does any one have a pic of a rear lower tie bar mounted on a crx? I'm just trying to find out what it looks like, how low they sits, and where it mounts. Thanks

 

mounts on lower control arms, doesnt sit any lower than suspension, and i cant seem mine cuz of the exhaust dammit!

 

here is how it looks, and an answer to BLING that useless bar, pass. exit exhaust
thinking about taking it off or making a custom one. need to reroute the exhaust a bit.
stan

 

sweet thanks

 

I would take pics of my blingin ZSpeed but can't..

 

I have the Skunk2 rear lower tie bar. Only time I ever see it is when I'm under the car because my Thermal muffler is blocking it. But as long as it does what it's supposed to be doing I don't care

 

you may not see it....but it does its job....

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by dgonzals &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you may not see it....but it does its job....</TD></TR></TABLE>

What's it do? Any before and after comparisons?

 

I put my front lower one on and there was a noticable difference. I have heard the rear is even moreso, but I haven't put one on yet.

-Dustin

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

What's it do? Any before and after comparisons?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

Don't waste your money. Buy a sway bar. Tie bars do nothing except for BLinG

 

Yeah, I did the front one a long time ago and the steering cleaned up a lot in turns. It reduced bump steer from turns on rough roads quite a bit.

Upper ones... chassis became a bit stiffer, but I could see how a roll cage would be better.

Rear lower... no clue!


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Don't waste your money. Buy a sway bar. Tie bars do nothing except for BLinG</TD></TR></TABLE>

Hahaha - that's hilarious! Do you have any clue what you are talking about? Do you KNOW what a sway bar REALLY does? They don't do the same thing and weren't intended to.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


Hahaha - that's hilarious! Do you have any clue what you are talking about? Do you KNOW what a sway bar REALLY does? They don't do the same thing and weren't intended to. </TD></TR></TABLE>


Hey moron, the tie bar ties the lower control arms together that is already attached to the CHASSIS of the car. how is this doing anything for the car.

A sway bar attaches to the suspension of the car thus making it one unit. thus making the car stiffer and has less body roll.

Before you stick you FOOT in your mouth go read.

Edit, I said nothing of how the 2 are the same or did the same thing.

 

Well, suggesting to just get a sway bar in the middle of a tie bar post makes it seem that you are trying to say that a sway bar is better at doing a tie bars job. Why else would you post "Buy a sway bar" in a tie rod oreinted post?

I already have a sway bar which sufficiently cleans up the roll that my springs and shocks can't deal with. Spending money on a beefier sway would lead to conditions that I do NOT want... understeer or oversteer depending on which sway bar is bigger.

So, you think the tie rods do nothing for chassis stiffening? Hmmm...
Yeah - I know it's not a full roll cage, but then again they don't carry half the price of a full roll cage either. Futhermore, why is it that I see upper tie bars on professional road race cars that do have a full roll cage incorperated? Are they just dumb or what?

Adding a front lower tie bar made an OBVIOUS difference in my car and in other peoples cars that I have spoken to that have a front lower as well. Why waste the money though, huh? I mean what performance minded individual in their right mind would want to stiffen the chassis up for $70 (quality Cusco lower front bar... not some ebay thing) to gain a little better control and feel in their car? Damn those idiots! They should all be out buying fatty fat fat sway bars for $300. Man.. you should really go school them!


Edit: Before YOU stick your FOOT in your mouth open it... you have big shoes on.

 

Didnt Integra Type R's come with front and rear UPPER strut bar from the factory? So that may prove to some of you out there that tie bars are there for a reason. "They" say the rear LOWER tie bar is suppost to stiffen that rear crossmember that the lower arms attach to. Again, "they" say its common for flex to be at those low suspension attaching/pick up points. Thats just what i remember reading from somewhere...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Well, suggesting to just get a sway bar in the middle of a tie bar post makes it seem that you are trying to say that a sway bar is better at doing a tie bars job. Why else would you post "Buy a sway bar" in a tie rod oreinted post?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Because I was stating that the money would be well spent somewhere else.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I already have a sway bar which sufficiently cleans up the roll that my springs and shocks can't deal with. Spending money on a beefier sway would lead to conditions that I do NOT want... understeer or oversteer depending on which sway bar is bigger.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was not talking to you about YOUR set up. I could care less that YOU have a sway bar. AGAIN I was talking to the creator of this thread.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
So, you think the tie rods do nothing for chassis stiffening? Hmmm...
Yeah - I know it's not a full roll cage, but then again they don't carry half the price of a full roll cage either. Futhermore, why is it that I see upper tie bars on professional road race cars that do have a full roll cage incorperated? Are they just dumb or what?

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Do you have a FULL race car. If you do then good for you but AGAIN the creator of the thread does not know what a tie bar is so I have a good assumption that he does not, therefor he would not need a tie bar. If the car is done then yes get a tie bar, other then that it's for BLING factor.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Adding a front lower tie bar made an OBVIOUS difference in my car and in other peoples cars that I have spoken to that have a front lower as well. </TD></TR></TABLE>

If it did something then explain what it did. You have not given any proof that it has done anything but " it's made OBVIOUS difference", well like what, Did it cut down on body roll, will the rear step out smoother, WHAT did it do?

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">They should all be out buying fatty fat fat sway bars for $300. Man.. you should really go school them!

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't know what brand of sway bar you are looking at but I can find them all day for 130.00-140.00.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

Edit: Before YOU stick your FOOT in your mouth open it... you have big shoes on. </TD></TR></TABLE>

You must wear CLOWNSHOES

 

hahahahahahaaaaa!


Ok man - "...good assumption that he does not..."
You know, you are probably right about him not having a race car, but you should know what assuming stuff gets you.


