I was just wondering if anyone has a all motors car that has a single cam in it. Cause i havea D16Z6 and i was wondering if it would be worth building and making it all motor to see what kind of numbers i could get out of it with-out forved induction or nitorus. Thnaks if anyone has this set-up and would like to share it with me i would appreciate.

 

i also have a d16z6 and am planning the all motor route. my setup as of now is just i/h/e. i have skunk2 stage 1 cam and a camgear in the mail. im also hopin to buy some new pistons(around 11 compression), ls or shotpeened z6 rods, upgraded valvesprings, possible skunk2 im and hondata for tuning. im hopin for 140 -150 whp, but im not exactly sure what im gonna wind up with. i have heard of similar z6 all motor buildups making around 150 whp. if you are looking for more than like ~160 or so whp, all motor is gonna get pretty expensive and forced induction might be a better bet.

 

wheres bisi when you need'em? hehe

 

We build all motor SOHC all the time. While most so called engine builders negelected the SOHC in the past, we continued to research and build both SOHC and DOHC.

The most effective upgrades you can do to the SOHC would be using a high compression pistons such as the A1 pistons from the 88-89 Integra or some aftermarket pistons from Arias. bumping up the compression on the SOHC to at least 12:1 is what will put the SOHC to a competitive level.
ANother important part is working on the head and cam on the SOHC. I think the SOHC needs such a good head setup to make some good power out of it. With our non-vtec setups.(D16A6), we were achieving average gains of 35-40 HP to the wheels with our headwork and camshaft along with the basic I/H/E bolt ons.

So my point is... it has a good potential to make power. It all depends on how dedicated you are to the Z6 and what type of budget you are working on.

A basic high compression Z6 setup with headwork, cam, and bottom end will be about 155hp to the wheels.. and possibly more.
On our A6 nonvtec setups.. with just headwork and stock low comp bottom end. we are getting about 130-140hp to the wheels. which were good enough for 13.6@99mph runs in an EF.
Wil





Modified by exospeedAMcrx at 9:59 AM 7/10/2003

 

would the 12:1 compression be totally streetable for daily driving on pump gas in the z6??

 

12:1 isnt that much and can go on pump gas. might have to retard the timing a bit for the street and just advance when you get to the track and have higher octance gas.

 

I have a full race D16Z6 SOHC. It is very near to being completed. I have spent two years building it, waiting for the right parts. You can check out all the spec's on my website. http://www.allmotorsohc.com. I should mention that my site has not been updated in a while and the car looks completely different.

Before I decided to build a full race motor my SOHC ran 14.1's @ 95mph.


Modified by allmotor7642 at 10:13 AM 7/15/2003

 

I have a SOHC swap for sale and I also have rods, A1 pistons, and dual carbs to get you started on making it NASTY. Dirt cheap too! E-mail me at vtecluke99@aol.com

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by exospeedAMcrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">We build all motor SOHC all the time. While most so called engine builders negelected the SOHC in the past, we continued to research and build both SOHC and DOHC.

The most effective upgrades you can do to the SOHC would be using a high compression pistons such as the A1 pistons from the 88-89 Integra or some aftermarket pistons from Arias. bumping up the compression on the SOHC to at least 12:1 is what will put the SOHC to a competitive level.
ANother important part is working on the head and cam on the SOHC. I think the SOHC needs such a good head setup to make some good power out of it. With our non-vtec setups.(D16A6), we were achieving average gains of 35-40 HP to the wheels with our headwork and camshaft along with the basic I/H/E bolt ons.

So my point is... it has a good potential to make power. It all depends on how dedicated you are to the Z6 and what type of budget you are working on.

