I am interested in opinions regarding the formation of a spec class, similiar to Spec Miata, but instead using the Civic EG as the "base". The idea behind the class is to create a relatively inexpensive, but fast race car without the need for additional expensive parts that widen the performance gap between competitors.

All that is necessary is a suspension package (shocks, springs, etc.), engine package (header, air intake, exhaust), and tires (likely Toyos) based on a 92-95 SI base vehicle and I am positive a car can be completed for around $7500.00 or purchased complete and ready to race for under 10k. And don't forget a weight limit.

Spec Miata has become very popular and is a great way to get into close competitive racing without having to worry about your competitor's next performance upgrade. The only problem is the Miata, while it handles well and makes an awesome race car, is of no interest to anyone under 30. It was designed to bring back the days of the 50's roadster - it can also be considered a girl's car.

A class like this would be an ideal way to attract import fans that are interested in taking the plunge into racing. The only drawback I see is that the import crowd tends to be a hot rod type crowd and I am not sure that participants would be satisfied with the constraints a spec class would place upon them.

I have already begun researching this project and would appreciate any opinions. Thanks!

 

Girls cars are fun.

 

rumor mill has it there will be a spec E30 series running w/ NASA next year

 

The Civic DX would be a better choice. Less expensive and more available than the Si.

$7500 is a phony figure. People said the same about Spec Miata. Now the top SMs cost $15,000+ to build. It is guaranteed to happen with any nationally recognized spec class.

 

yes but those DX shells and good running cars are getting hard to find (just ask JMU1337)

 

i have 2 of them and paid less than 1000 for both of them combined!!! and they both run....hmmm.....and jmu didn't want my automatic and that thing rocks nads!

 

teal cars are for fehgs

 

Too many different motors put in those cars and not enough Si's made. Plus, the Si's bring mucho $$ when trying to purchase one.

And the D16Z6 isn't plentiful enough IMO. Spec Miata is successful because there were a ton of miatas sold, it is a FR layout, had a long production run and the model levels did not vary too much. There was a 1.6 and a 1.8--that's it. In the Eg chassis, there were 4 different motors to be had in the span of 4 years.

i think there is enough places to run the car anyways (IT, ECHC, etc).

 

...so open up the choices to include the EX and LX, Coupe and 4-door - all of the tubs that came with the Si engine, at a single spec weight. I would TOTALLY get behind this kind of effort and you will know why if you look at...

http://www.it2.evaluand.com

There are SIX EX coupes parked in the first four blocks that I travel out of my neighborhood. I almost never see an Si.

Sign me up.

Kirk

 

Outside of the tech specs for the car, what sanctioning body would you approach on this subject? Would this be a SoCal based club region only class?

 

Here is one of the big reasons that SM works. If you disregard the teams that have a ton of cash to spend on prepared cars, it is 'relatively cheap' to get into the class. Mazda makes it so easy to get into their race program. If you have a race license or are in the process of getting one & say that you plan on running in competion, you are in. Have you guys checked out the pricing that you can get parts for?

Honda supports WC & Grand Am. Period. A regular guy isn't going to get in the
program.

Don't get me wrong. I love my Honda. I think that they rock. A Civic just took second in the 12 Hours of Thunderhill OVERALL. I just don't think a spec series is going to happen without strong factory support.

 

Because I race with TCRA I thought that would be an interesting place to start. NASA seems to be open to new things. I believe a West Coast Honda Challenge (Honda/Acura race and time trial evens could probably stand alone without NASA) could definitely be a place for a Spec Civic class. East Coast as well.

We can see the success of Spec Miata. With Honda's larger following and fan base with numerous companies producing aftermarket parts (choices for series sponsors), a spec series based on Honda vehicles could be far more successful - especially to the new generation of aspiring racers.

This is just a concept at the moment. But I think it is viable.

