Yeah I know sounds stupid but every time I search My computer freezes, Been happening for the past 3 weeks.(It's my STUPID internet!)
Anyway What is the differences between the D16a1 and the ZC? somebody wants to trade me for my motor and I asked to trade for a ZC.

 

which car was the d16a1 from...i only know the a6...tell me which car it is, and i'll tell u the differences

 

In the process of gaining that knowledge myself. What was the motor in the 89 teg? I thought that the Zc was more like the y7 and y8 I didn't know about the a1. I got pics of it and it looks just like my zc but who knows? not me.

 

d16a1 is from 86-89 integra

 

Okay thats what I had in my mind. its still 130Hp or ps though correct? It's black top I know that. anyway do you guys think thats a good trade? my d15b vtec without vtec that I don't have the money to vtec it correctly for the d16a1? I saw pics of the motor and its emaculate. comes with everything but the exhaust manifold and the down pipe which I have. I also have another ZC in my garage that I could use parts off of if I need to. only question is he lives in WA and I live in KS so How would you go about doing that if you did?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by speed_racer012 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Yeah I know sounds stupid but every time I search My computer freezes, Been happening for the past 3 weeks.(It's my STUPID internet!)
Anyway What is the differences between the D16a1 and the ZC? somebody wants to trade me for my motor and I asked to trade for a ZC. </TD></TR></TABLE>
Heres a thread you might find helpful.

https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=737941


And no the D16A1 is not 130hp, its more like 112-115hp.
And I would say NO it's not a good trade.

 

The D16A1 came in 86-89 USDM Integras. The 86-87 brown/olive top has vacuum advance, slightly thicker rods, slightly lower compression, and 113hp. The 88-89 black top has electronic advance, slightly thinner rods, slightly higher compression, and 118hp. There is no one particular engine that THE ZC. There are several different engines that are called the ZC, all of them being JDM, and all of them saying "ZC" on the engine block stamp. Some people call the D16A1 a "ZC" but that is wrong. If you hear someone say that would you please kick them in the nuts for me? Thanks. Now, what is a ZC? The early 1g dohc ZC that is externally identical to the D16A1 also came in both brown/olive top and black top and had *I think* about 130hp. WARNING!!! The D16A1 and the 1g ZC have the valve cover bolts near the middle of the valve cover and these engines have very little in common with the other ZCs and the d-series in 88+ Civics. Different head bolt pattern, different bell housing bolt pattern, different engine mounts. These will not swap into your 89 Civic without huge effort or money! You have been warned! There is also a black top 2g dohc ZC that has the valve cover bolts on the outside edges of the valve cover. This is the one that many people swap into 88-91 Civics/CRXs. The sohc non-vtec ZC is similar to, and shares many parts with, the D16A6. The sohc vtec ZC is similar to, and shares many parts with, the D16Z6. Be very very careful about which ZC someone is trying to sell you, and if it is even a real ZC.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by speed_racer012 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">It's black top I know that.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That could be one of several ZCs, dohc or sohc, carbed or mpfi, vacuum advance or electronic advance, vtec or non-vtec. Make sure the block is stamped "ZC" and not anything else.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by speed_racer012 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">anyway do you guys think thats a good trade? my d15b vtec without vtec that I don't have the money to vtec it correctly for the d16a1?</TD></TR></TABLE>

I don't think it is a good trade, especially for an engine that won't even swap into your car. What is wrong with your D15B anyway? Why doesn't it have vtec?


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by speed_racer012 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I saw pics of the motor and its emaculate.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Clean and purty on the outside doesn't mean anything except that he washed it good, and that might be bad.


I'm not sure which ZC to recommend that you get but research which ones have the OBD that matches what you want and get that one. If I were you I would just fix the D15B.

 

Well that turns me away a lot. I'm glad I came here first. The problem with the D15b is that I don't have the OBD1 coversion and I also don't have the ecu. I used to have a ZC in my car, Black top. It had a lot more power than this motor does right now and I was/am looking for just the block and I was going to turbo that but then this came up. Thanks ALOT for the info on the motors.

 

Here are some picks of the motor.

http://www.shutterfly.com/os.j...pen=1

 

<U>The D16A1 is a useless motor to us</U>. It has NO good qualities... So just hang onto your D15 for now. I'm sure that somebody with a real ZC will trade you. But if you take this deal,<U>you're getting screwed</U>.

