I mentioned in my post about my last race that I went off track and bottom'ed out really hard in an area off the track that had a deep dip in it. It was a really loud smack and the result was a 90-degree turned steering wheel and a whole hellavua lot of negative camber on the passenger-side front wheel.



At the track we were able to get the toe straight, but the only thing we could figure that was creating all the negative camber was that the spindle arm (is that the correct term?) might have bent. The inside rim of the wheel had some rub scrapes too, like the wheel bottom'ed out so hard that it bent that arm inwards.

So I took some measurements this weekend:
In both pictures below, the lines labeled "B" were 1.5cm's shorter on the passenger side then on the driver side. The distance between the shock and the arm in picture two, noted as "C", was almost 2-2.5cm's shorter then on the driver side. And finally, on the tie-rod (again, not sure if I got my parts named correctly) in picture 1, labeled "A", the rod is not parallel, or flat with the spindle, it is at an angle. All this seems to confirm to me that the arm is bent, which if you can imagine, would of course bring the hub/rotor tilted inwards, creating all sorts of negative camber. Does this seem logical?





Is it possible the impact could have bent such a sturdy piece? It looks pretty strong but it does have the disadvantage of already having a bend in it.

So if this piece is really bent, would an alignment be able to adjust other things in order to cancel the negative camber? Or am I going to just have to replace the part? My other fear is that there is something else bent as well. Any thoughts?

thanks guys

 

"B" - the knuckle is a weak piece on the 88-91 civ/rex and will bend super easy. Actually one of the tricks to getting neg camber on the front of these cars is putting "B" in a vice and bending it. So if you want to straighten it put it in a vice and bend it back...watch out sometimes they snap if you go crazy !!

Are you allowed a front camber kit? if you are then I would just bend the other side then use the camber kit to bring it back.

If "c" is shorter then It I would say it is bent

If you want to check pull out the drivers side and swap it in the pass side (just to SEE what kinda camber you get)

I would send you one for free but It might take 2 years to get there with canada post

 

The spindle is definitely bent around the C area.

I'd replace the spindle and closely examine the upper arm and balljoint while everything was disassembled.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by uncleben &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
The distance between the shock and the arm in picture two, noted as "C", was almost 2-2.5cm's shorter then on the driver side. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Bingo. Now that you've measured, take both uprights off, lay them on the floor and measure again. Please don't bend the other side to match as mentioned in a previous post.
Good luck.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by 89civicdx &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">"B" - the knuckle is a weak piece on the 88-91 civ/rex and will bend super easy. Actually one of the tricks to getting neg camber on the front of these cars is putting "B" in a vice and bending it. So if you want to straighten it put it in a vice and bend it back...watch out sometimes they snap if you go crazy !!</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thank you! Thanks for the confirmation. Hmmm, I'm a little concerned with bending the other side, or bending the passenger side back for that matter - I'm afraid that might weaken it. I suppose I could do that just to get me through this next race though.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Are you allowed a front camber kit? if you are then I would just bend the other side then use the camber kit to bring it back.</TD></TR></TABLE>

And if you mean like the Skunk2 style adjustable camber kits, I don't think that is allowed in IT. Though I did notice OPM sells "Front Adjustable Upper Control Arm Bolts" which "Allows for front camber adjustment" and I thought most of their 88-91 stuff was geared towards IT racers, so maybe that at least is legal.

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">If you want to check pull out the drivers side and swap it in the pass side (just to SEE what kinda camber you get)</TD></TR></TABLE>

Are you sure I can swap the passenger side to driver side? They look unique from L/R...

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would send you one for free but It might take 2 years to get there with canada post </TD></TR></TABLE>

lol, yeah, it took like a month to get the springs from ya and my next race is in 2 weeks I hope I can find one from a junkyard or something for not too much $$$

thanks again!

 

thanks also, John and Jeff!

anyone know where I can find a used passenger side spindle?

 

How can you tell if the spindle is bent you can not even see it in the pictures nor did he measure it? It is the knuckle that is bent not the spindle, get your terms correct.

 

I needed one, junkyard had about 8 pulled already, but all needed either bearings, hubs or both. Good time to upgrade to OPM hardened hubs, and they should be back instock!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by DB1-R81 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">How can you tell if the spindle is bent you can not even see it in the pictures nor did he measure it? It is the knuckle that is bent not the spindle, get your terms correct.</TD></TR></TABLE>

Chill out man - that's why I said "(is that the correct term?)," because I wasn't sure. I think the pictures clearly show what I measured and what part we are all talking about.

 

I usually call it the upright so you get away from the spindle and knuckle terms which get people confused.

Get a used one from a scrap yard rather than trying to rebend the bent one. They are very common and should be pretty cheap. Then check to see the condition of the front wheel bearing as now off the car is the right time to change it. These units are sided right and left so you will need to get the correct one.

While you are under there, check the condition of the upper control arm as that stamped sheetmetal arm and it's ball joint have taken a mighty whack for the upright to have bent. Since the whole system took a big jolt, it is possible naive to think the upright alone is damaged and all else is okay. Not a big job at all but be thorough as you don't want to find other damaged parts while at speed on track.

While you are at it, turn the adjuster **** on your KONI on that corner. If the adjuster mechanism still turns and stops properly, the shcok itself is probably okay but there is a good chance that the shock bottomed internally and the best evidence will be a stuck or ffreely spinning adjuster. If so, contact me directly.

 

Thanks Lee, very much appreciated - I will check it all out like you said.

So if I end up just replacing the upright, what is my parts list? The upright and possible a new wheel bearing? Anything else?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by uncleben &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
So if I end up just replacing the upright, what is my parts list? The upright and possible a new wheel bearing? Anything else?</TD></TR></TABLE>

Check the condition of the inner and outer tie rods, both for possible bends and the inner for a damaged ball socket and the outer for a bad ball joint. If the upper arm and ball joint are OK and the tie rods are OK then probably it is just the upright and the condition of it's wheel bearing.

When you had the thump, were you going straight and do you recall if the steering wheel was jerked to the side hard? There is potential for the steering rack to be damaged (check it's mounts to see if there is sign that it might have been shoved to the side) but a straight impact might have spared the rack.

I built an ITA car for a guy who killed a rack and an upright by sliding into a tire wall but he was spinning during the impact. Hopefully your damage will be all upright.

 

i do recommend the OPM hardened hubs. and new bearings of course. if youre going to get the new upright/knuckle from a junkyard, remember to pull as much of the assembly as you can, you never know what you might need later. (but then again, you start to amass a bunch of misc parts...) you should probably get the other side too, and if you can, be in search of another so that you have a full set of spares, including a set of spare axles to bring to the track. itll be much easier to swap out the whole upright at the track if anything should go wrong, both of mine went out for one reason or another last year.