well talked to G eoff and he said post and see how many people i can find that would want some traction bars for the 92-96 lude... (might be same for accord and later model lude not sure yet)

i would imagine the price would be around the civic and teg bars.
woo adjustable caster without shims...yea man..

 

How much? I really don't know how much they are...

 

what do they do?

 

would this require removing the front crossmember?

 

I'm in. I still need the price.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by v4lu3s &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">would this require removing the front crossmember?</TD></TR></TABLE>Yes... it replaces the stock one.

Price check please. The one shown looks pretty damn good

 

forgive my ignorance....does this prevent wheel-hop? or what?
(if it does then that would be sweet)

 

The civic/crx ones run $350 I believe. I am interested in a set as well. BUT the problem with the H series is we use a motor mount for the front of our motor. Geoff would have to incorperate this into the design and add a section to it to allow us to run the mount still. You do not want to run without the stock front motor mount... especiall when you have a powerful motor.

 

in

 

what would you do about the center beam? or does it just eliminate that altogether?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrecisionH23a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The civic/crx ones run $350 I believe. I am interested in a set as well. BUT the problem with the H series is we use a motor mount for the front of our motor. Geoff would have to incorperate this into the design and add a section to it to allow us to run the mount still. You do not want to run without the stock front motor mount... especiall when you have a powerful motor.</TD></TR></TABLE>

civic/crx's come with front motor mounts stock aswell - nobody ever uses them because mount kits only come with 3 mounts - many headers require us to cut off the braket on the crossmember as well. Even on EG swaped H22A civics the hasport kit only provides 3 mounts.



The reason for 4 (i'm pretty sure) is for comfort. 4 soft mounts are better than 3 stiffer ones - but 3 stiff ones is all you'll ever need.

YOU need 4 mounts (thats for damn sure).. but 95% of prelude owners will be perfectly fine with 3 mounts providing that they use ES inserts. There are plenty of very high powered '3 mount' civics out there holding up. If anything, it should be an option, not a requirement..

 

Civics/Integra's do not have front motor mounts. EF civics have them, not the EG or EK though. (props to gay sam). The reason prelude's have this mount is because it is for torque. B series motors sit 'up and forward' more in civics whereas H series in a civic/integ sit more back in the bay.

I know people with civics use the HASport mounts, but the motor sits in a completely different position as it does in the prelude. Plus, prelude's do not have these mounts readily available. Instead we have Energy Suspension ones and they are not enough to compensate for the loss of the front mount.

It is a requirement, I do not care what you say. You are increaseing the stress placed on the other motor mounts by a large amount. Have you ever revved the stock motor without the front mount in place? You'll be surprised by the amount that the motor will flex and twist. It is not safe and with high whp preludes this promotes a high danger. I run all 4 mounts in my car (the front one was custom made using a tube frame) and it helped to keep the motor in position. Here is a video of my car on the dyno with 20psi. Notice the amount the motor does not move:

Video of the dyno (2.6MB):
http://people.clemson.edu/~lan...p.mpg

At idle without the mount, if you revved the motor using the throttle cable the motor bounced back and forth.

The last thing you want to do is break a motor mount and get your throttle stuck open. I was talking to my welder about this in the past and he was saying how some heavy duty v8's with loads of torque even use a safety chain bolted to the frame/Xmember in case of motor mount failure. He told me a story about this guy who had a high power/torque hotrod and broke a motor mount which lead to the throttle cable getting stuck in place... long story short, unfortunately, the guy is no longer with us.

I was going to ditch my front motor mount a few months ago but after research, seeing how the motor flexed, and making a few threads dealing with this, the bottom line is the prelude's need that mount. Otherwise honda would not have designed them.

If you do not have experience with this type of thing as well as the civic's/Integra design, please do not add your response. Thinking something will work is nothing like hands on experience as well as applying mechanics to the system and seeing how the other mounts will be affected by the loss of a supporting member.

