Hello everyone, I'm new to the board. My name is Matt and I have a 5th gen Lude Base Auto/SS transmission. Car has about 55k miles on it. I'm planning on getting a JRSC sometime in the near future and want to get some info before I jump in and start buying expensive stuff. First of all, I plan on running stock internals so I was wondering if the stock internals can hold up to a bout 5 lbs to 6 lbs of boost. Never anything more, thats my limit. This is a daily driven car, so I can't have big problems coming out of it. I plan on just running that Psi for the length that I have my car and the SC. I was quoted by a local company (found on Jacksonracing website as a dealer) that it would be around $3,800 to $4,000 for purchasing the kit and having it installed/tuned. I was wondering if this is a good price or not. I found that another site online sells the supercharger for $2,990 plus tax and shipping, so I was thinking of maybe buying the kit online then taking it over and just having it installed. In addition to the normal kit, I am getting colder spark plugs, a colder thermostat (160Degrees) and 2 Gauges for my interior (boost and Air/Fuel ratio) Does anyone know if I will need anything more to have my car run somewhat safe without having to worry about blowing up? lol. (I also heard that the Ringlands in the H22A engine are the first things to go when under boost, is there anyway to counter-act this problem?) Also, would it be a good idea to invest in a different head gasket such as Hondata Gasket for heat redution? Looking to make my car last as long as possible on this hehe. Also, can someone explain to me what the J&S Safeguard does? Someone was telling me about it, but I did not understand what they meant. It has something to do with pressure in each cylinder and keeping it so it wont go over and blow a piston/cyliner from detonation or something. Any response is helpful, need to get my ideas strait before I go through with all this. Thanks! - Matt

 

damn, no body answers on this forum =[

 

bump

 

bump agian. =\ no body will respond to me =[

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I was wondering if the stock internals can hold up to a bout 5 lbs to 6 lbs of boost.</TD></TR></TABLE>
The stock H22, with the appropriate fuel/engine management and GOOD TUNING can do just fine up to ~10 psi.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I was quoted by a local company (found on Jacksonracing website as a dealer) that it would be around $3,800 to $4,000 for purchasing the kit and having it installed/tuned. I was wondering if this is a good price or not. I found that another site online sells the supercharger for $2,990 plus tax and shipping, so I was thinking of maybe buying the kit online then taking it over and just having it installed.</TD></TR></TABLE>
Installation of the stock kit will typically cost between $600-$800, tuning will depend where you take it. Around here (SF Bay) dyno tuning typically is $150-$180 per hour.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">In addition to the normal kit, I am getting colder spark plugs, a colder thermostat (160Degrees) and 2 Gauges for my interior (boost and Air/Fuel ratio) Does anyone know if I will need anything more to have my car run somewhat safe without having to worry about blowing up?</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you want to spend more, you can improve on the kit. The stock kit for the lude is known to run dangerously lean in most cases (some have been luckier and ended up with pig rich results). Ditch the fuel management and electronics that come with the kit, get 440 cc injectors, run the stock fuel pump, and either run the afc hack with a vafc or Zip SMC (do a search), EFI PMS (www.efisystems.com), or Greddy e-manage with injector and ignition harnesses (www.greddy.com). Note that with the afc hack, you will still need something for boost timing control, such as an MSD BTM, or a J&S Safeguard.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I also heard that the Ringlands in the H22A engine are the first things to go when under boost, is there anyway to counter-act this problem?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The problem is detonation. The solution is adequate fuel delivery (of which the H22 JRSC kit is notorious for being less than adequate) and GOOD TUNING. The best way to provide the fuel you need would be to go with larger injectors and some sort of programmable electronic management, as I suggested above, and find a GOOD TUNER and have the setup TUNED ON A DYNO.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, would it be a good idea to invest in a different head gasket such as Hondata Gasket for heat redution?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The Hondata gasket is an intake manifold gasket, not a head gasket. It helps insulate the intake manifold from the head, important in a JRSC application as the intake temps get high enough as it is.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, can someone explain to me what the J&S Safeguard does?</TD></TR></TABLE>
There are mixed opinions on this site regarding the J&S. I use one on my JRSC setup. Besides being able to provide boost timing control, as I mentioned above, the J&S taps into the knock sensor signal wire and when it hears "knock" (detonation) it will retard the ignition timing to stop the detonation. It is proactive detonation prevention, and it does work. IMPO, it is a valuable commodity on an H22 JRSC setup. The J&S SHOULD NOT be installed as an alternative to GOOD TUNING. It should only be there as a last resort to stop detonation. If you were to drive around on a poorly tuned setup where the J&S was pulling timing quite often (because of detonation) you would eventually damage something, as it takes an initial onset of detonation for the J&S to work. Just one detonation event can blow a ringland on a stock piston.

You will be taking an additional risk to your tranny. The sportshift has a poor track record of holding up on a stock lude, and you will be asking it to deal with much more power. That is something you will have to weigh for yourself. I'm running a 9 psi JRSC setup on my sportshift.

