I wanna know if I can expect better performance with an aftermarket clutch on a lude with no FI? Will that do any difference?

 

only if your clutch old clutch is slipping.

It will make the launch feel much nicer and shifts will feel stronger. It also depends on the aftermarket clutch...some are good and some arent.

 

does anyone has some comparison numbers? Like 1/4 mile or something?

 

if you're getting a new clutch think about getting a flywheel at the same time, you will notice a bigger difference with a lighter flywheel rather than a new clutch. I plan on just getting an OEM exedy clutch off ebay and a fidanza or JUN flywheel.

 

A clutch simply transfers power from the engine to the ground

If the clutch is weak and cant handle the horsepower the engine makes, the clutch cant 'hang on' and will 'slip'

discussing differences in 1/4 times is irrelevant

 

ok i may sound like a retard here, maybe someone can back me up or i just might be plain wrong, what nick said is 100 true its only for tranfering the power to the tranny to put it to the gorund , but would the fly wheel be considered part of the clutch? becaseu if you get a lightened flywheel you theoreticaly (i may be wrong) reduce the amount of HP lost through the drive train as the drivetrain is the reason we have bhp and whp because there is a loss from the crank to the wheels, (hp at the crank and hp at the wheels) .. would a lightened flywheel then reduce the amount of hp loss (however little) thru the drive train do to the cut in weight?

 

hmm my friend got an aftermarket clutch on his GSR and his car is definitely much faster. It enables quicker shifts and engages with a definite thud, and he can now chirp 2nd to 3rd, which i've never been able to do with my OEM. it's not as streetable though, as it's hard as hell to depress the pedal...

 

what kind of a clutch your friend is using?

 

I am not sure about the hp you would gain from a flywheel if any, but I do know that a lightned flywheel does *** some torque lost in the transmission.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bad-monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm my friend got an aftermarket clutch on his GSR and his car is definitely much faster....</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is an examle of speading miss-information on the Internet.

A 50K mile clutch and a clutch with 600 miles on it will not yield any noticeable gains, if any at all. A worn out clutch and a new clutch will show some gains depending on how badly the old clutch slips. However, these gains are not ACTUAL gains. They are gains that are basically getting you back to what the car should be at.

And the reason why your friend is able to chirp the gears now is because the clutch is grabbing the flywheel with more pressure. The car will chirp it's gears if the clutch grabs hard and the RPMs of the engine are higher than what the engine should be spinng at when in the next gear. If your friend doesn't use his car mainly for racing or doesn't have a high horesepower car...I would say he wasted his money on that clutch.

An aftermarket clutch is only necessary if your engines horsepower is so great that it cannot keep from slipping. NA cars really shouldn't need an aftermarket clutch. The OEM clutch has enough pressure to keep from slipping, particularly if the car is used for daily driving.

Just because it is aftermarket...it does not mean it will give you more horsepower or make you faster.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by btlfed1 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am not sure about the hp you would gain from a flywheel if any, but I do know that a lightned flywheel does *** some torque lost in the transmission.</TD></TR></TABLE>

There will not be ANY HP gains!!

An aftermarket flywheel is good if you want to reduce some weight on your car and if you want to make shifting smoother if you are racing.

A lighter flywheel loses inertia faster than an OEM flywheel. Basically, the flywheel will not keep it momentum as long as a heavier flywheel. The lighter flywheel will cause the engine to drop it's RPMs faster than a heavier one.

Ideally, you want your car to drops it rpms enough so that when you shift gears...there should not be any jerking of the car (RPMs drop down to where they should be when you shift into the next gear). Too light of a flywheel makes shifting A LOT harder because the RPMs rise and fall MUCH quicker.

A lighter flywheel is best if you autoX mainly. The engines RPMs will raise and fall quicker so short sprints will be a little faster. This will allow for greater engine compression braking.

Heavier flywheels are better for dragracing because you can use the inertia to you advantage to help you move forward.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by AndyD &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

This is an examle of speading miss-information on the Internet.

A 50K mile clutch and a clutch with 600 miles on it will not yield any noticeable gains, if any at all. A worn out clutch and a new clutch will show some gains depending on how badly the old clutch slips. However, these gains are not ACTUAL gains. They are gains that are basically getting you back to what the car should be at.

And the reason why your friend is able to chirp the gears now is because the clutch is grabbing the flywheel with more pressure. The car will chirp it's gears if the clutch grabs hard and the RPMs of the engine are higher than what the engine should be spinng at when in the next gear. If your friend doesn't use his car mainly for racing or doesn't have a high horesepower car...I would say he wasted his money on that clutch.

An aftermarket clutch is only necessary if your engines horsepower is so great that it cannot keep from slipping. NA cars really shouldn't need an aftermarket clutch. The OEM clutch has enough pressure to keep from slipping, particularly if the car is used for daily driving.

Just because it is aftermarket...it does not mean it will give you more horsepower or make you faster. </TD></TR></TABLE>


This is bad news for me, i just bought a 6 puck clutch and a HD pressure plate for my b16a. THe engine is stock for now, i plan on I/H/E and CTR cams.

It's funny, a friend and I were having this disussion about a week ago about my clutch that I bought. He was telling me it wasn't going to make my car any faster. I knew it wouldn't increase power but i thought it would make me faster because I would be able to grab gears harder and faster.

