RECAP
Had a great weekend, Gerald Chan was an amazing instructor, gave me tons of feedback. Worked on trail braking and throttle modulation to rotate the car around, both very cool techniques. Had my first off-track experience as I locked 'em up coming in to 5. Without thinking about it I straightened the wheel out and headed straight in to the infield, instructor was very happy with my reaction. I also found during my solo session that talking yourself around the track (out loud) really help you remember things and keeps your mind off the minute details, allowing you to concentrate more on the whole picture. Slow in fast out brought on a whole new meaning as my instructor had me braking HARD before 10. I was able to get on the gas way before the apex and exit with tons of speed. Highlight of my weekend (other than the off) would have to have been hanging with a Z06 during my solo session, very cool stuff considering he has 3 times the power The catering was damn good Saturday night as well!

THE CAR
The new shocks since my last event worked miracles, difference was night and day. Car definately still needs a braking upgrade (got some XPs off Larry but the drums in rear and small rotors up front weren't liking me), some new tires (Kumho Ecsta 711s SUCK! But I guess I can't complain for $35/ea), a roll-bar, and a rear sway. I also plan on getting a neck-support, gloves, and shoes by February. Anyone have a money tree I can sit under til then?

SUSPENSION ISSUE
Under heavy braking into 5 I was hearing a popping noise from my front-left. My instructor said it sounds like the suspension binding, could it have been anything else? I assume this means I'll need new bushings? Is there an easy way to find out exactly which one it is that's binding? It didn't unsettle the car, it was just sounding really ugly.

The Ultimates were fine for my 1st event, I was dumb to think I'd be able to get away with using them again this time. Ater my 1st time out I had no brakes and the pads looked like below. Thank god Larry brought a few extra sets and had the pads for my car.








Modified by JMU1337 at 11:24 PM 11/2/2003

 

Wait a minute.

Were you in my group? (HPDE2)

I had a nice little exchange (from my POV, at least) with a white Civic hatch that was moving pretty well. I passed it to start the session, then I let it by, then I got past it again. Was that you?

 

That was me. I got ya Saturday but you picked up some speed Sunday and were able to get back by me, good stuff

 

the noise might just be the bodywork rubbing on the tires. you might have plenty of clearance in normal situations but braking into T5 you have extreme dive, at least if you are doing it right.

everyone knows you enter T5 from the left edge of the track, correct? there seemed to be a lot of confusion about this in hpde 1 & 2 this weekend.

joel

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JoelG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
everyone knows you enter T5 from the left edge of the track, correct? there seemed to be a lot of confusion about this in hpde 1 & 2 this weekend.

joel
</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was playing around with differnt lines into 5 in the Solo group I found that If I started at the right then and turned in I would carry more speed, but I would have to lift or brae for turn 6 or 7. If I was all the way to the left I did not lift Unil I shifted to third between 6 and 7.

 

there is confusion because not every instructor teaches the same line into 5, and Dan U. tells the students to just do what the instructor says...
Ultimately, I think everybody should try it both ways and see the differences for themselves...

 

In a production based car, you cannot go full throttle down The Chute and have time to get to track right for the entry to T5. Because T5 is so slow, you throw away the entry in order to maximize speed down The Chute.

This varies from "The Textbook Line", which would have you exit The Chute and pull to track right for entry to T5. Instructors who are not familiar with Summit Point would not know this. More than likely, you would only learn this non-standard line if you were racing or instructed by a racer.

Some lightweight purpose builts have neough tire and/or aero to get back to track right.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SJR &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">there is confusion because not every instructor teaches the same line into 5, and Dan U. tells the students to just do what the instructor says...
Ultimately, I think everybody should try it both ways and see the differences for themselves...</TD></TR></TABLE>

I was wondering about that since people were everywhere in HPDE1/2 when I was at Summit this year. Sort of thought that it was basically crazy (or unpossible) to go to the right before T5 if you carry enough speed down the chute/T4. I can imagine wanting to go right if you're trying to pass someone and compromise T4 a bit but with a banzai/clear track type run (no brake and confidence lift/flat footing it), I can't see how it's going to be "safe" to go right (enough time to straighten out the car and brake).

