He got his final pass last monday and he's being banned from the all motor NHRA class ... I'm sure he wanted to go out with a big bang and he busted out a 10.04 e/t ... we'll no motor all motor class for his rotary ... its all FWD cars now ... finally NHRA getting some brains ???


Greg

 

His motor should have been in a 6 cyl class. 3 rotors=6 cyl. I wonder how he will do with a 2 rotor?

 

actually its about time. if you looked at the rule book early on...it said cars must be i believe model year 88 and up. next thing you know you see 1g rx7's in there and nobody is complaining. now put that motor in the next bodystyle and it would have alot more weight added to the car.

oh...i thought it was 2 rotor bridge/ported

 

Im sure Padilla will come out with his 2 rotor just as crazy as his motor now. Isnt there some 2 rotor all motor 7's coming out next season in the low 10's also? all coming from PR.

 

Amazing for Padilla! Good to hear about the NHRA rules too.

 

yeah, he had many advantages:

1) RWD
2) non "H" pattern seq shift
3) bridgeported high compression 2 liter rotary
4) non OEM rear end
5) see 3) above
6) see 5) above LOL

yeah, I hate them rotaries ... even on boosted motors those things dump out 1.5 exhaust pulse to 1 pulse form a piston motor ...

as for the Boriquas, they have 5 street all motor 10sec "Roach" chassis runnign around PR, I saw them with my own eyes, and my wife's cousin is one of the banditos LOL ...

those guys would drive anything around over there and they would love to compete, but their main setback in competing is getting their cars shipped stateside to our events, but they try to hitch rides with Seguel Racing but only so many cars can come.


But yeah, next year will be interesting, I was giving up on NHRA for a while because of their crap rules, but now I can see myself trying to compete on the East coast events ... good money in NHRA also.

Greg


[Modified by CHEETAH, 6:19 PM 11/4/2002]

 

LOL! HAHAHAHAHA! Greg vs Roataries for life! You've been battling those guys since your 4 door GSR then the Frog , article on Honda-Hybrid. Def they need to be in aa separate class, since I've been racing back in the day of MIR events EIP Tuning ones Rotaries were alwaays with the 6 cylinder class, NHRA was on something.

 

The new rules **** me off, if they are allowing 2 rotary power plants to stay then they should allow 6 cylinder FWD's to stay as well.

As you all have said, 2 rotors are equal to 6 cylinders so why allow one and not the other?

NHRA says we can not be competitive, If only I built a big motor this year and did not stay with stock displacement. Oh well, I still have IDRC.

Regardless, what the 4 cylinders folks are doing all motor is awesome, the old school rotary technology does not belong racing with them, it is a horrible thing to see.

Anthony

 

I'm pretty sure that the car can hit 9's...hell the damn thing has a passenger's seat and full doors with OEM glass, just imaging if someone removed some weight. Nice guy though, pretty funny.

 

i definatly agree with anthony on that 6 cyl should still be allowed if 2 rotos is allowed. the only reason i think they dont want 6cyl is cause there afraid that someone will dominate with one, like in the case with padilla

 

technically, 3 rotors should be classified as 9 cylinders, since it has 3 combustion chambers for each rotor and 2 rotor as 6 cylinders. But aren't these classes divided by the displacement? Because 3 rotor is still only 2.0L.

I think RWD could actually be a disadvantage for all motor race cars since the drivetrain loss is, i would think, greater than a FWD car. For turbo it doesn't really matter since it's got the torque, but for all motor, u need all the torque you could get to the wheels, because there ain't much. Also bridgeported high compression 2.0L rotary? I wonder what you'll say if they make a race car with a peripheral port, same design that Mazda used to win LeMans, which, with 2.6L, put out close to 900whp. And driving a Honda, I wouldn't consider rotary's compression very high. stock GSR has a higher CR than a rotary.

I don't think that's fair to rotary fans. Classes should be divided by the displacement. So if they could make a 1.3L 6 cylinder, go for it. Otherwise, that's not fair. Also then that defeats the whole purpose of us driving Hondas to go fast, when we can do it so easily with a domestic. I chose to fix up a honda because I believe that the technology and efficiency is superior to raw power from just more displacement.

Amazing what rotaries could do with such a small displacement. Rotary engine is the anti-thesis for the statement, "There is no replacement for displacement."

Props to Padilla.

Jay Kim


[Modified by AllMotorMonster, 12:02 PM 11/4/2002]

 

1st off I want to express how much I hate rotary motors. Their 1.3L isn't 1.3L. They are only measuring 1 of the chambers from each rotor. Also they have a bit of an advantage, THEY HAVE NO VALVETRAIN! Its like a ******* 2 stroke motor. Also that motor has been around forever!