You should seriously consider registering at http://www.preludeonline.com All of this information, and much more about the H22 JRSC, is available in our FI archives.

 

thanks for the reply. So u think I should just go with a different fuel/air managment system and some bigger fuel injectors? I wasn't sure weither or not I should use the stock fuel pump also... I'm not very educated on what system would work best with the JRSC, and you seem to know an extensive amount more on the JRSC set up than I do. What system do you recomment I use to manage my fuel/air ratio and timing retarding? I would only be running the stock pulley, so no 10 lbs of boost or anything, but again I am on stock internals. And I'm going to do some search for finding some Dyno tuning Around LA, need to find a place which can do it, and do it right. Also, do you suggest I get a different Gasket then? I'll try doing a search for Prelude Head Gaskets to help with heat reduction. I heard about the J&S, but now I know exactly what it is for, thanks for clearing that up. I will probably be getting that system as well, just to ensure that under any circumstance, I will atleast have somewhat of a safety feature to help if detonation does occur. And I will be registering at preludeonline very soon, thanks for the Info. Hope to hear back from you again soon! Thanks - Matt

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">So u think I should just go with a different fuel/air managment system and some bigger fuel injectors?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Yes. If you will be staying at 6 psi, then 440 cc injectors would be perfectly fine. I'm using 550s for my 9 psi setup.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I wasn't sure weither or not I should use the stock fuel pump also</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you were to run the stock JRSC management, you would use the provided Walbro pump. With large injectors the stock fuel pump is much more than adequate.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">What system do you recomment I use to manage my fuel/air ratio and timing retarding?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I would recommend Hondata, but neither you nor I can run Hondata because it is incompatible with our sportshift transmission (supposedly, but I believe it could be made to work with the proper wiring, but I won't get into all of that). I'm using the EFI PMS, http://www.efisystems.com
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Also, do you suggest I get a different Gasket then?</TD></TR></TABLE>
Headgasket? Nah. But definitely get the Hondata intake manifold gasket.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I am on stock internals.</TD></TR></TABLE>
I am, as well

Here is my current setup, you might find this useful:

9 psi JRSC
EFI Systems PMS
RCE 550 cc injectors
J&S Ultra SafeGuard V2
Tech Edge V1.5
custom CAI
Hondata IM Gasket
Kamikaze header
2.5" Car Sound cat
custom 2.5" exhaust
AEM TruPower pulleys
Mugen thermostat
Mugen thermo fan switch
Mugen radiator cap
Moroso oil catch can
Goodyear Gatorback belts
NGK R5672A-8 spark plugs
a hellofalotof street tuning

 

so is it like a proven fact that the fuel managment that comes with the kit sucks? only reason I ask if, I dont wanna go half-a$$ on this job by any means, but at the same time I do have somewhat of a budget as to what I can get at this particular time. I mean if I have to wait to ensure that my car will be safer buying a diff Fuel managment than the one that comes with the kit, then I will but I just wanna make sure. And also, the 370cc injectors are too small right? since they are supposto be used with the Walbro Pump that comes with the kit? and I'm also checking out the EFI PMS you posted about, prolly end up getting that if anything. And the Hondata Manifold gasket sounds like its good, so I'll prolly get that also. Thanks for the replys man, info is greatly appreciated. =]

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">so is it like a proven fact that the fuel managment that comes with the kit sucks?</TD></TR></TABLE>
I wouldn't put it in those words. But it is a general consensus among JRSC lude onwers that the JRSC management is inadequate. I've seen quite a few dynos with a/f numbers that give evidence that this is true.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">And also, the 370cc injectors are too small right? since they are supposto be used with the Walbro Pump that comes with the kit?</TD></TR></TABLE>
The kit does not come with injectors, it is designed to utilize the stock 290 cc injectors.
<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I'm also checking out the EFI PMS you posted about, prolly end up getting that if anything.</TD></TR></TABLE>
If you do end up getting one, message me, there will be some things you will need to know for setting it up. You will need an OBDII datalogger to assist in setting the PMS up properly.

 

Strange, almost all websites I find that sell the JRSC kit for Ludes have 370cc injectors with the kit. maybe i'm just loosing it hehe. Anyway, how much do the 440cc injectors cost? I didn't know that the kit doesn't come with them, so I'll have to check the prices to see what I can get. Also, is the Greddy E-manage system work very well? I've heard some good reports on it, but again it is designed more so for Turbo's than for Superchargers. I just wanna make sure my Fuel/Air ratio is good and my injectors can get enough fuel in to match the air. I dont wanna lean out and do some damage. =\ BTW, do you have AIM? its a lot easier to talk in real time rather than on posts at this board, if not thats ok though. Thanks

 

oops. duh, I got it mixed up with the Greddy Turbo kit which comes with 370cc injectors. stupid me. lol And btw, if I have proper fuel/air managment and the right dyno tuning, how long do you perdict my engine will last with the JRSC at the normal 6lb boost? Right now I have about 55k miles on it, and its a 98 Lude. thx!