely agree with kendall and sylverius....tein has great marketing and exposure.....but their entry level stuff is well.........entry level. Probably why you are not satisfied with their "bronze" stuff. You can't go wrong with konis and Ground control coilovers.
But from reading your post you also sound like you are looking for something more for appearance and stability than harcore auto-x. I'd recommend the Eibach Pro-kit with kyb agx shocks or konis for a little more money. The Pro-kit has a nice moderate drop 0.8 to 1.4, and great ride quality.
Sorry bout your restart......we've all be there done that when it comes to wishing we had gone with another setup...... at least I have. Good luck

 

kyb agx shocks are great, with stock springs. 130 bucks installed for all at discount tire. you can haggle with them

i also have a 22mm progress anti-roll bar and custom rear lower tie-bar(from ben ogle). no more understeer and very little body roll. i need stock height on my DA, reason for stock springs.

 

problem is... you have Tein h-tech springs
for a nice even drop, get the S-tech's and run some koni yellows.
i believe its a great setup for daily driving with a touch of aggressiveness

sylverius - thanks for the info, very useful for me

 

WOW lots of great info, and not what I expected, I thought this would end up being a Tein-fest.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSaargh &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">problem is... you have Tein h-tech springs
for a nice even drop, get the S-tech's and run some koni yellows.
i believe its a great setup for daily driving with a touch of aggressiveness

</TD></TR></TABLE>

What would happen if I switched to the S-tech's? Does anyone have any postable pics of their cars with non-adjustable setups, so I can what the drop really is before I do this again.

I never realized this would be so hard, because I nailed the suspension first time out on my Jetta, for both height and ride, but now I am really struggling with different ideas for the DA.

Thanks for the help!

 

forget the s-tech as well...........practically the same spring as the h-tech but more of a drop.....they are both entry level. I've had the eibach pro-kit twice; once with cheapo blue tokicos and once with kyb agx.
DA's are strange in that they tend to settle/sag lower in the rear than the front with practically any spring combination with a 1.5" of greater drop and no camber kit. With the pro-kit I didn't have this problem. Don't have pics of my eibach setups on my comp yet but
I also had a set of neuspeed 1.8" drop springs on my DA (didn't like them much), here is a pic of that.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by GSaargh &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">sylverius - thanks for the info, very useful for me
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Anytime man, glad to help.

Here's a pic of mine:


Koni's on middle perch
Neuspeed Sports (1.8" drop)
15" 95GSRs
195/50R-15 Kumho 712's

What I also like about the Koni's is that you can raise or lower the spring perch by +/- half an inch, so if you want a taller ride height for snow or shitty roads or whatever, you can raise it a little, and still have stiffer springs than stock or the Pro-Kit.

That pic is actually pretty old, maybe I'll go take another one since its sunny out. I have since lowered the front by half an inch (front and rear Koni's now both on middle perch).

- Jim

EDIT - One advantage of sport springs over GC's is that you can find them cheap used. I think I got mine for like $80, and that's far from the cheapest I've seen them since. I've also ridden in a couple cars with GC's that go clunk over bumps and whatnot because the springs come off the perch when the springs are full extended and the car is still moving up (like after a bump).

This might not have been the GC's, but that's what the guy said it was.


Modified by Sylverius at 6:22 PM 4/9/2004

 

I got my Ground Controls for $250 shipped.

 

So how do you like them? What spring rates did you get? Do you get any of that clunking I was talking about?

The greatest thing about GC's is that you custom pick your spring rates. Nice little perk!

- Jim

 

Thanks for helping with the pics. I guess I am going to have to get some kind of coilover system to really get the drop I want. CDcliffjumper, I think you are right about how DA's settle in, the drop I have is way more than I expected.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DCcliffjumper2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">DA's are strange in that they tend to settle/sag lower in the rear than the front with practically any spring combination with a 1.5" of greater drop and no camber kit. With the pro-kit I didn't have this problem. Don't have pics of my eibach setups on my comp yet but
I also had a set of neuspeed 1.8" drop springs on my DA (didn't like them much), here is a pic of that.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

For some reason my front end is slammed and the rear is significantly higher, which is driving me crazy, I hit the front end on everything. I really have to get this straightened out before I do the body work.

 

i have the tein ss on my 92 gs-r and i love them. i love the ride and the handeling. i haven't seen any problems with the back saging lower than the front. actually i feel like the front looks lower than the rear. either way i give my teins the

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by giff74 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Thanks for helping with the pics. I guess I am going to have to get some kind of coilover system to really get the drop I want. CDcliffjumper, I think you are right about how DA's settle in, the drop I have is way more than I expected. </TD></TR></TABLE>
no problem, your welcome.
The coilovers definitely give you a lot more wiggle room in terms of adjustability, and the only time I saw the problem sylverius mentions with the coilovers was when I lifted my friends crx ( with GC knockoffs) to almost stock height..........we quickly lowered it back down. So as long as you are not planning on bringing it up to stock height the GC coilovers should not be a problem.

As for the reason I didn't like my neuspeed sport springs......after several months, they were sagging badly in the back (can't see this in my pics which were taken just a month after the install). I would not recommend the neuspeed sport for DA's to anyone because of my experience.

 

You know, now that you mention it, I think my Neuspeed sports might be sagging in the rear. There's definitely more of a gap in the front. I always explained it away to my front springs being on the higher perch, but now that I lowered them back to the middle perch, it still looks higher than the rear.

My springs are pretty old though. First off, they're used. Second, they're black. I know, new Neuspeed sports are green, but I actually called Neuspeed with the part numbers listed on the springs, and sure enough, they're just really old sports. This could definitely cause some of the sagging issues.