It's funny how you say you were reponding with all that info toward the creator of the thread. Funny thing is that all the creator wanted was a picture and nothing else. Where's he ask for info and your opinion?


No, the front tie rod I have did not do anything for body roll. If it did, I didn't notice. That's not what it's supposed to do anyway. What I did notice can be felt on everyday streets. When taking turns on rouch paved roads I used to have a little bump steer especially notable if I took the turn aggressively. That's pretty much gone now. I have a better feel in the turns now and it makes it easier to respond to what the car is doing. My guess is that the chassis where the LCA's bolt to does flex some and the bumps in the steering are a result from uneven horizontal force that would wobble one wheel, but not translate to the other wheel. My guess is that both LCA's are now feeling the force a lot more evenly now and I don't get the wobble. Money well spent IMO.

Suspension Techniques seems to be the brand to go with for sway bars. Do they cost a bit more than the other brand you suggest.


Your sway thing still doesn't hold water if you still don't get it. Tie bars don't do what sway bars do. If you are out to have a car that doesn't lift up the inner wheel around tight turns then you go get a sway bar.... you don't go buy a tie bar. So would be getting a sway bar be money well spent if you only wanted a stiffer chassis?


I'm not wearing clown shoes. Your internet psychic capabilities are failing you.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Tie bars don't do what sway bars do

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Never said they did

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you are out to have a car that doesn't lift up the inner wheel around tight turns then you go get a sway bar.... you don't go buy a tie bar.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

My friend you are sooooooo WRONG on this. The idea behind a sway bar is that the pick up points are at the suspension and therefore making the whole suspension one piece.

This will pick up the INNER REAR tire around corners.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
No, the front tie rod I have did not do anything for body roll. If it did, I didn't notice. That's not what it's supposed to do anyway. What I did notice can be felt on everyday streets. When taking turns I used to have a little bump steer if I took the turn aggressively. That's pretty much gone now. I have a better feel in the turns now</TD></TR></TABLE>

You say that the front tie rod did nothing that you could tell for body roll, yet you state that you did notice a difference when you took turns on the street.

So tell me, how do you not feel any difference in body roll when that is what happens in a turn, yet you state that you did feel something.

Please stop contradicting yourself.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I'm not wearing clown shoes. Your internet psychic capabilities are failing you.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Still Clownshoes.

 

I think the "H" braces would be much more effective at preventing chassis flex, and when I get time I'll work on engineering one for the rear of my car. Front ones are already available, so i can just copy one of those.

If you look at the LCA pickup points they really don't look as though they were designed for any serious suspension loads

-Dustin

 

&gt;sigh&lt;

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">The idea behind a sway bar is that the pick up points are at the suspension and therefore making the whole suspension one piece.

This will pick up the INNER REAR tire around corners. </TD></TR></TABLE>

No. That's not true unless you got a sway bar that is too heavy for the application. You do NOT want to three wheel through turns. It's loss of traction. If that's was what was ideal, then they wouldn't have put them on factory made cars because it would be unsafe.

During a turn the outside wheels suspension is under load and the inner wheel is not. When the sway bar picks up that the outer wheel is under compression it does it's thing. It's like adding spring weight on the outside wheels of the car. It also lets you feel all the uneven bumps in the road.

In a non-roll application like a race car they don't even use the sway bars to reduce sway. If you are setting up a race car you use sway bars to do some other trickery. Since a race car has heavy weight springs already, they aren't going to lean. They use the sway to do this -
A big bar on the front, increases rear lateral and motive traction.
A big bar on the rear, increases front lateral and motive traction.
The applications. If the car is understeering, decrease front bar size, or increase
rear bar size. This increases front lateral grip and decreases rear lateral grip
giving the car a more neutral to oversteer feel. Reverse the process for
too much oversteer.


What's that go to do with the chassis flex? Errrm... nothing.


I'm not contradicting myself. I plain and simply said that I didn't feel it do anything for body roll. Read on a little bit and I explain what is felt in turns and it's not related to roll at all.




Modified by 4drEF at 1:50 PM 2/12/2004

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Do you have any clue what you are talking about? </TD></TR></TABLE>


its obvious you dont , do us all a favor and never procreate.

I cant even contribute to this worthless thread

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 4drEF &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">&gt;sigh&lt;

It's loss of traction.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

I totally agree with this. The tie rod does do something but I think that you would more benefit from having a sway bar first and then adding a tie bar after. Or do both at the same time.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Mr Furball &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I totally agree with this. The tie rod does do something but I think that you would more benefit from having a sway bar first and then adding a tie bar after. Or do both at the same time. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yeah. Hmmm.
Adding the rear sway first would be better for most preformance minded people that are worried about having traction in Auto-X type turns. On a street car adding the rear sway will guarantee that you feel more bumps in the road.

I don't think you can do both. I looked into it once a LONG time ago and it was either one or the other. I don't know if kits have cahnged since then.... might be worth looking into.

Still... anyone have experience with the rear lower tie bar? Any first hand "how does it feel" experience?

 

I have a rear tie down and sway bar and nothing in the front and I like it is better than when I had a strut in front

 

got one, see post above, that piece did zilch, nothing, it added shine factor and about 2 pounds. it was free, and it will most likely come off soon.
here is my impression on the tie bars, in the order of the most impact on the handling to none.
front upper, neuspeed - tightened up the steering and turn-in.
front lower, cusco - reduced tramming, improved turn-in and high-speed stability.
rear upper, no-name - slight improvement in rotation. (shitty quality, it was 30$)
rear lower, no-name possibly made by walmart? - coat hanger, shiny (free).
there you go.
i did not understand half of what you were babbling about earlier, if you are asking about the effect of the lower tiebar, you need to re-educate yourself on suspension geometry theories rather then argue a moot point.
Stan