H22A Stage 2 with stock idle (64322A) plus dual springs and retainers:

I know there have been many topics on this, and I did a search and read most all of them. What I am hearing is breakage issues. My question is what kinds of setups were the guys that broke them running? What kind of RPM's were being turned? Any other internal mods? And most of all, for those that have good luck, no breakage, are you happy with the performance you got from them? Any dyno numbers? Those seem to be lacking here as well. When I get my motor back, I will get some dyno numbers for all.
Thanks for the input.

 

I've never heard an incident of the Crower H22A series cams breaking. But I have read several incidents of Crower B series engine cams snapping...

Andrew

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by aklucsarits &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I've never heard an incident of the Crower H22A series cams breaking. But I have read several incidents of Crower B series engine cams snapping...</TD></TR></TABLE>
yeah, me too

 

someone recently posted an EG w/ an H22 that snapped his intake cam (not sure)...either way I've been hearing nothing but bad this about Crowers cams and am unsure if it's installer error or what, I know I've never heard of a skunk2 or a CTR/ITR cams breaking.

 

"heard"... so you have no experience with it. It seems that one batch of bad crower cams yeilds years upon years of rumors spreading though, and not limited to, their entire Honda/Acura application list. I've seen only one instance of this and it was not for a H22.

 

I've got those exact crowers... stage 2 w idle lobes. There great..second season w them running hard to 8000rpm quite often. My car makes over 200whp w them...not bad for the shitty DC header and no headwork... Most snapping incidents are due to inproper installs. U will be fine.

 

One more question for you 96SR-V, why did you go with the Type-S pistons? Any advantage over stock? Any sleeving concerns?

 

I went w the s pistons cuz I didn't want to spend the money to sleeve..Really depends on how much power u wanna make and weather u want to spand the money or not... I spent around 400-450 for pistons and rings the another 140 to hone the cylinders properly... instead of around 6 -700 bucks for high comp forged pistons and another 200 for rings plus sleeving... Mind u if u go w the more expensive route u will make more power and be able to run more aggressive cams due to the size of the pistons reliefs on forged pistons ie JE's... I'm pretty happy w my setup makes pretty good power. I just need to get a good header on here this DC sucks...
PS don't worry about breakin the cams...I did some research and its bogus..the cams are good u should not worry one bit... If I were u I'd worry about getting someone who can hone ur cylinders properly and make sure that if u do get the s pistons that u get the .25 oversize so that whoever is honing can get and cylinder warping out. I've posted this before but I'll do it again so u know whats up w the honing...It's really important if it's not done right u'll be sorry. This is word for word honda service bullitin:

1990-2001 Prelude – Honing Fiber Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinders 2000-01 S2000

All S2000 and 1990 and later VTEC and SI Preludes have Fiber-Reinforced Metal (FRM) cylinder liners. FRM honing is not required unless the cylinder has deep vertical scratches that run the length of the bore. Cylinders with light colored spots or flaking cannot be corrected by honing and must be replaced.

To hone FRM liners, perform the following:
· Use a rigid hone (not a ball hone) with GC-600-J or finer stones for nonferrous metals. The honing pressure should be 200-300 kPa (2-3 kg-cm2, 29-43 psi).
· Use an oil type honing oil.
· Hone at 45-50 rpm to a 60 degree-crosshatch pattern.
· Do not stroke the hone more than 20 cycles.
· After honing, thoroughly clean the engine block of all metal particles by washing with hot soapy water, then dry and oil them immediately. Never use solvent; it will only redistribute the grit.
· Some light vertical scoring and scratching is acceptable if it isn’t deep enough to catch your fingernail, and doesn’t run the full length of the bore. (rm,sn)

 

Ya, I don't wanna sleeve if I don't have to. Haven't done much research yet, but are the Type-S pistons any more expensive than the std's? And, are they a different compression ratio over std?

I sent the honing process to my engine builder, so hopefully he gets it right, he says he has done them before without issues.

 

no more expensive.... same compression .25 oversize is a really small difference..

 

I have a similar setup to 96 srv. I rebuilt a blown H22A1 with oversize type S pistons and crower 63422 cams. I have the full stage 2 (not the stock low cam lobes). The type S pistons raise your compression. That's the point of using them. USDM pistons are 10:1, JDM 10.6:1, and Type S 11.1:1. The oversize pistons are mainly to refresh the cylinder walls, remove scratches, wear, taper, etc. My cylinders were badly scratched up from the previous blowup. My vtec is set at 4800. Very smooth and flat torque curve. Can't feel the VTEC switch, but I can hear it. I'm happy with them so far. There were two versions of the 63422 cam. The new one has revised profiles to get another 600 rpm before valve float. If you get the cams used you may get the old profile, just fyi. The card that comes with the cams will say which profile it is. btw, busted cams are usually from not checking for proper clearances, coil bind, etc.

Here is some related info on the Type S pistons:

http://www.hondatuningmagazine...rhead/

 

Do you still have the pistons for sale? What about rings, no rings with them? I plan on getting the cams/springs/retainers new, so they should be the "newer" ones.

 

Ya, pistons are still for sale. They use the same rings as other honda H22 pistons. Just order the oversize rings from hondaautomotiveparts.com.

 

btw honda rings are the best for this app..don't bother w total seal or anything like that.. Iva actually heard a lot of bad things about total seal rings. Like flyrod said these cams are nice I to have a nice flat tq curve make power to about 7700 rpm and the vtec engagement seems to work best at 4800 for me as well.

 

Guess I should invest in a V-AFC as well, and spend a little time on the dyno to boot......

 

good idea...or inquire about a hondata setup? if not VAFC is good. I was running at 170 something before we got to the camgears and hondata... after tuning we broke the 200 mark..

 

Thanks guys, I appreciate the flame free conversation.

BTW, nice times 96SR-V, I'd like to be close to if not in the 13's when I'm done.

Flyrod, I'll let you know this week about the pistons.

 

good luck keep us posted and remember proper break in procedures r important...cheers

BTW run regular oil in it for a while if u run synthetic the rings won't sit properly. I actually won't convert my car at all... If u do wait a while

 

I wish I could say the same for the Crower cams... I had at set of
63422s with his spring/retainer kit along with his adjustable cam gears when they first came out.

Unfortunately, mine broke where the cam gear slides on the cam.
Everything was torqued properly and in the right sequence. I was lucky that
the break occurred at idle at a stoplight. The cam must have fatigued shortly
before when I had my foot into it. I didn't have any damage other than the
cam breaking...the cam caps looked fine and the compression checked out ok.

Remember, this is one of Crowers early batches I'm talking about.

Import Tuner made some kinda statement in this months issue about grinding down the rockers if you used Crowers 68187 spring which was confusing.

Check out what these guys have to say on the breakage issue.
https://honda-tech.com/zerothread?id=359458