What would be better in order to build an all motor Prelude, without forced induction..... a base prelude or an SH? Thanks!

 

Either would be fine but I would choose the base cause it's cheaper to start with. Then in the process of doing all the engine work you could put in an LSD and make it handle just as well if not better than an SH.

Gabe

 

Yeap, what Gabe said

 

You might consider the lighter 4th gen Lude too.

 

lighter, and more powerful.

 

Not to mention better looking too...

 

A-MEN......

 

Yeah, and you can play cards on the dash...

 

Best would be a 1992-1995 Prelude VTEC. Without a doubt.

the Prelude SH is the worst motor Honda has made (of their performance motors) int he 1990's. The drivetrain loss of HP on the SH is just rediculous. They Dyno at the wheels a good 10 HP behind a 1992-1995 motor. And the SH is WAY heavier. Plus you can only use SH trannies, with SH blocks...

Does it sound like a nightmare yet?

If you are not scared yet, I will make a scary face. That will scare you.

haha.

Good luck man.

Jeff

 

we had few peopel in our lude group go to dyno ...
and all the SH cars jsut felt short up to 15HP at the wheels less than the other 5th gen without ATTS

if are going for a drag/street car..
i think that 4th gen would be good ..

but if u are going for a race car..
get a 5th gen..
the 50% stiffer body on roll and such will help a lot
the real diff of weight between the 5thg and 4th is like 20-40lbs ..so
do not worry at all about that..

+ the dash of the 4th gen is just plain ugly hahahaah ( )
not honda at all

the engine is basivly the same..and now u can use obd1 converter and build up the enigne of 5th gen just as much as the older one so ..
have fun

 

Ease up on the SH man. The large drive train loss on the SH is a myth. When in a straight line the ATTS clutches are disengaged leaving an open differential just like the base. When NTPOG did a dyno day my SH actually had more hp then the equivalently modified base models. http://www.ntpog.org/dyno/index.shtml
BTW my SH weighed 2930 stock and my friends base weighed 2900 so the SH is not WAY heavier.

 

You may be right. I only posted from my experience.

I have dyno'd 3.

All at 155 HP at the wheels.

Sorry if I came arouns wrong way, I was just trying to rec. WHat I know is working.

Sorry.

Jeff

 

RCR,

Where have you been!?

I agree that the base model is the better of the two when its a 5th gen.

If given a choice though, I would build a 93-95 4th gen. VTEC. OBDI and weight.


[Modified by VeeTec, 9:47 PM 9/9/2001]

 

You said something about the 4th gen being more powerful??? How much did it have? As far as the fifth gen being stiffer... Hmm.... cornering is kinda important to me... Thanks for all the help by the way.

 

5th gen being "50%" better on body roll? Somehow I doubt that. That would mean a 4th gen would have to handle like a ******* SUV.

And no one can doubt the power advantages of the 4th gen over the 5th. We have 3 or 4 members in 4th gens that STOCK could pull high 14's without stripping. I've yet to see a 5th gen do that.

Plus, the motors are NOT "basically the same." I consider the open deck as opposed to the closed deck a major difference.

 

there are several people who have pulled high 14s in a stock 5th gen. it takes a good driver. honda claimed that the 5th gen was 50% STIFFER, not "50% better on body roll."

and to get back to all the crap above, the best stock 1/4 mile time i've seen for ANY prelude was for a 5th gen SH. they do *not* have 15hp less at the wheels. maybe 2 or 3, maybe none, nobody really knows because the only way to know for sure would be to dyno a base, then swap the ECU, add the SH tranny, etc, and then dyno it again. the variation between motors is greater than whatever the difference may or may not be between a base and an SH.

as for the bs about it being "a lot heavier," the atts unit weighs 44 pounds. the rest of the weight is the spoiler and a few suspension bits and pieces - total of 88 pounds, or less than the weight of a tank of gas. finally, the 4th gen vtec prelude weighs within 25 pounds of the 5th gen base.

 

What was the rated hp of a 4th gen vtec vs. a 5th gen SH?

 

4th gen vtec was rated at 190.
5th gen (base and sh) were rated at 195 and then 200 after 1998 (incl 1998?) due to (we think) a different header design.

 

hey hey ... 50% better on ROLL STIFNESS
common... like the car with almost the same suspension and weight would be 50% better on roll

 

Todd's biased, don't listen to him!
5th Gen SH all the way!

 

50% "stiffer" structural rigidity, resistance to flexing, torsion, and stuff.

 

To hell with it... my car is the fastest N/A thing in here... I'm sticking with my original answer...

Oh, and Honda saying that the "newer is better" is crap. We all know they underrated the 93-95 H22A1's... and they HAVE to say the newer model is better (50% anything) even if it isnt true. Cause who the hell's gonna buy a car when they say:
"It's a great car, not as good as last years, but still a nice car."

It's called marketing.

 

hee hee

it may be that honda either underrated the 4th gen vtec slightly, or overrated the 5th gen slightly. however, i've yet to see a dyno of stock 4th gen. comparing a 165hp dyno from a 5th gen with I/H/E to a 170hp dyno from a 4th gen with I/H/E doesn't mean much, except that the 5th responds to those kinds of modifications VERY poorly (which is true for sure!)

as for the marketing, it would be very hard to argue that for 99.5% of the people out there the 5th gen is not at least as good a car as the 4th gen. aesthetics aside (that's just personal preference), the car *does* handle better (drive them back to back, stock, or just read any of the myriad reviews out there from the debut), and straight line performance is essentially the same.

but to go back to the question - if i were going for an all out all motor buildup (or an all out FI build for that matter) i'd get a base. the SH is a better buy for those who are planning to only moderately modify their cars, and it looks a hell of lot better out the door.

 

Like Car and Driver said, each manufacturer claims each new chassis is xx% more structurally ridged than the previous, meaning the first generations must've been made of jello.

 

what was the name of those cars (east german?) that were made of cardboard? they were literally some type of very heavy duty paper product. trabant?