A couple of nights ago, I was at the Cleveland Auto Show chatting up a gentleman at a local Kart racing organization booth. The guy I was speaking to started in karting, moved up to SCCA Nationals (FF, FV?), finished 2nd at the Runoffs in 2001, then decided to go back to karting. His jist was: The adrenaline/fun level is the same, for far less money. He claimed he built his (very competitive) kart for $1300 with motor (used components) and tires cost you under 200 and last most of the season. I like the sound of that.

I know many F1, CART, etc stars got their start in karting. It must be worth something. I know very little about organized kart racing, as far as safety record, etc. But it seems like you can learn much about the fundamentals of chassis setup on the machines, while honing driving skills.

Have any of you done any organized karting? How does it compare, in your opinion, to auto racing?

 

Yeah - Right!

"Affordable Crack"

"More Humane Crack"

IT'S ALL CRACK!!!!

Kart setup is peculiar and unique - not necessarily good training for car chassis tuning, except for the generalities with respect to tires.

YES, it's very attractive in many ways. If you can give up Car Crack, and be happy with Kart Crack, you'll look like a friggen GFCP Genius.

And they are Definitely the real thing - as close as any of us can/will ever get to driving an F1 car - shifter karts are INSANE. And the maniacs who run 250 and larger motors on real road courses are INSANE^10.

Scott, who hasn't done any Real Karting...thinks it's very violent in terms of dynamic load on your body, and more potentially injurious than running an IT type car....

 

That's good logic, but if you're an addict (like me) you'll end up racing both the car and the kart. As for caryover, here's my OPINION....
setup--very little carryover, partic. for FWD hondas
Driving skill--great cross-over, I started on non-shifter karts, then cars, now shifters and cars. THe shifter kart is by far the most "busy hands" you can have. Brake zones in the car that used to get me flustered with three downshifts now seem like they are a month long...also a couple of days on the kart in the rain and my rain car skills improved greatly.
Fitness--this is the best part, if you can get to the point where you can run a shifter for 30 min. then 90 min. car stints are like a walk in the park.
$$$ factor--your guy who built a kart for $1500 is either very savy or simply riding a piece of junk. For a decent used shifter you'll spend at least $4000 or you'll get some spanked out loose chassis pos that you'll spend more time fixing then riding.
Logistics--the kart logistics are great, everything fits in my expedition, no trailer to get, load, hook-up, ect.
saftey--there is no doubt in my mind that karts are more dangerous. Don't forget they are open wheel and if you touch things get ugly quick...I've broken some ribs on the kart and that sucks...however I never considered quiting... Also you'll prob. be racing againt a lot of "kids" who don't pay when they crash and are happy to miss a day or two of school, whereas I must work every monday morning and fix my own damage. Now at 31 I'm going to waiver into the seniors class.

btw I agree w. RR anyone who runs a 250 is INSANE and has a death wish...125 is enough for me, and somedays too much! Good luck, have fun...

 

I've kinda done the kart and car thing too. My kart has been broken more than it has been running, mainly due to my lack of time or motivation to get it running properly.

The other downside of karts is the tracks...lots of times just cones in a parking lot, the biggest thing that makes me want to build a car over a kart is racing at Sebring, Daytona, Road Atlanta etc. There is something romantic or nostalgic about running on the tracks that I watched racing on growing up.

Also I don't think anyone would disagree that the risk of serious injury is far greater in a kart.

Otherwise for adrenaline, storage, transportation, total cost, competitiveness, and fun they're pretty tough to beat.

I've heard from more than one kart dealer that ~75% of shifter karts are not actively raced, so it seems like a lot of people just buy them to run practice/track days. We'd sure like to have some of those people come out and try an autocross, F125 could always use more numbers.

Matt

 

That's my question... where can you run 125 shifters, etc? Here in DC, the only game in town seems to be Woodbridge Kart Club, which runs at Summit Point and the most popular karts are enduro karts (layback, 2 stroke, no shifter).

Are there kart-specific sprint tracks anywhere on the East Coast? (and I mean real tracks with real races, not the AllSports GrandPrix things where you run their 5-10hp things).

 

BeaveRun, LMS, and I think there are some others

You cant start off in shifter anyway, and actually a lot of people in WKC run the "sit-up" Sprint-Enduro cars with 2stroke yamaha KT-100 engines. They run 1:29s at Summit pretty easily.

Evan
-who took the WKC novice school

 

Awww, be nice... the "arrive and drive" places like Allsports GP are fun as hell too! Especially in the enduro events... you can get lots of legitimate, competitive, and extremely technical roadracing in for less than the price of one Kumho track tire. It's true they only go ~50mph but on the positive side they're a lot harder to hurt yourself in!

PS- VIR has a kart track, down near the rally courses. Not sure if it's available for use in anything but their own karts, though...

IMHO,

Jon
all seat time
is good seat time

 

*grumblemumblegrumble*


[Modified by elgorey, 5:05 PM 3/7/2003]

 

I didn't mean to imply that. The "arrive and drive" venues are a lot fun. But most of them tend to be smaller tracks. Have you seen the kart racing on SpeedTV (the races that are billed as a feeder to CART)? The track looks to be a kart specific sprint track that is fairly long (I think it was outside Vegas somewhere) and looks like a lot of fun.

 

We've got a small track, kart specific in Opa-Locka (Miami) and a much better lot style track at Homestead. Homestead is currently building a kart "complex" with multiple tracks and lighting. We also have kart specific tracks in Ocala (near Orlando) Jacksonville, Naples, and I'm sure I've missed some.

As for autoX in a kart, I've heard it was a blast, but for me it's just not enough time in the seat. I'd rather sepnd a little more an do an open test day for 3 hours then go thru the same logistics for 3-4 under one min. runs, that's not even enough time to heat the tires! I have a lot of respect for guys who are able to autox on shfters and put in good consistent times on cold to warm rubber, karts are tough enough when the tires are hot!


[Modified by amweiss, 5:46 PM 3/7/2003]

 

I knew what you meant, Al... just had to get my 2 cents in, you know.

I saw that stuff on Speed the other month too! IIRC it was indeed outside Vegas... the facility and/or program was owned and/or helped by some CART heavy hitters like Michael Andretti. Those did look fast as knutz, and scary fun.

But I knew what you meant - dedicated facilities like that, sized between an indoor track and a roadcourse - would be awesome.

PS- there is an outdoor facility like the Vegas one on top of a mountain not far from Carlisle, PA... long since abandoned but very well known in kart history from what I've been told. Anybody ever heard of it?

Jon