Trust us! We know what we're talking about. Also, the A1 is nothing like the ZC, it'd take too much work to convert the pistons and such. Just go to http://www.hmotorsonline.com and pick a ZC up. $525 for the long block.

 

Yeah I'm not planning on getting the motor :[ It sounded good at first but thanks to H-t I'm a little more educated on things. If I had 525+shipping I most likely would but for know I'll just stick to looking for a ZC block. There is a place in town here that sold a kid A DOHC ZC for 200 with ECU DAMN LUCKY KID!!! Any way thanks for the knowledge and info. Hope to just keep learning.

 

lol... I might be in the market for a D15 sometime soon. It all depends on when the Rex shell shows up. I'll PM you if you still have it this summer.

 

I most likely will. who knows my luck I'll send a piston through the hood somehow and it would land on the back hatch glass. Man I have bad luck with this thing. Oh well just keep fightin I guess.

 

OK, if no one else is gonna do it, I'll step up to the plate and correct him.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VashTheStampede &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"><U>The D16A1 is a useless motor to us</U>. It has NO good qualities... </TD></TR></TABLE>

WHOA there jake! It might not be the best for you 2g CRX/4g CIVIC guys, but from my EW4 perspective, it has MANY good qualities and is quite the upgrade.


<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by VashTheStampede &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, the A1 is nothing like the ZC, ...</TD></TR></TABLE>

Right here is where you need a swift kick in the nuts. Can everyone please stop posting misiniformation? The D16A1 is almost EXACTLY like the 1g ZC. And, the 2g dohc ZC head will only bolt onto a D16A1 block and NOT onto any 88+ d-series. Oh, did you mean a different ZC? Well you didn't say that did you. This is how so many people get confused reading these boards, when someone says "ZC" meaning one ZC and someone else hears "ZC" meaning another ZC. No say say whichy ZC = get swift kicky in nuts! Again, be SPECIFIC people!!! Do you mean 1g, 2g, later g? Dohc or sohc? Carbed or mpfi? Vacuum advance or electronic advance? Vtec or non-vtec? The toe of my boot is waiting.

 

The A1 will not bolt into a 4g Civic/2g CRX. It will bolt directly into a 1G CRX/3G Civic though. So for the EF guys, it is useless, but for the pre-'88 guys, its a pretty good upgrade if you don't want to go all out for the B series swap.

Overall, the ZC is better than the A1 as far as performance; the numbers don't lie bizzo. Also, being that most people in this forum use fuel injection, vacuum advance and dual carbs don't really matter to 'us'. Usually when people talk about a ZC, its the JDM/EDM DOHC 1.6; PM7 engine.

If you want to be SPECIFIC, then other than the basic engine design, the ZC and A1 are different. ZC has bigger ports, stronger rods, more (than some years of the A1) compression, bigger cams, better computer, etc...

You seem to know a lot about ZCs, so tell me if there is a VTEC ZC. I have always thought/heard that ZC was pre '92. D series VTEC wasn't until 92. There was never a DOHC VTEC ZC. I have heard that there is a JDM ~ to the Z6, but it is not a ZC motor! Everyone tries to argue that there are ZC VTEC SOHC motors, but they just send me links to suppliers that don't know any more than they do.

 

Well just keep that boot waiting, nobody wants to attend right shoe U anytime soon.
As for the missinformation, I figure it's not always gonna be perfect and for me what turned me from buying the motor is the fact that it doesn't bolt directly into my 2g crx and only has 118hp instead of 130. But now that I have that out of the way Another question??? If I had a D16a1 block then would my DOHC 2g head bolt up to that and would it lose power or be around the same? I keep seeing these blocks for sale but don't want to pick them up because they aren't what I want.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by I8ayellowcrayon &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
You seem to know a lot about ZCs, so tell me if there is a VTEC ZC. I have always thought/heard that ZC was pre '92. D series VTEC wasn't until 92. There was never a DOHC VTEC ZC. I have heard that there is a JDM ~ to the Z6, but it is not a ZC motor! Everyone tries to argue that there are ZC VTEC SOHC motors, but they just send me links to suppliers that don't know any more than they do.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The "term" ZC is a generic one, sort of a catch-all. Honda uses it to designate, ANY D series, inline 4 cyl engine, which displaces 1.6litres, sold ANYWHERE in ASIA. The catch is engines designated "ZC" were only SOLD in ASIA. Not North America or Europe. For what reasons they're ALL called "ZC", or why only asia, I'm not sure. So any D series 1.6litre that was at one time or another sold in ASIA, was designated a "ZC". The variations include, Carbed- SOHC/DOHC and MPFI-SOHC and DOHC And I have heard they're were SOHC VTEC as well. The only configuration the ZC was NOT made in was DOHC VTEC.
And the ZC's did NOT dissapear with the '92's. I believe in some asian countries they might still make them, like Malaysia as an example.