P.S. Keep those ******* weed wackers in PR I cannot stand that noise!

 

Displacement measures total combustion chamber volume on each rotor, just like they do with each cylinder in a cylinder engine. Also only 1 rotor surface is combusting, on each rotor at any given time.

And you realize that having no valvetrain and needing to take apart the whole engine if you want to upgrade is a pain in the rear, right?
And thank you for proving my point. Technology and efficiency. Less moving parts=more efficiency.
How long ago do you think Felix Wankel came up with a first working automotive rotary engine? Sure the idea has been around forever, but they were never realized until Wankel. How long has the piston engine been around? Forever x 2, if you count history of rotary engines as "forever."

If I were to make an argument against rotary engine it would be.....1)the apex seals. The weakest link is the apex seal. Its 2mm width just gives up, on even little detonations that you could get away with, if you had a built cylinder engine. There is no way of getting a stronger, i.e. forged pistons, and rods, internal parts for rotary. All the apex seal upgrade is actually weaker than steel, such as ceramic, carbon fiber, etc., 2)fuel consumption, my god....my 2 previous rex's put a freaking hole in my wallet! A big a$$ one too. 3)mentioned above, you need to take the whole damn engine apart to do anything, 4)questionable build quality(Mazda...come on...).

Also rotary engines make THAT much power using 9.7:1 CR. That was the highest CR rotor Mazda ever produced and there are no aftermarket rotors.

Jay Kim

 

"I think RWD could actually be a disadvantage for all motor race cars since the drivetrain loss is, i would think, greater than a FWD car."

That is the second dumbest thing I have ever read.

 

I wasn't talking about all piston engines. I meant that that particular motor has been around for a long time. The competition has not had as much expereince with their motors (ie. B series, H series motors) as the rotary guys have had.

The actual displacement of these motors have been argued in many racing sanctions. This is the reason that the 3 rotor was banned starting in the 2003 season. NHRA was incorrectly measuring displacement. 3 rotor is not < 2.7L therefore it should not be allowed in the class.

Sorry if I came off as an ***, but I have a strong hatred for the rotary motor.

 

Finally!

 

It's all good dude. This IS honda-TECH after all.

But I think NHRA made a wrong decision by banning 3 rotors, but by doing so, they're giving chance for VW, Honda, Ford, Chevy and other companies a chance to win. Just like they did at LeMans.

I'm excited to see Mazda return to LeMans this year. Hopefully Ford, who owns Mazda, won't **** block because it'll definitely mean Ford has no chance so as with other manufacturers. Hehehe.

Also 3 rotor IS 2.0L.

Jay Kim

 

having front wheel drive cars and rear wheel drive cars in the same class is stupid. that's the bottom line.

 

I think they should have Rotary, RWD and 6 cylinders in one class and 4 cylinders in another. And i would like to see more regulations like the NHRA Pro Stock class, max CC's, cam restrictions, ect ect... My $0.02.

 

Eventually I think it will get to the point of displacement and cam restricitions once everyone starts to even up and all qualifiers are within a 10th of a second. We all have to realize that is what NHRA is aiming for so things are competitive and any car can win on any given Sunday. The Pro class with Bullish and Lingenfelter is close to that now and when all these folks are in attendance and on their game it is some awesome racing with everyone running 6.9-7.1 to qualify.

That is one of the main reasons they are limiting who/what can run in each class. Yes I realize I have been voted off the Island, I am upset about it, I just have to deal with it, adjust to the rules and move on. If I was racing for anything more then just having fun then I would build something else but since I already have a real carreer in the Coast Guard then it is all just for fun.

Rotaries are incredible but why do they have to be so freaking loud? Also, an extremely easy engine to work on.

Anthony

 

damn dude, not too many ppl remember my 4dr GSR days ...

EIP Tuning, they still around ?

Greg

 

I'm oldschool too. The Frog , Cheetah, your old Rbbit or Scirroco. You gave me an offer before for my JUN Type 3 cams trade with used ITR cams and Manifold, I should've took your offer because I got scammed by SpeedSport in Chicago. Long story. But when I posted on the ITR forum here people flamed me on there cuz they had good experiences. on them and me for being stupid.

 

where will my v6 hybrid HB be then? I'm making just a little less than 300whp

 

run the IDRC ... until NHRA gets the idea ... they support the Pro racers more than the street guys, thats the bottom line. Until they make some aggressive changes (which I personally think Javier Ortega will help change since he's from the street and knows what the street racers want) they wont see too much street guys at the races.


Greg

 

I'm just kidding...but I was really gonna try a v6 accord motor in a crx