I have a 1997 f22b2 special edition accord thats been parked for bit do to the fact i cant get the woodruff key off..ive done plenty of timing belt changes but this one has me stumped..
i first lined up the crank and made sure the cam sprocket is facing UP but when i take my cap off its pointing to #4..all rockers are loose on #4 so its on the compression stroke..if i turn the crank 1 complete revolution the rotor will be pointing to #1 but the cam sprocket UP marking will be facing down..
can the sprocket be installed upside down..i did nothing with the disributor so its not 180 off..it ran when i took it apart..its like #4 is #1..

 

are you sure the dizzy isnt 180 off ?

1342
180 degrees would get you back to 1

 

F22B2 and F22B1 have different clocking of the #1 cylinder on the distributor. # 4 & #1 swap and # 3 & #2 swap places. So if you are looking at a B1 diagram your layout is going to be wrong for the B2.
Firing order is still 1-3-4-2

 

My rotor is facing the rear of rhe car..the rockers are loose on #4. The #1 cam lobe are beginning its intake stroke..the cam marker UP is up and crank nipple are lined up..if i go 360 on crank the rotor is facing forword but the cam is upside down and #1 rockers are loose..#1 by timing belt near driver fender..its crazy..its like the cam sprocket it put on wrong

 

thanks..

 

Lets cover a few things.
If #1 intake is about to open, then #4 is on its power stroke and is at TDC. The rotor on the F22B2 should be pointing down and back at the firewall for #4.
As for the cam sprocket being upside down, dunno. B2 and B1 cars have the same sprocket.
If the engine ran before you took it apart and put everything back then it should run. Does it not?

Just to clarify, you have an F22B2(non-VTEC) engine. Spark plug tubes are on the intake side of the valve cover, and the coil for the distributor is external?

As for removing the woodruff key, as long as you can get the crank pulley off, there really is no need to pull the key. 96/97 engines are tighter around the crank pulley with the belt due to the sensors but they will not prevent you from sliding the belt off/on.

Pictures would be very helpful.

As for the camshaft pulley ¯\_(ツ)_/¯

 

thanks again..its definitely on #4 tdc and the rotor it pointing to #4..but the cam sprocket is facing up..weird..as for the crank pulley..its stuck on..the woodruff key dont budge..i can usually tap on the gear and pull the key but its stuck..the seal leaks and i was going to replace it..ill load some pics shortly

 

https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-crx-ef-civic-1988-1991-3/cam-180%2A-off-wtf-2982420/

This is what going on with mine..i rotated my crank 180 and aligned notch on crank pulley and tb cover and with the cam sproket facing down with the 2 notches parallel with the head and now the rotor facing towards the front of car....#1 cylinder..and now all rockers are loose on #1.TDC .wow..somehow my camshaft sprocket is 180 off but still runs..how it came from factory is beyond me..

 

during normal operation, the crank spins twice for every one cam turn

 

Thanks..got it..appreciate everyone's help..now to deal with the stuck woodruff key..timing gear is offset and the key is twisted..been stuck for 9 months..thanks

 

just use a punch with a hammer and hit the key flush on its face, it will eventually give up, they get seized up over time

 

flush on its face..from the top pushing it toward the crank or from front pushing it back in...not much left to it..its been stuck for a bit and ive tugged on it for hours..appreciate your time

 

<br />flush on its face..from the top pushing it toward the crank or from front pushing it back in...not much left to it..its been stuck for a bit and ive tugged on it for hours..appreciate your time

 

hit it from front to back but it won't clear, you will then just grab the timing gear and bring it forward and it should slide off and the key will fall

you are just trying to shock the key enough so it loosens up the rust that has binded it onto the gear

if you've bought a new key already you will see what it looks like

 

depending on if you got enough room you can get a two jaw puller on the gear and put the crank bolt on and then just pull the gear off, but it depends on if the gear has enough lip on it to grab with the puller

 

so push it back in a little or wack the top..sorry for the dumb question but ive tried for days to get this off..no room for puller..i hate to push it in further..#1 or #2 on picture..thanks

 

If the key has jammed or rusted on then tapping it in/out up/down side/side will break it free and hopefully release everything.

As for the camshaft sprocket. I can only assume someone probably munched the slot/hole for the alignment pin and they simply rotated the pulley 180° and machined it with a new slot/hole to fit the camshaft.
As long as the distributor is pointing to #1 and the engine is on TDC #1(far right cylinder) then you should be fine.

 

before i tear back into this..since my cam is facing UP...crank is lined up... the rotor is pointing to #4 on the cap...and #4 rockers are loose..TDC..my question is can #4 be at TDC with all the info mentioned above?..it seems that normally if everything is line up #4 TDC would be when the cam UP is facing down..i reall would hate to take the cam sprock off and see it messed up..thanks for everyone's help.