A basic high compression Z6 setup with headwork, cam, and bottom end will be about 155hp to the wheels.. and possibly more.
On our A6 nonvtec setups.. with just headwork and stock low comp bottom end. we are getting about 130-140hp to the wheels. which were good enough for 13.6@99mph runs in an EF.
Wil
Modified by exospeedAMcrx at 9:59 AM 7/10/2003</TD></TR></TABLE>

hey wassup. is a 12:1 CR streetable and for daily driving?? because if i've always wanted to build up this d15b1 put some A1 pistons but that only makes the CR 10.2:1. so i was planning on milling the head but whats the most you could mill??

thanks

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by James. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

hey wassup. is a 12:1 CR streetable and for daily driving?? because if i've always wanted to build up this d15b1 put some A1 pistons but that only makes the CR 10.2:1. so i was planning on milling the head but whats the most you could mill??

thanks</TD></TR></TABLE>

yes its streetable, if u want higher compresison do a 30 mill, and use 1 layer of a headgasket, try and get some head studs too.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by James. &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

hey wassup. is a 12:1 CR streetable and for daily driving?? because if i've always wanted to build up this d15b1 put some A1 pistons but that only makes the CR 10.2:1. so i was planning on milling the head but whats the most you could mill??

thanks</TD></TR></TABLE>
Honestly, I am not a big fan of MILLING heads. I prefer a good headwork and quality high compression bottom end to get the job done. The A1 pistons should be good enough for the bottom end and will not require milling the head. the 12:1 will be streetable but of course will require higher octane, at least 91octane and possibly may need to retard the timing for reg street driving. Driving conditions will be a factor in determining if the timing has to be retarded. Colder/cooler conditions may not require adjustment but if you're area is hot and the elevation is higher, you may have to adjust a bit to prevent detonation.

Wil

 

would a compression bump to something between 10 and 11:1 be worth it? im just trying to see what the limit is of compression before timing adjustment and other factors come into play.. would the horsepower gain be noticeable?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackeg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">would a compression bump to something between 10 and 11:1 be worth it? im just trying to see what the limit is of compression before timing adjustment and other factors come into play.. would the horsepower gain be noticeable? </TD></TR></TABLE>

Yes a 10:1 to 11:1 CR would be more conservative. Most likely dont have to mess with timing. the HP is still noticeable compared to stock..

 

Man this always makes me laugh (not a bad thing)
Sup Wil I haven't talk to you for a while now. I'll IM you

Listen to Wil, he knows his stuff when it comes down to it. I use to have a All-MOTOR plan for my D16a6 and I was constantly working with Wil to see what my options were. I happen to run into a really good deal with a c1 so my setups have now changed. After driving a EG with c1 I have a lot more respect for the D16 motors. WHY simiply becuase for their size they can dishout their fair share of HP. I mean it's sorta weird to say this but I think most D16 cars can hang with B16 and B18c1 up to about the middle of 3rd gear. Which in my book is good.

Seeing a 140whp d16 sould be a pice of cake! Much like seeing a 185whp B18c1. It is mainly simple stuff like cams and bolt on with more compression. Now trying to make +165whp on a D16 would be a real challange at the same time haveing it be street legal & daily driven.

Call me crazy but I have though about going back to my D16 all-motor route for the following reasons:
*less hassel with swap
*wiring stays the same
*D16 parts in general (blocks, pistons, heads, cranks, pullys, cams, ect) are dirt cheap! and every were you go!
*Its different
*If theives know you have a D16 in your civic most of the time they won't even care.

Also all those time talking with Wil has really stuck to me, and I can't help to be satisfieyd until I have a D16 all motor route, even if a STOCK B18c make more power. It's just a gotta have setup that I would love to accomplish some day. Man I wish I had the time a fundings to get another project going.


MORE power to the D16!



Modified by Charlie Moua at 7:14 AM 7/15/2003

 

Wil,

I'm glad you chimed in here since I was about to post a question and I figure you'll know the answer. I have an A6 that is running a mild all motor setup. IHE, milled 30 mills, Gude cam (sorry, it was a freeby that came with the car I personally would have gone with the exospeed), mild port and polish, and Ghettodyne engine management. I was wondering how much gain I would see going to the A1 pistons, yielding an approximate 12.3:1 CR. I know there is no definite number, I was just wondering an approximate guess. I was thinking about this route since it is an auto-x only car and the low end torque of an all motor car would be a lot more beneficial than a turbo setup. To give you an idea of my output now I just ran a 15.4 @ 89 on street tuning (has not seen the dyno yet but will) Thanks in advance.