 

Well I figured out the whole search thing!!!! I just can't use AOL to go to websites!!!! I HATE AOL AND 56k!!!!!!! Just have to use Msn explorer.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tjbizzo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">OK, if no one else is gonna do it, I'll step up to the plate and correct him.


Hmm... I wonder why nobody else did?

WHOA there jake! Who is Jake? And does he still have any nuts after you've gotten done with him? It might not be the best for you 2g CRX/4g CIVIC guys, but from my EW4 perspective, it has MANY good qualities and is quite the upgrade.

What forum is this?


Right here is where you need a swift kick in the nuts. Can everyone please stop posting misiniformation? The D16A1 is almost EXACTLY like the 1g ZC.
Yep. It's exactly like it alright :*******: It's got 17 less rated ps, the damn thing has a horrid porting pattern, the block castings are different, and just about everything else on the motor is inferior... but ok.

And, the 2g dohc ZC head will only bolt onto a D16A1 block and NOT onto any 88+ d-series. That's because it's the only ******* one that's DOHC... hmmm... The D15 is a D series, so is the D13! That's like saying there's no difference there.Oh, did you mean a different ZC? Nope. DOHC 88-91 Black Top. The one that looks like an A1... but is obciously NOT. Well you didn't say that did you. No... he said that it was a black top. C0mPr3H3nZ10n 0wNz j00!This is how so many people get confused reading these boards, when someone says "ZC" meaning one ZC and someone else hears "ZC" meaning another ZC. No say say whichy ZC = get swift kicky in nuts! He said it in the first post. You = Dumbass Swift Nut Kickcer. Again, be SPECIFIC people!!! Do you mean 1g, 2g, later g? Dohc or sohc? Carbed or mpfi? Vacuum advance or electronic advance? Vtec or non-vtec? The toe of my boot is waiting.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I'm confused by your nut-kicking fetish. We're trying to explain something simply to this poor guy. If he would have bought the A1, he would have had a useless motor.

 

Yep, that is correct sir. Exactly what I said.


I completely agree, however for the 1g CRX/3g Civic people there is a much bigger difference between the EW and the D16A1 than there is between the D16A1 and the 1g ZC, i.e. much better power/$. I'm still not sure if the 1g ZC is 120hp or 130 hp because I keep hearing both?!? Also, D16A1s are plentiful and dirt cheap here in the US whereas 1g ZCs...well, maybe hard to find and not cheap (relatively speaking).


True this is more of a 2g CRXR/4g Civic forum but I wanted to give some respect to ALL of the pre-92 Civics/CRXs since this is our forum too. It's not the "88-91" Civic/CRX forum, it's the "pre-92" Civic/CRX forum. Granted there are more 88-91 owners here but it is not like the 84-87 models are extinct. Vacuum advance DOES really matter to "US", and by US I mean all 84-87 Civics/CRXs and 86-87 Tegs.


This is exactly what I am talking about! There is no "usually" when talking about ZCs. You might know what YOU "usually" mean but the noobs don't know that and people browsing from other forums and other boards looking for info don't know that! C'mon people, it doesn't take much effort or time to type a few extra letters to say EXACTLY what you mean. Don't be so damned lazy! Also, when talking about the ZC many people mean the sohc ZC. Sorry, I didn't mean to **** anyone off or to come across as an *******, but damn it I hate it when misinformation spreads like a cancer because people are too lazy to type a few letters! How many people do you think have bought the wrong engine because what they read was wrong?


Well, yes, but my point was that they are similar enough to be able to swap almost every engine part with each other, which is something that the 1g ZC can't do with 88+ d-series and the other ZCs. BTW the 86-87 D16A1 has the strongest rods of any d-series.


Yes, there is supposed to be a later sohc vtec ZC similar to the D16Z6.


Some were pre-92, some were 92+, I'm not sure what years each different ZC series began and ended.


I have also heard that dohc vtec ZC is the only configuration that it never came in.