My vote is definitely for the GC's if you've got the money, although if you've gotta save money somewhere, I'd DEFINITELY get the Koni's, and save money on the springs by getting a set of used Sports. And don't forget your camber kit!!

- Jim

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by kb8thekid &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">i have the tein ss on my 92 gs-r and i love them. i love the ride and the handeling. i haven't seen any problems with the back saging lower than the front. actually i feel like the front looks lower than the rear. either way i give my teins the </TD></TR></TABLE>

I was at a car show today and again someone was swearing about how great Teins were. Without driving both setups I am really at a loss, I have seen the basic coilovers shipped for $637 and I know the GC and Koni's will go almost as much. I have even thought about keeping my cheap shocks and adding the GC, but am afraid to add the higher spring rates to the cheap shocks. I am really going to have to think about this, because whatever I do next, I want to be the last suspension setup for a while.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by giff74 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I was at a car show today and again someone was swearing about how great Teins were. Without driving both setups I am really at a loss, I have seen the basic coilovers shipped for $637 and I know the GC and Koni's will go almost as much. I have even thought about keeping my cheap shocks and adding the GC, but am afraid to add the higher spring rates to the cheap shocks. I am really going to have to think about this, because whatever I do next, I want to be the last suspension setup for a while.</TD></TR></TABLE>

You can always buy the GC and try them on your cheap shocks, then later upgrade to the konis and love the improvement. That way it's not as much a hit on your wallet at one time, and maybe then you can sell your s-tech springs to put the cash toward your konis. It's all about recycling and upgrading, when it comes to not breaking the bank
I don't think you can lose too badly with either of those choices, so good luck.

 

Ill go ahead and start off talking for the Tein guys!

I have the SS's on my car and I love them. This is my point here....I got my SS's for 8xx shipped. Say you pay even 600 for a good strut and spring/coilover setup. I think its worth paying the extra 2xx for a LifeTime Warrantied Strut/Spring

I have the stock sway bar; I really want a new one (front and rear) If you could msg me with some good opinions that would be great; I dont want to jack this useres thread thanks
I also have all 3 of bens bars as well....lower tie bar, rear strut and the cPillar.
(just extra food for though)

If I had any reason why I wouldnt buy them; the only thing I can think of is you cant get custom spring rates.

(note: Ive never really tried any other setup; I know me and my friends all ride on Teins)

 

im on the tein ss as well. i like em. good street setup, hence the name Super Street. ive been to one autox and they did well, but i need to learn to drive.

you can get custom rates for teins but need to revalve the rear shocks. if youre a competitive autoxer, id look past tein ss and get custom GC or somthing. but if you want a good street setup and have extra $$$ for teins you wont be disappointed.

if you strapped, GC/Koni probably wont disappoint you w/ the regular rates. but my tein ss are the only suspension ive ever ridden on.

 

a pic from the cruise to Alki on saturday...


a pic from yesterday


not only do i care about covering the gap, but the body all around should be level. DA's look weird IMO w/o a lip or anything, because of how high the front bumper sits. i suggest everyone to get a lip but yeah... oem lip kit ownz jo0

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Sylverius &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Anytime man, glad to help.

Here's a pic of mine:


Koni's on middle perch
Neuspeed Sports (1.8" drop)
15" 95GSRs
195/50R-15 Kumho 712's

What I also like about the Koni's is that you can raise or lower the spring perch by +/- half an inch, so if you want a taller ride height for snow or shitty roads or whatever, you can raise it a little, and still have stiffer springs than stock or the Pro-Kit.

That pic is actually pretty old, maybe I'll go take another one since its sunny out. I have since lowered the front by half an inch (front and rear Koni's now both on middle perch).

- Jim

EDIT - One advantage of sport springs over GC's is that you can find them cheap used. I think I got mine for like $80, and that's far from the cheapest I've seen them since. I've also ridden in a couple cars with GC's that go clunk over bumps and whatnot because the springs come off the perch when the springs are full extended and the car is still moving up (like after a bump).

This might not have been the GC's, but that's what the guy said it was.


Modified by Sylverius at 6:22 PM 4/9/2004</TD></TR></TABLE>

thats a nice drop on your car, im surprised i havent seen it around the Jax.
BTW where do you go and autoX?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by projectTeG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

thats a nice drop on your car, im surprised i havent seen it around the Jax.
BTW where do you go and autoX?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thanks man, I appreciate it. I try to keep it low-key, no need to arouse unwanted attention. Most people don't even realize its low until they try to get in or out of it!

I run Buccaneer Autocross, #93 STS. Check out http://www.buccaneerregion.com. The next event is May 23 I believe. They're held at Whitehouse Airfield, which is off of I-10, about ten miles west of downtown. Come check it out!

What car do you have?

- Jim

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nickgmiller04 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
you can get custom rates for teins but need to revalve the rear shocks. if youre a competitive autoxer, id look past tein ss and get custom GC or somthing. but if you want a good street setup and have extra $$$ for teins you wont be disappointed.

if you strapped, GC/Koni probably wont disappoint you w/ the regular rates. but my tein ss are the only suspension ive ever ridden on.</TD></TR></TABLE>


So you saying althought the Teins cost more, the GC and Konis would be the superior setup, espcially if I intend to use the car on the track??????

 

The thing with track driving is you'd want completely different spring rates than what the Teins come with. Street driving and track setups are (and should be) different. I'd never want to drive to work and class on race springs and super stiff shock valving, I'd suffer kidney failure. My car makes enough funny rattles as it is!

The kicker is that you can get the GC's with whatever rates you want, so you can strike that middle ground between comfort and trackability. It won't be perfect for either, but it can let you have fun in both situations.

- Jim