Dru

 

Dru...
the A1 pistons will make so much difference.. that high compression on an A6 is just so nice to have. Its hard to describe how D16's are..

they may not push as much HP as B series but the performance on the track can be comparable as far as times... Numbers dont necesarilly compare either.. a 170hp d16 vs a 170hp b18C is totally different.

I like to build up all the Honda motors, but i personally havent built a D series i was totally satisfied with and feel I can move on and go on another project.
Someday..
I have a few friends with 11/12 sec B series that are all excited to build a D series again.. sometimes its not necesarrily how fast you go.. its the challenge of how to get there that will make this Sport Fun AGAIN.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Charlie Moua &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
I mean it's sorta weird to say this but I think most D16 cars can hang with B16 and B18c1 up to about the middle of 3rd gear.
</TD></TR></TABLE>

This is the downside of the D series.. the 3rd gear is weak.. i believe with the right gearing, a simple d16 with 140hp can smoke a b18VTEC with about 180-190hp..

I have raced many dual cam vtecs and we always pulled on the DOHC on 1st and 2nd gear.. the Launch is ridiculous on 1st gear for the SOHC. and the 2nd is still strong. But 3rd gear just dies out.. it doesnt pack that punch even if you had the power.
Even with a Final Drive, 3rd still needs some work. I am still trying to find out what is the best combination. Im Sure Mr Bone might be able to help on this one.

Wil

 

using ZC gears for 3rd and 4th would help... same gears as a GSR tranny..

also, any luck with the y7 head?

 

[QUOTE=Wazup]using ZC gears for 3rd and 4th would help... same gears as a GSR tranny..
QUOTE]

Ya but how common is that trans hehe..im looking for an easier accesible option.

 

call Matt over at Speed Machine 760-746-3117. he knows all when it comes to sohc. he's got a wicked fast one in his crx.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by exospeedAMcrx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">[QUOTE=Wazup]using ZC gears for 3rd and 4th would help... same gears as a GSR tranny..
QUOTE]

Ya but how common is that trans hehe..im looking for an easier accesible option.</TD></TR></TABLE>

you can get one at honda motors online for 150

 

When you talk about headwork, what exactly do you mean? And I must agree about the tranny. 3rd gear REALLY sucks. Would be cool to put in a compatible tranny with the proper gearing. Sorry to butt in, but I am a D16 fan too.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by larrysdsol &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">When you talk about headwork, what exactly do you mean? </TD></TR></TABLE>

A proper head would be a mildly ported head with the matching upgraded valvetrain. Valves can stay stock, since for street, the oversized ones tend to be too much. But you can put in some better flowing ones if budget permits.
In the D series, expecially the A6, the cam can make such a HUGE difference and turn a stock A6 from a tame motor to a wild beast.
Another thing, we suggest are welded combustion chambers. IT helps increase the compression as well. The only thing about this is, think ahead on what you want to do later on as far as piston and bottom end build up. If you plan to do some crazy **** with custom high high compression pistons, think about how a welded combustion chamber will play a part in designing your head and block combo.
Some liek to Mill their heads to increase their compression, yes its a cheap way to get more power and Compression, but its like the welded combustion chambers, think ahead how milling will affect what you want to do wth the bottom end in the future. We personally dont USE milling in our heads as a way to get more power out of our heads. its an option for our customers, but its not something we rely on to get power.

Wil

 

Wil,
Thanks for the reply, it makes me want to start moving on the A1's. I wanted to know since I usually win the autocrosses in SM2 unless there is a vette there. If so, I lose by 0.1-0.2 sec. Hence I was looking for a little umph throughout the entire rev band.

I agree 100% with what you've been saying. A cammed SOHC has so much more low-end than a typical B series. This is ideal for auto-x where you consistantly find yourself pulling out of the "hole." The D's aren't necessarily superior or inferior, just different.

Although don't spread the word too far, the lust for the B-Series is what keeps our parts cheap.

 

The D16 is really kool for autox applications.. you can play with the powerband of our cams easily and find the sweet spots for what you will need it for.
we are getting into AutoX market more and more so hope to see our products on more of these track cars.
A few well known honda-challenge guys have already been calling us to use some of our cams, race heads and the Bisimoto header.

Don't forget, we arent just DRAG racing anymore.. (thanks Jared!)