In a nutshell, under load the front mount is under tension (force applied away from mount aka pulling) and the rear is under compression (force being applied to mount aka pushing). When you release the load the motor jumps forward, placing the front mount under compression and the rear under tension. I know tension and compression mainly refers to cable diagrams, but you get the point. Geoff is in engineering, I know he knows whats up. He will come up with a good design... hopefully a separate beam for the mount will be designed.

I sent geoff a PM, I am sure he can incorperate a mount to the kit with no problem. I also mentioned to him that a stronger beam may be needed to compensate the additional forces applied by using the motor mount.

 

place racing does make replacement mounts for preludes. i looked into them when i had to remove my front mount to accomdate for my turbo. they are roughly $120 each though.

breaking mounts sucks, i know b/c i broke one, that in turn broke a bolt OUT OF MY BLOCK which in turn added stress to the rear mount and BROKE MY TRANNY CASING!!!!!!

so i have to pull the motor and disassemble it, have the bolt holes welded up and then re-tapped on the block, and had to buy a new tranny casing.

 

So you are spending closely to $500 for something you already have stock AND you lose a motor mount?

I am sure geoff will have a new design for the prelude's that will be better then the stock ones.

.....waiting for geoff to chime in.

 

I've got 3-4 buyers here.

The front mount has to be incorporated.

 

I would definatly be interested if a front mount is incorporated into the design.

 

Or a second bar has to support the front mount...one way or another we need something holding a front mount on...

 

actually yeah separating the traction bar from the motor mount would probably be a really good idea!

 

stop post whoring.... or else i'll dock your ***

 

+1

 

These traction bars, does it take away the suspension capabiltiy? With these bars will i still be able to take twisties like before? In other words will it do anything to my suspension? Like worsen it ?

 

Is it wise to have it on for a daily driven?

 

I'm interested, but I need a few of these ^^^^^ Questions answered first!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by PrecisionH23a &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you do not have experience with this type of thing as well as the civic's/Integra design, please do not add your response. Thinking something will work is nothing like hands on experience as well as applying mechanics to the system and seeing how the other mounts will be affected by the loss of a supporting member.

In a nutshell, under load the front mount is under tension (force applied away from mount aka pulling) and the rear is under compression (force being applied to mount aka pushing). When you release the load the motor jumps forward, placing the front mount under compression and the rear under tension. I know tension and compression mainly refers to cable diagrams, but you get the point.</TD></TR></TABLE>

The thing is, you simply lose 1 of 2 supporting member (tension/compression wise) on two of the hasport kits, this works because the mounts are much stiffer.. 1 handles the tension and compression. I think thats reason enough to atleast add this to the conversation. I've done several experiments including "revving the stock motor without the front mount" - and i came to the conclusion that you only need 3 mounts (one being the rear) if the "t/c" (lets call it) mount is stiff. I scrapped my fount mount and went with an ES kit on my last setup aswell, and i beet the crap out of it. I know about stafty chains.. i've looked into the physics and contruction of mounts quite a bit more than the average HT user, i even put a NC switch (to an LED)on my motor to get an idea as to how much my motor is torquing under load because i'm only using 3 mounts. Please P61, i'm just trying to help. and no, i wouldn't care what i said if i was running alot of power, but if i'm just worried about wheel hop and have your basic I/H/E setup then i still don't agree that you need more than 3 stiff mounts.

But your right, this doesn't easily apply to Preludes because there aren't as many mount goddies out there as the civic/teg crowed. I'll take your word that the prelude motor sits in the engine bay differently enough to be concerened (producting differn't types of moments/forces and such..)..

Maybe Geoff can add to this?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Please P61, i'm just trying to help. </TD></TR></TABLE>

 

i will purchase one, only on the condition that the front engine mount is incorportated into the design...

what will the approximate weight of the piece be? will there be any significant weight savings over the stock crossmember???