See the above comment and the links below.

http://www.honda-acura.net/for...36075
198702ed0f1027c469fcfb&threadid=81961&highlight=%2 AZC%2A
http://www.vtec.net/articles/v...=7367
http://www.redpepperracing.com...=5899
http://asia.vtec.net/specs/daintegra/
http://www.naganojapanese.com/jdmhondaspecs.html
http://www.cr-x.org/home/whatwhy/15xwhatwhy.html
http://hometown.aol.com/nosajuf/nosajuf2.htm
http://resource.crx.org/module...19873
http://www.hasport.com/News/Ar...r.htm
http://dmoore.com/crx/zc.htm
http://www.geocities.com/teamp....html
http://www.geocities.com/teamp...c.htm
http://hometown.aol.com/nosajuf/nosajufa.htm
http://www.redpepperracing.com...=6170
http://www.d-series.org/viewtopic.php?t=236
http://www.redpepperracing.com...63&hl=

Also, googly google "vtec zc" and you might find more.

Yes, that is what I have heard, that a 2g dohc ZC head will bolt onto a D16A1 block, although I have never done it myself. As far as losing power, you might lose some due to lower compression (I have no idea how much compression would increase or decrease) but since most of the power is gained in the head/cams/ports/IM/ecu, I would think that you would come out much closer to the ZC than to the D16A1.


Yes, mostly correct except that "ZC" referred to the top engine available in its family at that time, so I believe there were other JDM 1.6l d-series called something besides "ZC". I *could* be wrong about this but that is what I've heard.

 

"Jake" is anyone who disses the D16A1. It has more power (118hp) than many of the d-series in 88+ Civics/CRXs, and it certainly has more potential and a stronger bottom end than many of them too.


It said "pre-92" the last time I looked.


I guess it depends on which rating I've heard is correct. If it's 120hp, then that 2-7hp is not a huge difference. If it's 130hp, then that 12-17hp is much bigger.

"horrid porting pattern"?!? What on earth are you talking about?

"block castings are different"?!? They are virtually the same except one has "D16A1" stamped on it and the other has "ZC". How are they different?

"and just about everything else on the motor is inferior... "?!? It makes less power because it is tuned for American gas, but what is *inferior* on it?


Um...are you trying to make a point there or something? My comment was in response to you saying "the A1 is nothing like the ZC" when it is very much like a 1g dohc ZC and can swap heads and share many parts with a 2g dohc ZC, things that the sohc ZCs and later d-series can't do. OK, they can share *some* parts, but not more than the D16A1 can.


He said it was a dohc black top but if you go back and read the thread you'll see that no one ever said it was an 88-91 dohc black top so how could anyone have known that? There are two dohc black top ZCs, one that bolts to D16A1 trannys and one that bolts to 88-91 d-series trannys. If you knew this you sure didn't say it earlier so why would you make the above comment? If you didn't know this then who is C0mPr3H3nZ10n 0wN1Ng?


No, he didn't. He said, verbatim "What is the differences between the D16a1 and the ZC?" My point was that you can't just say "ZC". He has to either say which ZC or we have to explain the differences in all the various ZCs and ask "which one do you have?" ZC is meaningless without saying WHICH ZC!


OK, if you don't enjoy a good nut kicking, then how about a nun giving you a good rap on the nuckles with a yardstick? Yes, we are trying to bring clarity here, and every time you or someone else says only "ZC" it muddies the water again. Do you get it yet? DO YOU?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tjbizzo &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
Yes, mostly correct except that "ZC" referred to the top engine available in its family at that time, so I believe there were other JDM 1.6l d-series called something besides "ZC". I *could* be wrong about this but that is what I've heard.
</TD></TR></TABLE>
Why would you assume the above to be correct?
I've never seen it written anywhere that the designation, "ZC" was commiserate with a "top of the line engine" indicator. What about cars that had B series engine availibity? Integras? And Si-R's? Wouldn't the "B" engine be considered "top of the line"? And why then weren't the "B" engines labeled "ZC"?
And, I've also never heard of a JDM "D16"; only JDM "D15's". It' seems ALL "D16" originate from somewhere OTHER than ASIA. Europe or N. America for example. But you may well be correct on that one. Only time will tell.

 

anyways...after 1200 quotes and info....dont do the trade.....

 

Yeah I decided that after like the second post. Oh and Vash how did you know that I was poor?