Honda Accord (1990 - 2002) Includes 1997 - 1999 Acura CL

Help diagnose A/C problem

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Old May 20, 2018 | 10:39 AM
  #1  
mikee75's Avatar
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From: Portland, OR
Default Help diagnose A/C problem

Hello, new to the forum, I've done some research but I have not seen anyone with this same problem.
2001 Accord LX, 2.3L v-tech, 5 spd

The problem:
A/C compressor engages but will only run for about 10 seconds, then continuously cycles about 10 seconds on, one minute off...
Outside temp doesn't seem to matter, same pattern of cycling on 60 degree day and 90 degree day (low humidity in Pacific NW), on 80 degree day air was 60 degrees out of the vents.
Air temp out of the vents is constant, driving, idling, reving engine makes no difference, even the cycling of the compressor only makes it change about 1-2 degrees.

What I've tried:
I suspected low charge, rented manifold kit and bought one 12oz can of refrigerant, no sealants or dyes
Low side pressure 20psi resting, dropped to 0 immediately when compressor engaged
High pressure, 80 resting, went up to about 120 when engaged
reving the engine (2500 rpm) made no difference on these pressures

So I'm still thinking low charge, maybe three or four ounces of freon will get me some good numbers, I tried adding a little freon at a time about 5-10 seconds with valve open each time, saw no difference. I ended up adding the entire can, the pressures did not change and the air temp coming out of the vents actually went up to about 65-70 degrees.
How can adding 12 oz of freon make no difference in pressure readings?

So I'm stumped, I know there was some freon in system before charging or the compressor would not engage, I know it's possible that I've overcharged the system at this point but if I did shouldn't I have higher pressures? I'm afraid to add any more because I don't want to overcharge it (the entire system holds 23 oz)

Compressor still cycles in same pattern as before I charged system, could this be a bad compressor? Something electrical?

I don't want to throw too much money at this but I'm thinking evac and recharge from a professional and cross my fingers.

Any advice greatly appreciated.
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Old Jun 1, 2018 | 10:30 PM
  #2  
mikee75's Avatar
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From: Portland, OR
Default Re: Help diagnose A/C problem

Update:
I have had the system evacuated and recharged, the tech said that the system was "several ounces low" It now has the correct charge assuming there is no leak. Unfortunately this made no difference, same pattern of cycling, same 60 degree air out of the vents. I have observed the evaporator form ice in the short time that the compressor is engaged so I assume if I could keep the compressor on longer it would work properly.
I have ruled out fuses, relays, loose connections, etc.
Interestingly bridging the pressure sensor did not change the pattern of cycling, so either the pressure sensor is faulty or it's doing it's job because the pressures are either too high or too low.
I plan to:
Test pressures again (next warm day)
Leak test the system
Test temperature sensor in the evaporator

I'll update this post if/when I figure this out.

Still looking for some suggestions...
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Old Jun 1, 2018 | 11:02 PM
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Default Re: Help diagnose A/C problem

If the compressor cuts off when the evaporator frosts over then the expansion valve is bad. Replace the expansion valve and the receiver/drier, vacuum the system for an hour, check that it holds vacuum which means there are no leaks, and then recharge to spec and you should be good to go.
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Old Jun 3, 2018 | 11:46 AM
  #4  
mikee75's Avatar
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From: Portland, OR
Default Re: Help diagnose A/C problem

Originally Posted by holmesnmanny
If the compressor cuts off when the evaporator frosts over then the expansion valve is bad. Replace the expansion valve and the receiver/drier, vacuum the system for an hour, check that it holds vacuum which means there are no leaks, and then recharge to spec and you should be good to go.
Thank you for your reply.
I was starting to suspect the expansion valve, but I wasn't seeing the classic signs like the compressor running constantly or frost in the vents. But it might explain why I dumped 12 oz of Freon in and the pressure didn't change...
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Old Jun 3, 2018 | 12:19 PM
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mikee75's Avatar
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From: Portland, OR
Default Re: Help diagnose A/C problem

Update #2
we finally had a warm day, 81 degrees, 29% humidity
resting pressures were equal at about 90 psi

Max cool, fan speed 4, recirculate off, windows down yielded the following:
Compressor on @ idle, 10 psi low/ 125 psi high, pressure remained constant
Compressor on @ 2500 rpm 8-9 psi low/165-190 psi high, pressure slowly climbed to 190 until compressor cycled off
Compressor off 25 psi/115 psi, held steady
The whole time I've got 60 degree air coming out of the vents, occasionally raising to 65-70 degrees briefly.

I also did a leak test and found nothing.

So my question for you all is what does this mean?

I know my low pressure is way too low, but my high side is about right. I suspect faulty expansion valve but the labor on that is going to be $$$! Any other thoughts?

Thanks for your help.
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Old Jul 4, 2018 | 12:37 PM
  #6  
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From: Portland, OR
Default Re: Help diagnose A/C problem

For those with similar problems...
My A/C is working great now, 40-45 degrees out of the vents on 90 degree day. On cooler days the air temp stays at 40. Haven't had any days over 90 here yet...

The weird thing is I didn't do anything, I kept running the A/C and it slowly started to improve. I started getting brief periods where the temp would drop to 50-55 degrees only to go back up to 60 (I've kept the thermometer in the vent to monitor it). Then it was consistently at 50-55 degrees, occasionally dropping to about 45. Then finally after running the A/C a lot for about two weeks it actually got down to 40 and stayed there, it's been working great ever since.

The only thing I can think of is that the expansion valve was partially clogged with old gummy/waxy oil. This is possible because I had gone over six months without running my A/C. Maybe after circulating the oil through the system repeatedly it finally loosened up? It's a guess but it's also a lesson to run the A/C during the winter to keep the oil moving around.

I wish I had a sure-fire fix to offer but I don't. I think the big takeaway is if your compressor is engaging and you know you have the correct charge just run the **** out of your AC and hope it starts working.
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