 

That's JUST what NASA needs... another series...
*forgot we're talking about west-coast*

-- Personally, I don't see the appeal of this. There's a big honda following, but none of those people are going to get involved over a relatively stock civic. I guess there's something to be said for cost-control, personally, spec civic would be the last place I'd spend that amount of money. Anyway, it would be interesting to see how much of a following this type of thing could garner.... especially if honda-challenge successfully moves west-coast.


[Modified by JeffS, 3:31 PM 12/10/2002]

 

I agree NASA is likely not the place for another series. I watched an in car clip from an American Iron race at Willow Springs and there were Legends cars on the track at the same time..Legends cars, I could hardly believe it.

I guess the major question for everyone is...does racing equally equipped civics (any Honda for that matter) interest you?

 

From that IT2 hopeful site---> Due to their economy and popularity with young drivers, these cars will be increasingly available in coming years, as used-up, damaged or theft-recovered vehicles
LOL, how true...

 

Define "Spec Civic" as the models I mentioned earlier and apply the exising IT rules. This way you can run as a class-within-a-class in either SCCA (ITS currently), NASA, or ECHC H4. I can't see any reason not to include the next generation SOHC VTEC cars, too. There would be no need to do a spec class, however, if the SCCA didn't think that the EX and Si should run against the e36 325 in ITS...

Kirk

 

very nice.

 

i think another reason the spec miata class is so successful lies in the fact that miata enthusiats are, for the most part, people who prefer a stock-er car. they just want to enjoy driving the car they bought.

honda owners are typically more inclined to modification and large changes to the car's characteristics. i think this is where a spec honda class would fall-no interest from the community that supports the marque.

 

That was one of my concerns. There is so much aftermarket support for Hondas that limiting racers to specific components may not be realistic.

Keep the comments coming.

 

What makes a spec series successful is an abundance of cars. There simply were not many EG Si's sold. I've been looking for one in decent shape for 2 years now, I haven't found a single one. I have found a few but they need major cosmetic work or the engines are on their last legs.

If you're looking to make a spec Honda series you may want to look at the 91-93 Accord. It's relatively nimble and there are tons of them out there.

 

I am under the impression that the only difference between SIs and other models is the engine/trans and rear brakes. Anything else? My original intent was to use the EG SI specifications. If that meant taking a VX and adding the engine or rear suspension components to conform, so be it.

Thanks for the comments.

 

The Si & EX cars also have bigger front rotors. 10.2" or is it 10.3" which are the same size as the Integras. In order to go to this brake size, you need to get new uprights as the DX/VX/etc upright won't match the brake caliper bracket.

 

Data is fun!

I did a search at cars.com, for used '92-95 Civics within 500 miles of my home. While it doesn't represent some universal Truth about what it would cost to buy a donor car, it does illustrate the general state of the used Civic market. Ignoring listings that didn't provide (a) price, or (b) trim level, here is what I have to choose from:

CX = 9 choices, $2700-5200
DX = 70 choices, $1900-8999
EX = 113 choices, $1900-8995 (ignoring one idiot - $10k for a '95 w/85k miles?!)
LX = 58 choices, $2000-7995
Si = 10 choices, $3900-8600
VX = 2 choices, $2000-3500

Given the price difference, I don't think it makes "fun factor" sense to opt down to the DX, which surprised me - I expected a price break in the market. The idea of creating Si clones from VX or CX models is also going to be tough, given their scarcity.

I looked back at my notes and I was wrong about the LX having the bigger engine. Given this, how about the Si, EX Coupe or EX 4-door, at a spec'd race weight in the neighborhood of 2375#?

Kirk

PS - I should just fess up. I am going to build an EX (1996, probably) pretty much regardless. I want the more contemporary body, unless Mr. Kent or the guy that ran at the late MARRS event decide to sell their earlier ones. I just want other people to do the same and come run IT2 with me... Agenda? What agenda?

 

Si has different engine, adjustable stering column, larger gas tank, sunroof (not important), brakes, power mirrors, power steering, and possibly ABS (agin not important) .

That's just the list that I got when I posted about converting a car to an Si, there could be more differences.

 

Civic still costs too much? Got your solution right here.



Spec Chevette yO!