Honda Civic / Del Sol (1992 - 2000) EG/EH/EJ/EK/EM1 Discussion

Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

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Old Sep 28, 2023 | 08:38 AM
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Chance EG's Avatar
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Default Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

I'm getting extremely close to finishing the full restomod build that I've dragged out for a few years on my EG Si. I bought the car in very neglected condition and have ended up replacing damn near everything on the car.

I picked up a Mustang a few months ago, 89 GT that had likely sat unused for at least a few years before I purchased it. The car is in much better condition than the Civic was when I picked it up and is almost 100% stock, but regardless it's a 34 year old car that's stretching it's legs for the first time in awhile so a lot of components have been reaching their natural EOL and death dates.

With the Civic one thing that stressed me out a lot while building it and caused me a lot of anxiety was how rare and scarce parts are becoming - and I see all the time now people here struggling to find parts needed to finish their builds or get their cars back on the road. It doesn't help that Honda pulls flat out bullshit maneuvers as well like filing copyright claims against people who try to remanufacture discontinued parts, like when they filed a cease and desist against the websites that were hosting 3D CAD files from people trying to recreate things like old interior components.

This is a huge contrast to the Ford, where I can go on a website like LMR and find endless lists of new remanufactured parts - Interior, engine, electronics, etc. I can get full printed circuit boards, full new clusters and dashboards, etc. Hell you can buy a fully remanufactured classic Mustang chassis on Dynacorn, licensed by Ford.

I'm just mentioning this because it's disappointing as hell that Honda operates the way they do. It makes it really difficult to enjoy these older Hondas - If something breaks on my car or I get into an accident I'm basically fucked. It's one thing for a company to not want to support one of their old products first hand, or continue producing parts for a 30 year old car - I understand that completely, but it's entirely another and much shittier thing to actively get in the way of 3rd party companies trying to keep an old platform alive and stifle production when HONDA THEMSELVES don't even sell the damn parts anymore.
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Old Sep 28, 2023 | 11:51 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Don't forget Honda lobbies against the right to repair.
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Old Sep 28, 2023 | 01:03 PM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Originally Posted by Ryanthegreat1
Don't forget Honda lobbies against the right to repair.
Oh I haven't even seen that one...

Sooooo gaaaaayyyyyyy
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Old Sep 28, 2023 | 01:31 PM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

You nailed it on the head with the term 'licensed'.

My wife is in the licensing business and used to represent Ford (and occasionally worked with Honda) at her previous employer. Her area of business was gifts & toys - Think retro logo signs and model cars and stuff, or a toy lawnmower at Lowe's with a Honda logo on it. Ford was way more open to licensing their logo to items that represented their brand, but not necessarily a precise product. Hona was wayyy more picky about their image and keeps their IP very close to the chest. Think 'You can't just put a Honda sticker on that lawnmower, it's clearly not a Honda lawnmower'. They're just not willing to license out their stuff as freely as the big domestics are. It's not about money (everyone makes money when a license is issued), it's about maintaining a certain image and level of quality control... for better or for worse for the end consumer.

I work for Honda and I see it every day. We might have a set of LCAs for a 10th gen Civic, but we can't sell them because the HPD laser etched onto them is the old logo. Same part, different logo.

Next year, all of my trackside uniforms go in the trash since HPD is going away and everything has to become HRC. Not exactly sustainable, but I guess I needed new shirts anyway.
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Old Sep 29, 2023 | 05:40 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Just such a stifling and buzzkill way to operate.

It's definitely a difference in culture. Japan is WAY more protective of intellectual property. Nintendo is extremely lawsuit happy with anyone who tries to recreate their old games in newer engines, or emulate, etc.
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Old Oct 1, 2023 | 01:53 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Heck, Im still amazed that you found a STOCK fox body.. Ive owned 4 Mustangs so far, and I always have to have the same requirement V8 Stick Shift.GT, It usually takes me about 6-8 months to find one that is stock. and not all clapped out, Send pix
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Old Oct 1, 2023 | 05:47 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Originally Posted by youstolemybeer
Heck, Im still amazed that you found a STOCK fox body.. Ive owned 4 Mustangs so far, and I always have to have the same requirement V8 Stick Shift.GT, It usually takes me about 6-8 months to find one that is stock. and not all clapped out, Send pix
Cosmetically, and I'd say overall it's in extremely nice condition. I replaced a lot of little things like switches/window motors/fuel pump etc when I picked it up, just old parts reaching their end of life. Compression tested the engine, flat 160 across all 8 cylinders on a cold test.
The only mods when I got it were the Cervini hood and spoiler, one piece headlights, and the wheels. Exhaust has mufflers on it which are leaking.

Planning on a heads/cam build on the stock block, TKX transmission 5 lug conversion and Maximum Motorsports suspension, keeping the live rear axle. I have a Mishimoto radiator kit and fan/shroud combo ready to go on, the factory radiator clutch is going out and I have a leak in my heater core so that needs replaced as well. Have headers and exhaust sitting in a room waiting for installation.
Got some bad news a couple days ago, was supposed to have subframe braces welded in but the shop told me the driver's side frame rail is off center in the rear by about an inch(?). I'll need it fixed at a frame shop.







Edit: Oh, and whatever fenderwell intake is on it and K&N filter - I'm not sure what brand the intake is, probably something pretty cheap. Throttle body still stock.
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Old Oct 3, 2023 | 07:11 PM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

It is depressing to see Honda themselves are not supporting their fans by not supporting us keeping old favorites going. Yet their museum cars have all new OEM parts to keep them minty fresh, but only available to Honda as needed.
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Old Oct 4, 2023 | 01:49 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Originally Posted by TomCat39
It is depressing to see Honda themselves are not supporting their fans by not supporting us keeping old favorites going. Yet their museum cars have all new OEM parts to keep them minty fresh, but only available to Honda as needed.
if they did support us, then there would be no reason to sell new cars
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Old Oct 4, 2023 | 03:53 AM
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Default Re: Chit Chat - Intellectual Property, Old Ford vs. Honda

Originally Posted by youstolemybeer
if they did support us, then there would be no reason to sell new cars
That's 110% not true.

Most people are completely unwilling to work on their own vehicles to the extent that we are. And labor still costs extra money to get work done at shops.
Remanufacturing old parts doesn't mean that your old vehicle will suddenly have the new commodities, comfort, or capabilities found in newer vehicles.
Most people still think new=good.
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