I just got my car dyno'ed at DSR.. 185 hp
Lawerence only adjusted the intake cam to +1.5... exhaust -2
afraid of valve to piston contact.. could it go more??

 

cam gear settings have to be done to specific car while dyno tunning...get on a dyno and then set them. Can't just set them.

 

What he said. My optimum cam timing settings for my Stage 2's were way different than what I expected, and way different than optimum with CTR cams. Dyno...Dyno...Dyno...

 

The max you can advance the intake cam and retard the exhaust cam depends on what pistons you are running. The best way to know is to clay the motor with the cams advanced/retarded as far as you think you might go. I was able to go +4 intake and -4 exhaust, but my optimum setting was actually 0 intake and +2 exhaust. I ordered custom JE pistons with the valve reliefs cut 2.0mm deeper to allow for bigger cams and more adjustment of the cams. And I clayed the motor before I did the final assembly so I would know how much I could play with the cam timing.
Without claying the motor, there is really no way to know how much you can adjust the cams, and a mistake could be costly.

 

It seems like I should be hitting more than 185hp and 120tq.. or am i wrong?
I have a 96 JDM Type R motor, Compression 215 all cylinders, c/r of 11.2
milled head, AEM cold air intake, AEM cam gears, DC 4-1 header, VAFC, MSD 6AL, RC 310 injectors, B&M fuel pressure reg and gauge, Skunk2 stage 2 cams, Skunk2 valves, Skunk2 springs, Skunk2 retainers, Skunk2 intake manifold, Skunk2 exhaust, Skunk2 ECU...i think that is it...
and in your opinion, how quick in the 1/4 mile those #'s can get me?? its in a 93 fully stripped civic coupe... thanks guys...Oh base run was 177hp and 117tq..

 

1. What kind of dyno?
2. If you want the most outof all those parts get a hondata.
3. Why dd u get the Skunk2 IM for a ITR motor?
4. Yes, I think you should b making more power, at least 200whp.
Thats a littl low for stage 1's, let alone 2's. How many miles on the motor.

 

You could probably advance the degree more and not have valve to piston contact, but you might have valve to valve contact.

Jeff, at Import builders or Skunk2 might be able to answer you question own the maxium tolerances on the cams.

 

seems to me that the skunk stage 2's only make good power with alot of compression. I would look into a thinner head gasket and lots of tuning but your clearances are gonna be tight with a milled head.

 

You shouldn't have to worry about piston to valve contact with only 1.5 degree advance on the intake cam. Valve to valve contact wouldn't be a concern either as an advance on the intake and retard on the exhaust would widen the lobe seperation angle.

Definitely your setup is capable of better numbers. Is your DC 4-1 the regular stock-sized 2.0" collector model? Maybe go for the JDM 4-1 model and 2.5" cat, likely would release a good amount of power. That stock-sized header is likely keeping those cams from breathing like they should.

edit: Also about your ECU, what Skunk2 program is it? If there is only one Skunk2 ECU program I'm sure it's doing the wrong things for your package too. It seems you should have the potential for 200whp+ with the right exhaust package and tuning on the ECU end. You have a scan of your graph?


[Modified by SurferX, 1:19 AM 11/28/2002]

 

I agree that with only 1.5 degrees of advance on the intake cam there should not be a problem. But, advancing the intake and retarding the exhaust cams narrows the lobe separation angle, and increases the chances of valve to valve interference. The exhaust valve is closing as the intake valve is opening, make sense...?

 

That does make sense, I will have to find that diagram I had looked at showing the cam changes affects on on the LSA and see if it was wrong in some way.

 

If you are talking about the diagram on T.I. that M.D. used to illustrate lobe separation angle, the direction of rotation was wrong for a Honda.

 

Here is a modified version:

Cheers.

 

thank you for the replies.. I will go get my graphs later today and let you know.. its a little hectic right now... but thank you guys...

 

to b19coupe.

I wonder though, my tuner dialed in more overlap but I gained low end power from it which is opposite what I would think. But perhaps with advance of the intake cam and earlier valve closing it may have increased dynamic compression a little and made up for it giving me more power in the low end. Also the fuel pressure was raised 2psi and ignition timing advanced 2 degrees (although I am led to believe on OBD2b the ECU overrides distributor timing anyway) so I guess the cam gears weren't totally isolated at that point. The VAFC started doing it's stuff after 5000 RPM.



Sorry to take it off topic though, let's see those charts with the skunk cams.


[Modified by SurferX, 10:31 AM 11/28/2002]

 

Nice chart! I don't have scanner so I can't post mine. Max power was 199.6 and max torque was 140.6. My engine is 1932cc and should actually be making more power than it is. Building a new motor with G.E. sleeves , bigger cams, and gonna get a P. and P. head. We will see ...

 

I have a similar set up in a 93 si, usdm b18c5 skunk2 stage2 cams, valve springs, retainers, dc jdm 4-1 header, hondata stage 3, b&m fuel pressure reg w/gauge, rs akimoto intake(shorty) 2.5 inch test pipe, tanabe rm exhaust W/bottle neck. stock compression, stock injectors.
I made 184 hp on a dynojet and we did not have time to adjust the cam gears, that 184 was with them set at zero. I was a little disapointed too
run 13.2 @104 on 20x8 M/T on 14inch stock steel wheels, launch @7200 rpm

 

Yeah I think these cams just plain suck. My roommate has them in his JDM R motor with i/h/e etc. and it only put down 187 with plenty of dyno tuning. Plus the car used to run 9.0's in the 1/8th with Toda A's UNTUNED and now it runs about 9.20 on average. Plus the low end/midrange isn't even comparable. Skunk2 stageII stink.

 

Bigger cams will actually lose you power if you don't have the right mods. To run Toda B & C's, Skunk Stage 2 & 3's, etc. you will need more compression. You will lose power with these cams on a stock compression motor.

 

I'm happy with the cams and long before i bought the cams looked at the big picture(raise comp, port head) and decided that these will be a good choice for that.
The numbers are kind of weak but the car pulls very hard. I think that with 22x8x13 slicks and new struts, and tuned gears i can break 12's
If you figure that a stock engine puts out about 160-165, then 184 is not to bad.

 

ok.. i originally posted this post... I just bought a 2.5 carsound cat and DC JDM 4-1 from inline... Xmas sale... I will let you know results after I dyno again... thanks for your replies

 

ya, I also think the stage 2's suck, but this opinion is all based on here-say and posted dyno graphs. Looks like stage 1's with stock compression are making more power than stage 2's with high compression.