Track n00b here.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Solracer &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

I was playing around with differnt lines into 5 in the Solo group I found that If I started at the right then and turned in I would carry more speed, but I would have to lift or brae for turn 6 or 7. If I was all the way to the left I did not lift Unil I shifted to third between 6 and 7.</TD></TR></TABLE>

if you can enter T5 from the right you are going too slow in T4, unless you have mad downforce. think formula atlantic

you should be able to enter T5 from the left and still need to brake for 6a, except maybe in an ITC car. unwind the wheel as you track thru T5. try not to scrub speed

joel

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by thk &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I was wondering about that since people were everywhere in HPDE1/2 </TD></TR></TABLE>

yeah, that's why I posted that. It was clear to me that people were getting all kinds of bad advice regarding that turn.

the turn-in, apex and track-out markers (yellow E, A and Es) were repainted last week. there shouldn't have been any confusion about where they are

joel

 

I'm always on the left side coming in to 5, like Joel said there's no way I could brake and get to the right. I also trail brake 6 and dive in early which pushes me out nicely on to the strips heading to 7. I'd like to try taking 5 from the right side but there really is no way I could get over there given my speed through the chute. I found a lot of the people taking 5 outside were braking or just generally going incredibly slow though the chute, that really sucked for me as my closing speed would be incredibly high on such people.

I'll take a look at the possible rubbing, although it just happened to me on the street also

 

I've found that coming in from the right for T5 doesn't let my car settle down enough for The Carousel. Too much speed, can't brake in a straight line for the turn, upsets the balance through T6. For me at least, I've gotten the best results from barely touching apex on T4, which puts me on the left side for T5, heading straight. This lets me come out of T5 fast enough to keep my momentum up, but not too fast that I have to brake a lot for T6.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JoelG &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
if you can enter T5 from the right you are going too slow in T4, unless you have mad downforce. think formula atlantic

you should be able to enter T5 from the left and still need to brake for 6a, except maybe in an ITC car. unwind the wheel as you track thru T5. try not to scrub speed

joel

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Well the Del Sol Si is not classed in ITC, however with street tires a 139000 miles on the motor and a whopping 110 whp it aint Far off, however, When I was able to get left it was usually when I was slow through 4 or was slow out of 3...

But even when I was fast into 5 I was able to keep my foot the the floor all the way to 6 7 before shifting.. which was fun I even gained a few car lengths on Grumpy in is SS camro and even more on some higher horsepower cars hehehe

 

[QUOTE=JMU1337Under heavy braking into 5 I was hearing a popping noise from my front-left. [/QUOTE]


hi.

mines been popping loudly under heavy braking for the last 2 to 3 years or so. i check underneath frequently for broken/loose bolts, etc. everything seems tight. i just figure it is because the suspension/bushings/shocks/shockmounts are worn out....

really doesn't bother me too much. just drive thru it!

todd

ps its really loud at times; similiar to a .22 Hornet round going off about 3 inches from your left ear!

 

yep, thats the noise! like i said it didn't unsettle the car at all, just scared me the 1st few time it happened. thanks for the heads up!

 

Mike, I have a question.

Was your instructor a very animated guy?

I'm asking because during the second session on Sunday, I passed you early on, but I overdrove the car so much that you caught up pretty quickly. For a few laps, I kept you far enough away so that I didn't feel a point-by was necessary, but I noticed your instructor going bonkers in the passenger's seat.

It looked like he was angry about something, so I waved you guys by. I ended up getting by again right after we were both chasing that Miata, but I was wondering if he was mad about not getting the signal as early as he might have liked.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Ross Rapoport &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Mike, I have a question.

Was your instructor a very animated guy?
</TD></TR></TABLE>

LOL!

that would be a good way to describe gerald chan. you ought to see him after a race. he's twice as "animated"

he's my #1 homie, though

joel

 

lol, joel's answer is about right. he's just a very excited person

yeah he was starting to get annoyed with the people that i'd catch easily 3-10 and then they'd just outpower me down the straight. it did get annoying, but no you weren't doing it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JMU1337 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote"> it did get annoying, but no you weren't doing it.</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's what I wanted to hear. Thanks, and nice driving out there.