Hey guys, going off topic alittle....I have a problem....i plan to have about $10000 in a year and I can't decide to either get myself a '99 accord ex or a new '03 RSX type-s. The car is going to be a everyday car and a race car (auto cross, drag, etc.) I love accords I have one now but I can't decide which one to get. ANy input would be great! Thanks



[Modified by pisces21, 3:24 PM 12/9/2002]

 

stick with fifth gen and invest your money, if you want to track the car you are gonna need the disposable income it provides. Brakes, tires, clutches, etc. are not cheap

 

Rsx.

 

neither, stick with the 5th gen

 

keep the '94, build the 5h!t out of it.

 

RSX type-S. Will kill the accord any day with just a Hondata ecu and intake.

99 Ex coupe? Heavy *****...underpowered...

 

Whats the point of a Hondata if you only have an intake? It will yield a whole 2whp.

 

Thanks guys..i'm thinking of going with the RSX too.I can't keep my accord, I got it from gramps like a year ago and am forever doing repairs and now pops wants me to sell the car and get a newer one (go figure). Well at least I get a newer car...Thanks again guys.

 

a newer car is always better than a older car, depending on how many miles you have. if you have less than 100k on the accord, keep it ...otherwise, just go with the rsx-s. i would.

i think the 94 is still better than the newer99 accord.

 

http://www.hondata.com/k20a2release.html

Highlights of K-20 engine + Hondata + CAI

- 12-20 peak WHEEL hp from a stock RSX depending on the dyno and modifications (ie CAI).
- 15-20 ft/lb torque increase between 2500-3500 rpm.
- Peak torque now at 3200 rpm on an unmodified RSX.
- VTEC dip eliminated.
- Very flat smooth torque curve. 95% of peak torque available from 2500-8000 rpm.
- Rev limiter optionally raised to 8600 RPM (see valve spring tech information).
- VTEC point lowered to 5200 rpm for cars with intake systems.
- Passes Californian smog testing (no measurable difference from stock).
- Fully dealer compatible - works with all Honda scan tools and equipment.

on http://www.vtec.net, they have a whole writeup on a dyno day for a type S with Hondata + CAI only. It was producing only 10 less wheel hp than a 240hp S2000 strapped to the same dyno. Wow...


[Modified by RotaryBzzz, 3:14 PM 12/9/2002]

 

And import tuner claims 15whp from an APC short ram.
That doesnt mean anything. For all we know, hp could have decreased at 5250rpm making the new peak torque simply in a different location on the power band.
WTF is VTEC dip?
Flat curve? Means nothing either. The rest is hypothetical since you wont be seeing 8000rpm.
Who cares? All he's got is an intake, 8600 RPM isnt possible with a stock valvetrain.
VAFC y0!

How much does this Hondata cost?

Someone posted a dyno chart of a B18C1 with i/h/e, and some other BS bolt ons and the only difference his Hondata Stage 2 made was 2whp and a little torque. The hp and tq curves were virtually identicle. I'm not saying that its impossibly, nor am I flaming you, Im just saying its unlikely to do all of that which is claimed.

 

I hear you man, I hear you! I'm one of the first guys to doubt "dyno-numbers" thrown out representing vague color graphs in these Ricer magazines. But, with the thoughtfully written article from Shawn Church...i was sold. I've been following his editorials for awhile and they seem very consistent and impartial.

Check out his write-up from vtec.net

http://www.vtec.net/articles/view-ar...ticle_id=45231

Yes, the phrase "dyno-proven" has basically turned into a bunch of b.s. lately. BUT, having had a research background in a different life, and seeing the methodical - dogmatic - evaluation (even using standard deviations) from this guy on this product, i was impressed.

-----
Re the valves...you didn't scroll down far enough
"Rev limits and Valve springs

Based on information from TODA Japan, the Type-S and Type-R have the same exhaust valve springs. However the intake side uses F20C (S2000) intake springs for the outer spring and a Type-R for the inner spring. TODA also mentioned that Honda is now using single springs of a higher class material for the newer Type-R's.
The interpretation here is that the stock valves are good. We have had a test vehicle (K20A2 in a Civic Si) running with an 8900 Rev limit for 2 months now. In this car you change gear when the Rev counter points to 20 mph!"

Edit: The cost for the Hondata was $595. Also too, the implication here is that the [new] K-series engines have alot of unrealized potential


[Modified by RotaryBzzz, 4:51 PM 12/9/2002]

 

I've never doubted hondata's research before, but this is really stretching it. Honda ECU's are already pretty well tuned from the factory, and unless the N/A setup is pretty radical (ie: 2point6), or F/I, it has shown not to do all that much. However, I would like to see myself proven wrong, because then I will start saving up for a Hondata right now.

 

Hondata is also very picky when tuned, you really need someone who knows what they are doing that has worked with Hondata before to get the power out of it. The guy with the B18 might of had tuning issues(purely speculation). Remembr that Hondata remaps fuel curves and other variables that regular VAFC do not.

I still have my reservations about the RSX. Of course this is purely a "road race performance" viewpoint though.

Edit: There is a dip at crossover on most VTEC engines, almost like a fuel lapse in the face of higher air flow. We noticed a pretty substanial "dip" in Corey's prelude afte the first SMSP header prototype


[Modified by urbanlegend21, 8:34 PM 12/9/2002]

 

You might be right. Good point.

 

I had a choice to put an h22 in my 94 accord but at the end I put up
03 RSX type s, now with 1000 miles I happy with the RSX

 

Nothing feels better than having a new car...well..almost(forget about
brand new Geo nightmare)..
Go get the RSX-S with 6spd
if you are ready to get jammed into a smaller car.
I was in the same situation now you were..
but I am poor so
rsx,celica and accord.
i picked accord after the test drive since they are kinda too small
for my butt..
but I have no idea why rsx resale price is kinda low imo..

 

Your definately right about Honda's ECU's being very well tuned. The reason why I think Hondata gets soo much with just a simple ecu + CAI is that Honda is holding back on the power-figures for the K-series. You know...so 3 years down the road, they have something to boast about when they release a new model year. Kinda like: "Introducing the 2005 RSX Type-S. NOW with 220 HP!!!". Like how honda has done the integra from 90-93...they "added" 10 hp during the run.

Shoot, I'm already saving for my TSX's hondata chip and they haven't even released the car yet.

 

Good point. RSX Type R y0!

 

Yeah I have money saved up for a h22 w/ about 2gs for the N/A but the old man says to scrap the car (man what a heartache) its been in numerous accidents and mad money needs to be spent repairing it (not that I mind). so in the end, its either a 99 accord or an rsx.....i'm guessing the rsx too! Thanks all

 

are these really comparable cars? A '99 EX 4cylinder model vs a '03 RSX-S?

My sister picked up a brand new (at the time) '02 Accord EXV6 for $23,500 back in January of '02.

That's what the RSX-S goes for brand new. A '99 EX 4cylinder should be SUPER CHEAP in comparison.

Just some food for thought...

 

point being?