Guys,
I whave been thinking about using 5 pt harnesses with my stock seats and I know that not having the hole for the substarp to go thru is bad, but so many people do it. Can anyone elaborate on what problems can arise? Yes, I have a roll bar and this is on a daily driven GSR. Thanks!

 

get a schroth rally 3 harness. basically 4 point, back goes to the c pillar mount for thew rear shoulder belt. awesome belt, even for every day driving. kick *** for autoX

 

Harnesses are meant to be used with racing buckets that do not recline. They lack appropriate lateral support. They also lack the guide holes for the shoulder belts. Are you planning to cut a hole through your stock seat? Otherwise the sub-belt will be essentially useless.

 

Also be aware of the dangers of an improperly mounted 4 (or 5) point harness in a car without a roll bar.

Maybe the members with more knowlege would care to elaborate?

 

 

It is impossible to get a 4pt harness to fit properly. The lap belt will always ride up on your belly and increase the chances of you "submarining" under the lap belt and reallt getting hurt. The "crotch" strap doesn't hold you from going under the lap belt, it holds the lap belt down across your pelvis where bone is stronger than your guts. Massive internal injuries can be had if the lap belt is too high. Even if the crotch strap is mounted in front of the seat cushion (as opposed to through it) it is still better than not having it at all.

5 point or 6 point is the way to go, for any events that speeds can reach 60 mph.

Something else you might want to look into, An H style harness. Especially if you have factory seats that have skinny headrest supports. Route the harness in between the headrest supports, but only if they are far enough apart that they won't cut your neck when they are tightened. An H harness keeps the shoulder belts on your torso and prevents them from splitting apart. There was a guy last year who had the shoulder harnesses come apart when he hit the wall and he hit the steering wheel hard enough to get massive internal injuries...


Hope this helps, and hope you NEVER have to find out how good your seat belts are...

Jeff
[edit : one more thing]



[Modified by jasyatz, 5:11 PM 2/22/2003]

 

heh... sorry, guess I didnt read well enough.

I ran one on my stock seat, all I noticed is it deformed the seat. IMO, just leave the 5th out. I also know a person who daily drives a Mugen S1 race seat...depends on the sacrifice you want to make.

 

 

This isn't always the case. I've used a Schroth Rallye 4 for two seasons of autocross and have never had this problem. The Schroth belts have asm technology as well, which is designed to eliminate submarining.

As for using a 5-6 point belt with stock seats, I don't recommend it. 5-6 point belts should only be used with a seat that has a sub-belt hole in the base of the seat. If you mount a sub-strap with a stock-type seat, the sub-strap will have to be stretched over the end of the seat, and if you do submarine, you will hit the sub-strap with force...not good. Also, mounting a sub-strap this way puts the camlock mechanism at an angle it is not designed for.

 

Im no expert... but my rally car has a hole in the stock seat for the sub belt. This works fine. The hole can be like a slot and almost invisible. If you crash, you'll rip up the seat. So what, at least the belt will be in the right position.

 

rally 3 in a type r, identical to mine, but mine is faster cause it's yellow:

http://store3.yimg.com/I/soloracerdotcom_1729_7490180

 

Ask Jay Wright, he's a paraplegic and one of many that finally led SCCA to ban the use of stock seats in Showroom Stock classes.

 

I tried the 5 point sub-strap around the front of the stock seat, and wasn't happy with it, so I got a 6-point strap. I mounted one end to the inside rear seat track mounting bolt, put the strap around the outside if the seat with enough slack to allow the buckle to sit on the seat cushion about 6-8 inches in front of the seat back, and attached the other end to the outside rear seat track bolt. In use, I sit on the strap and pull the buckle up between my legs to the cam-lock.

This setup has always satisfied autocross and track day tech inspectors, and is pretty comfortable once you get the length adjusted. Since the strap goes to either side, instead of straight down and back, there's less risk of damage to your tender bits.

 

reading this thread, I started getting concerned about the fact that I got individual shoulder straps for my harnesses. They are mounted to the roll-bar, and I am using stock seats. This is for HPDE only.
So I called the guys at RacerWholesale to ask if I could "upgrade" to H-style. While talking to the customer service rep, he suggested that I cross the straps (behind the seat, just before attaching to the roll bar) and that would probably be my best bet to keep the straps together, short of getting race seats.
Anyone here have a big problem with that idea? Instructors, tech inspectors, and members of our beloved safety council? (I am a little tongue-in-cheek here, but I greatly value the inputs of all on this board who are concerned with safety, and are vocal about it.)

thanks - and sorry for the thread semi-highjack...

 

I have separate 5pt straps as well, although its only used for autocross. It came with a 6th web strap with a slot at each end, which each shoulder strap slips through and keeps them together. If this is the only difference between an H harness and one with separate straps, it should be easy to find this connecting strap, or have one made.

 

thanks for the info Matt. I was looking around, and lookee here what I found around the corner from my house....
http://www.ogracing.com/eshop/itemde...kef&itemid=143

that should do the trick, methinks.