I picked up some (4) Pirelli P4000s and 2 of them have had a hole plugged (heard plugging is different from patching?).

The original size of the hole is about the size of a BB (BB as in pellets for BB guns).

The hole has been plugged but I'm wondering if there will be any problems if I use them on a 2 mile track and at autocrosses.


I am a novice driver (read: 1 school, 1 open lap day). Assuming that high speed braking causes significant stress/load on tires, the highest speed that I have braked from is ~110mph and I don't think I will be braking from much higher speeds.

Do you think these will be able to stand a driving school and a few autocrosses? As long as they don't blow up or depressurize suddenly mid-turn...

Here is a picture of the plugged up puncture (match for size comparison)


Here is a picture of the plugging on the inside of the tire.

 

you should do a search... i know there are topics on this, because i asked once... basically if you have doubts, go ahead and buy a new tire... that piece of mind might be worth it alone. however, i used a plugged and patched tire at summit point in nov and it held up fine. i've got a plugged and patched tire on the STi right now and feel very confident that i'll be able to use it during autocrosses.

in the first 6 years that i've been driving, i've gotten 1 flat tire from a nail... since i've moved to charlottesville 1.5 years ago, i've gotten 3 nails stuck in 3 different tires.... what a crappy place to live!

-brian

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Maengelito &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">you should do a search... i know there are topics on this, because i asked once...
-brian</TD></TR></TABLE>
Thanks Brian! I should've known that

EDIT: after searching "plug" and "patch" in recent & archive threads, I only came up with this
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=124202

Any other terms/words I can search under to yield more results???


Modified by REFLUX at 6:15 PM 1/12/2004

 

according to NASA's website, under "getting your car ready for HPDE"



WHEELS & TIRES – The wheels should be round without any dents or damage to the mounting surface. The tires should be in good condition. The tread should be above the wear bars. No cords or belts should show. Flat tires repaired with plugs should not be used as these could fail under the high stress of track conditions. Hubcaps or beauty rings should be removed. They can come off causing a dangerous situation for you & other students.

Here's the link: http://www.nasaproracing.com/hpde/preparing.html

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 743 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">according to NASA's website, under "getting your car ready for HPDE"



WHEELS & TIRES – The wheels should be round without any dents or damage to the mounting surface. The tires should be in good condition. The tread should be above the wear bars. No cords or belts should show. Flat tires repaired with plugs should not be used as these could fail under the high stress of track conditions. Hubcaps or beauty rings should be removed. They can come off causing a dangerous situation for you & other students.

Here's the link: http://www.nasaproracing.com/hpde/preparing.html</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well, I guess that question's been answered, but I never had a problem when autocrossing or driving down the backroads at 150mph, I had a puncture in my Kumho Ecsta supras, and had it patched... the patching job looked like a three year old's work, but it never leaked any air, or had any problems whatsoever. I also drove on those tires like that for about a year and a half.

 

Looks from the pictures like you have both a plug AND a patch on that hole. I've used tires with both without a problem. I doubt I'd trust just one type though. You do both, then you have a "backup" should one come loose.

If you do run them, check them periodically to be sure they still look sound.

 

thanks for the input guys

I'm going to play it safe and not run them on the track

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by REFLUX &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">thanks for the input guys

I'm going to play it safe and not run them on the track </TD></TR></TABLE>
That's what I would suggest. There is always that possibility of a failure, and you don't want to blow a tire at 110mph and risk your life/body/car, or at the very least your $300 HPDE day.

Sears refused to plug a hole in my street-driven Azenis last year because it was a speed-rated tire. They claimed they won't plug a speed-rated tire because of the liability -- i.e., they don't want to be liable for any stunnas who wreck while doing street racing or "mountain run" jackassery, and blame it on the tire plug.

 

[QUOTE=r2x]Looks from the pictures like you have both a plug AND a patch on that hole. I've used tires with both without a problem. QUOTE]

Before I did shocks, I was in the tire business. You have what is known as a "plug patch" as opposed to a "plug" (a doubled over piece of rope or rubber cord) or a "patch" (inside stuck on piece of flat rubber). Plug patches serve the duty of both and are the only way that I will allow my street tires to be repaired. From the outside, one easy way to tell is to see if there are two strands of repair material sticking out of the tread (plug) or just one strand (plug patch). Plugs are made to get you to the nearest place to buy a new tire.

The comment about any repair to a speed rated tire is correct, once the carcass has been compromised then all bets are off. If you can before the event, I would get some more tires as I would not want to start an event on these. It wil take more carcass motion to dislodge a plug patch but still it is a question mark.

On the otherhand, if you are at an event and get a hole that can be plug patched safely (not too close to the shoulder), then they can be a decent way of getting you through the rest of the weekend. With that plug patch, I'd have no real concern for normal street use but taking them to the track like this is not the best idea.

 

i have used plugged tires for autocross many, many times. however, i'd never use one for a track event. a blowout at 40mph is quite different and less likely than a blowout at 140mph.