 

The crank is 180°, flat plane cranskshaft. Typically, and on Honda F series, the two middle throws(#2;#3) are 180° from the outer throws(#1;#4)

This gif is flipped so #1 is on the left and #4 is on the right, but you get the idea.(this would be a correct orientation while sitting in the car)
To determine what part of the 4stroke stage the engine is in is to simply look at the camshaft lobes.
If the piston is at TDC and the lobes on the cam are 180° away from the valves(opening/closing) then you can determine that the cylinder is on its compression to power stroke and the distributor will be lined up with that cylinders spark plug tower.
If the piston is at TDC and the lobes on the cam are near the valves, exhaust should be closing/closed and intake should be opening/open, which would indicate the end of the exhaust stroke and begining of the intake stroke.
Simply, if there is valve action close to TDC then it is not the firing stroke. If there is no valve action imminent then you are on the power stroke.

If you have have the timing belt off, a simple way to clarify this is to rotate the camshaft and watch the valvetrain. To be safe. Rotate the crank 90° from TDC, doesn't matter if it is before or after. With a flat crank all the pistons will be about halfway down the cylinders and clear of the valves. Now you can freely rotate the camshaft and observe the valve action.
This is also the easiest/fastest way to adjust the rockers during belt installation, since you don't have to crank the whole engine over and it doesn't matter if you spin the cam backwards for easy rotation using the cam bolt.

Normally when someone uses 'TDC' in discussion it is in reference to #1 cylinder on it's firing to power stroke. Valves closed, fresh air/fuel charge compressed, valve sparking.

Since the Honda F22 uses mechanical lifters, there is end gap to allow for expansion of parts, so when cold the rockers may be loose during the exhaust to intake stroke. But there will be a slight overlap for scavenging purposes usually so there would be very little, if any, play with both rockers during the exhaust/intake stroke.

Since we don't have pictures, and don't know the history of the car, there may be a few parts that have been changed around to make work for whatever reason.
If the cam is at #1 TDC(compression/firing) but the cam sprocket itself is upside down, then the cam sprocket may have been damaged and the easiest fix at the time was to flip/machine the sprocket and fit a new camshaft keyway to repair the damage. I know plenty of machinists who would rather spend 2hrs milling a part to work rather than ordering a replacement.
If you are positive the cam is at #1 TDC, and the distributor is at #1 firing, then I would suspect the cam sprocket has been modified for whatever reason.

It is hard to tell what you are seeing without pictures of the camshaft lobe orientation.

If #1 is at TDC, the lobes will be away from the lifters, no valvetrain action imminent. At the same time #4 will have the lobes actuating the rockers, exhaust closing while intake is about to open.

 

Thanks mad mike..well explained..its definitely upside down..the rotor is facing #4 and the lobes are 180 from the rockers and #1 intake is about to open and the exhaust has just completed its cycle..appreciate it greatly..

 

Just to be redundantly clear. Which way is the cam sprocket facing as per your following description?
#4 is at TDC firing, so the cam sprocket should have the 'UP' arrow facing down, but from your previous descriptions the cam sprocket has the 'UP' sprocket facing up, yes?

 

its facing up....crank lined up..cam lobes on #4 are 180 from rocker and both loose and rotor is pointing toward #4 tower..#1 exhuast lobe just completing cycle and intake beginning..its 180 off..i bought the car from someone who put the tb on and it had no power..i thought it was off a tooth..put the crank lined up with the lower tb cover..the cam sprocket facing up and notches parallel with head..and took cap off and noticed the rotor was pointing toward rear of car..#4...

 

Well i dug into it today..i backed the crank 90 and rotated the cam..i turned it until the rotor was facing #1.. The intake opened it is about 4 o'clock and the exhaust it around 7 o'clock about to open..the tension is off the rockers on #1 but #4 has tension slightly .......#1 cylinder near timing belt and rotor facing radiator..but the thing is the UP is facing down..f22b2 with tec distributor and external coil..does this sound correct about the cam lobes in the correct position?..im nervous about starting it..ive done several tb on these engines but this one has me stumped..

 

Also..should both #1 and #4 rockers be loose..#4 is exhuast is tight....

 

If done some work on it recently..the cam gear is upside down for some reason.i know this because i attached my leak down tester on #1.. Near the tb...and put a balloon on the tip..turned engine ccw and watched the intake valve open then close..next balloon pumped up..i also had a straw in #4 until it reached tdc..and the rotor is facing #1 but the cam UP is down..weeirddd..
the problem is the car has no power and runs crappy..i thought it was the converter and took it off..same result..cleaned egr ports..they were spotless
i have factory oem plugs..wires..cap..rotor..all new..at idle it will run smooth then make a rapid clicking sound..starts missing..then smoothes out..if i rev it up its real slow to wind up...coughs and sputtered all through the climb..the above parts have zero miles..
I did a compression test..160 cold on all cylinders..leak down at 100 psi shows 20% loss in all cylinders.
Car has 85,000 original miles..i did a valve adjustment..i made sure all the valves were loose on each cylinder at TDC..super loose..010 intake..012 exhaust..stone cold..
Dirty injectors? Still out of time?...bent valve?..whatever this rapid clicking noise at idle that makes it miss i think is the problem..when it stops the engine smooths out