Anyway, learn something new every day, I'll keep it though, they stock clutch will get worn out eventually.

 

good info, but even though a clutch doesn't add hp, it's fair to say that in his situation it made his car faster. (90,000 miles and ready for a replacement, never noticed how bad his OEM was slipping).

also, if one were able to engage/disengage a clutch quicker wouldn't it make your drivetrain more efficient? sure it's not adding hp, but in terms of shifting it'd speed up the process so long as your hands could keep up, right?

he enjoys his clutch, i find it to be a little bit of overkill, but the car feels entirely different. ultimately that was my point despite my stumbling efforts upon trying to reach that point...

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bad-monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...and his car is definitely feels much faster...</TD></TR></TABLE>

That's the key word here...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bad-monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">...and he can now chirp 2nd to 3rd...</TD></TR></TABLE>

And you think that's good for your tranny?!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by SiRWanabe &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


It's funny, a friend and I were having this disussion about a week ago about my clutch that I bought. He was telling me it wasn't going to make my car any faster. I knew it wouldn't increase power but i thought it would make me faster because I would be able to grab gears harder and faster.

</TD></TR></TABLE>

Not sure if you read my replies to posts about big brake kits. If you haven't here is the Cliff's Notes..I am not a fan of them. LOL

Same rule applies. Your car will only be as fast as the weakest part. Throwing on OVERKILL parts will not be beneficial. In fact...it will be worse...it creates overconfidence.

On your car..the aftermarket clutch was an overkill. OEM is sufficient. Based on the HP you are putting out...the OEM clutch and the aftermarket one you bought should perform EXACTLY the same...friction wise. Shifting the gears will be a little more harsh now....so the driving experience should be different. Good or bad I guess depends on you.

Good luck with it.

All I can say is that we need to be better consumers. Don't fall for the HYPED parts. They are just a waste of money. I fell for "buy all the mods you can...it will make your car faster/better" hype. Fortuantely, I didn't spend my money before it was too late. Then I realized that most people like to buy parts just so that they can put it in their sigs.

I am just trying to spread the VERY LIMITED knowledge I have to help others realize that aftermarket does NOT always mean better.

 

all i have to say is a i can't launch mine at the track now.... haven't quite figured it out (and have been doing alot more Auto-X'ing than dragging anymore)

 

well shifting WOT and missing shifts isn't good for trannies but sometimes we do it anyway. (on purpose or by accident)

driving your car at the edge whether it's dragging or running from the cops probably isn't "good" for your car, but isn't that why we're all here?

like i said in my 2nd post, i think it's overkill esp if your OEM is still good, but i can see how it would benefit timed driving. maybe not in terms of engine related physics, but it does make a difference. better worse who's to say.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Odessa &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I wanna know if I can expect better performance with an aftermarket clutch on a lude with no FI? Will that do any difference?</TD></TR></TABLE>

do broken axles count?

 

Only thing aftermarket clutches do is hold extra power and torgue.There are alot of companies making big claims about thier clutches, stick with oem if you are stock or close to it. Quarter mile times are irrelevant as it comes down to driver skill.

 

ok andy, you make alot of good points, i still would like to see a dyno of a car w/out a lightened flywheel and then of one with, just my method of thinking in alot of people "claim" gains when removing the balancer shaft and there have been dynos to prove it. along with this the flywheel is a huge chung of metal that the engine has to get moving.

i was just thinking if removing something that has to be spun by the engine at the crank (balancer shafts) then why not the flywheel, why wouldn't that be similiar to taking out the balancer shafts, i mean i know its kinda of a stretch , but do you see the connection im trying to make.

Im not saying that its true that you will get hp from a lightened flywheel , but im saying i will wonder til prover other wise ONLY due to the fact that the crank driven balancer shafts when disables give HP acros the board, so why not another crank driven device, such as the flywheel if lightened would if give you hp?

 

ahem... looks like it makes power to me



https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=54704

 

I doubt a flywheel makes extra power, I do not believe any dyno sheets that don't have the atmospheric conditons listedl. In the time it takes to change a flywheel the atmospheric conditions change, and this a factor in engine power production. Also cars don't make the same power on a dyno every run, usaully power differs from run to run. Lightened flywheels carry less stored internia period, I thought this post was about aftermarket clutches. Why did flywheels enter the picture.

 

A quick explanation...the flywheel has inertia in it...balancer shafts do not.

The extra weight on the flywheel may take a little longer to get it moving...but once it is moving it has more energy in it.

Make any sense??

Also, I don't buy that dyno. Dyno results vary.

Bottomline...lightweight flyweels are really only good for autoXing and so that you can put it in your mod list in your signature. .

 

i thought about this last nite after i posted : its not that the car is making more hp, its just that you have the same amount of HP at the crank but more of it is getting to the wheels because HP is not used up to spin the extra weight. im not arguing that it gives you more power, just get more whp becasue you have less losses thru the drive train. i don't think that dyno is fake either but, to each his own.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by bad-monkey &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">hmm my friend got an aftermarket clutch on his GSR and his car is definitely much faster. It enables quicker shifts and engages with a definite thud, and he can now chirp 2nd to 3rd, which i've never been able to do with my OEM. it's not as streetable though, as it's hard as hell to depress the pedal...</TD></TR></TABLE>

That means hes slower. Chirping = wasted time