Alright, I'm a bit torn here. I know half this board has Spec Bs or JUN cams, I'm looking for a light cam that I won't have to make drastic modifications in other parts of my engine. Just drop in and make some power. I'm not looking for that much, but before I was considering the JRSC. I didn't get a good response from anybody to charge a Type R, so I'm going with cams.

I'm considering Toda Spec As, do I have to upgrade anything else with these cams? How's the idle? Gas mileage?

I did a search on this, but never on these specific questions. I wasn't sure to ask at first because I would probably get a response, "blah blah blah, didn't we discuss this before?" But nobody wants a bunch of Rs that are already JUNed and Spooned up while I'm sitting here confused. If you guys would help me out and point me in the general direction I would like to go in, I would most appreciate it. Help a young brother up struggling. Thanks.

 

SPOON

 

I think that the TODA Spec A cams are just like stock ITR cams, like what you would put in a GSR instead of factory ITR cams. Because of VTEC, your idle should be about the same, gas milage too.

 

How much power will Spoon put to the ground? With Bolt-ons of course.

 

Spec A cams. 200 SAE WHP

 

sgT:

Was that dyno done with a test pipe? If so, can you estimate what you've got with all the emissions equipment still in the car? I'm trying to understand how much is possible while still meeting emissions.

Curious.




[Modified by R748, 1:59 PM 6/17/2001]

 

it was with a test pipe if memory serves me correctly.
probably subtract a few hp for the test pipe.

 

Well, I had the same dilemma as you - I wanted to try out Spec A's. I knew that you'd at least have gains on an otherwise stock car (Steve is proof of that). But I ended up buying Spec B's from Jack, since I would have spent even more buying A's. I think B's are perfectly streetable. My car cuts off at stoplights every now and again (because my stock exhaust is now a restriction). Idle is a bit lower, but reasonable.

But the power is very nice - great gains down low. If you look at the cams out of the car, you'll see that the non-VTEC lobe of the Spec B's is as big, if not bigger, than the VTEC lobe of the ITR cam. Good stuff. And the best part? My mileage actually went UP after installing cams. Before, I was lucky to get 230-240 out of a tank. Now, I'm consistently at 29-31 mpg...

 

Nice! To what do you attribute the increase in mileage? Do you think you're more likely to apply only part throttle in sitruations that would otherwise require full throttle on a stock car? If not, how else can putting in cams help improve mileage? Did you increase fuel pressure? Bigger injectors? Pump? All of the above should, in theory, reduce mileage.

The fact that your exhaust system is stock got my curiosity going. How much power are you making, and what other modifications do you have?

 

How are you dealing with the lower vacuum the Spec B's make in terms of the idle quality. Any adjustments to the TB?

 

yeah my idling probblem went away with the B's by opening the idle adjust screw wide open...no VAFC adjustment needed. When Yoshio did my chip with that 7000 rpm VTEC switchover and the rest, the idle went back to stock.

cheers

 

Spoon it.
http://www.dynocenter.com and check out Eriks B18C5 engine with Spoon cams

 

I don't think Erik's motor is anywhere close to stock. That doesn't really represent what Spoon cams will do on a mild B18C5.

 

with toda spec B's or spoon you should get a new valve train and they will get their full power if you get a chip to let your car rev higher. I would say if you want a cheaper cam set up get spec A's or skunk2. they will make some power on a stock motor.

 

Great, good gas mileage is key to what I'm considering. What do I need exactly to run Spec Bs? New springs/retainers from Toda? What ECU do I possilby need? Or V-AFC? Fuel upgrades?

NOW, with the Spec Bs, what kind of power aside from my primary questions about the Spec As, will I be making with the possible upgrades?

Thanks.

 

Wait, wait, wait.

I'm sliding from my subject, I just want a good power gain with Spec As, and wondering if I need to UPGRADE anything else. That's all I need to know...

 

Yes, you will get a power upgrade out of Spec A's. I don't know why people have a misconception about the Spec A's being like to factory ITR cams, because they aren't.

Spec A's are plug and play on a Type R--no other valvetrain modifications needed.

 

Setup is as follows - V-AFC, JDM 4-1 header, 2.5" cat (stock can and b-pipe with first restriction cut out), Toda Spec B cams, Toda cam gears, AEM CAI, and Jack tuning. We did tune on the dyno the other weekend in Charlotte, but for some reason, the correction was all wompted on my runs, so I didn't get a clear indication of how much power I'm putting down (peak). Jack made 190whp with these cams in his car with the same setup (except for a Racing Medalion cat-back), so I'm guessing I should be in the 182-185 range, plus that big fat midrange gain Toda B's are known for.

I am NOT running a higher redline, so I am using the stock valvetrain. I do not forsee any problem in doing this. I realize there is more power to be found by going to a new valvetrain, higher redline and a modified ECU, but I don't want to get into all that yet. I can't make much power up top anyway, due to the limitations of the stock exhaust.

I'll try the dyno again next month, if I can make it down to Charlotte then. Hopefully I'll have a better idea of power output. Maybe, if someone will sell me one cheap (hint, hint!), I can get a freer-flowing exhaust on there.

As far as gas mileage, I think just proper fuel tuning and keeping somewhat near the speed limit is the trick to getting 30+ mpg.

Keyed - Sorry if this gets away from your intent. I really did want to try out A's, but this opportunity was too good to pass up. Good luck - I think you'll be happy with your A's, if you choose to go that route.

 

I spoke to tom this past weekend....dyno is now working properly!!

Sorry pat,jason, etc....................

 

Erick's engine that hit those awesome numbers is nowhere NEAR stock.
How bout CTR pistons, LS crank and rods, 60 thou off the head, port and polish, etc. sound?

It was also running on 110 octane.

 

I'm with Keyed. Not all of us need the extreme. I too am curious about the Spec A's.
Just a little bump in performance over stock would be nice, thats all!
What mods are required? So far the answers have been vague. Plug and Play with stock everything (header, intake,exhaust, etc...) will yeild in any gains???

-Nick

 

Well, I recommend doing intake, exhaust, header, etc. *before* you do the Spec-A's. I finally got all of the above taken care of and now I'm ready to install my A's. I don't know what kind of effect dropping A's into a bone-stock ITR would have.

sgT has posted quite a bit of info on the Spec A's, and from what I have been able to see, the A's will put out almost as much HP as the B's assuming stock redline and good tuning. With the B's, I really don't like the fact that I would be idling on what amounts to a "high cam" configuration on the stock valvetrain.

And for my needs (autox, roadcourse and no drag racing), the A's are going to provide about what I am looking for. Plus, the get the B's at the level they should be, it will take a lot of money doing the valvetrain and redline upgrades.

 

Todd - Please, KEEP US POSTED! I'd love to see what I could have done with A's instead, on a typical bolt-on car (no raised compression, etc).

Also, you don't have to do the valvetrain upgrade simply to run B's. They drop right in, just as the A's do. To get max power, then yes, you will have to upgrade the valvetrain to handle the higher revs, and get an ECU that lets you get there. But please don't think you have to spend all that money at once.