White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Cylinder 1 Doesn't Fire
First off, it's a 1989 HB with an OBD0 B16A SiR I.
Here is my 'problem' (1 minute video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
I think the intake cam has skipped a tooth or something. Not 100% sure. I need to check that my crank pully is actually at TDC. The mark is there, but I'm going to check the cylinder.
The engine is misfiring on cylinder 1 only. Doesn't ignite the fuel and the fuel is coming out the tail pipe causing it to smoke. That's how far I've gotten so far.
Here is my 'problem' (1 minute video)
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
I think the intake cam has skipped a tooth or something. Not 100% sure. I need to check that my crank pully is actually at TDC. The mark is there, but I'm going to check the cylinder.
The engine is misfiring on cylinder 1 only. Doesn't ignite the fuel and the fuel is coming out the tail pipe causing it to smoke. That's how far I've gotten so far.
Just threw a cel code 23 because the knock sensor isn't wired right now. But on start up it doesn't throw any codes.
The tail pipe has spewed white smoke out of it.
UPDATE:
It is now definitely getting gas. I ran it, went behind the car, and litterally saw liquid gas coming out the tail pipe. Spewing out the tail pipe. But there is no ignition in cylinder 1. It gets spark, because I saw the spark plug light. Still on my quest to figure this out.
UPDATE:
Cylinder 1 (Closest to the water pump) is not firing for whatever reason.
The white smoke is DEFINITELY a ton of GAS. That's my understanding.
It is getting spark, unplugged the spark plug and wire, plugged the hole, started the car, and observed spark.
It is getting gas (I Think), checked the injector wiring also.
Could a bad intake gasket cause this somehow? Is it not getting air? Or is the piston shot? I did a compression test and didn't see any deviation really.
Old Post:
The tail pipe has spewed white smoke out of it.
UPDATE:
It is now definitely getting gas. I ran it, went behind the car, and litterally saw liquid gas coming out the tail pipe. Spewing out the tail pipe. But there is no ignition in cylinder 1. It gets spark, because I saw the spark plug light. Still on my quest to figure this out.
UPDATE:
Cylinder 1 (Closest to the water pump) is not firing for whatever reason.
The white smoke is DEFINITELY a ton of GAS. That's my understanding.
It is getting spark, unplugged the spark plug and wire, plugged the hole, started the car, and observed spark.
It is getting gas (I Think), checked the injector wiring also.
Could a bad intake gasket cause this somehow? Is it not getting air? Or is the piston shot? I did a compression test and didn't see any deviation really.
Old Post:
I pulled the spark plugs and they are a little black at the tip, maybe too hot?
Compression test. 180 PSI through all cylinders after 4 turns of the motor. 210 after 5. Do I need to crank it even more?
Coolant level is normal. Doesn't seem milky to me.
Oil level is normal, also doesn't seem milky. Tail pipe smells like gas here and there, nothing abnormal. However, when driving it pours out white smoke. I thought blown head gasket, but wouldn't that show on the compression test?
Thought it was my PCV valve, but that is all hooked up right. I will check my secondary O2 and knock sensor out shortly.
Need help with this so I can finally drive to work. Getting real tired of the bicycle.
Thanks, I will post a video since I recorded everything I tested. Just have to edit it down to a reasonable amount of time.
A bit over 3 minutes, not bad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKt5G...ature=youtu.be
Compression test. 180 PSI through all cylinders after 4 turns of the motor. 210 after 5. Do I need to crank it even more?
Coolant level is normal. Doesn't seem milky to me.
Oil level is normal, also doesn't seem milky. Tail pipe smells like gas here and there, nothing abnormal. However, when driving it pours out white smoke. I thought blown head gasket, but wouldn't that show on the compression test?
Thought it was my PCV valve, but that is all hooked up right. I will check my secondary O2 and knock sensor out shortly.
Need help with this so I can finally drive to work. Getting real tired of the bicycle.
Thanks, I will post a video since I recorded everything I tested. Just have to edit it down to a reasonable amount of time.
A bit over 3 minutes, not bad
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKt5G...ature=youtu.be
Last edited by Freemananana; Aug 16, 2013 at 03:09 PM.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Too much fuel = black
Burning oil = blue
White smoke is burning coolant, most common is a blown headgasket. Do a leakdown test to find out. I've done motor swaps on cars that had such bad headgaskets that the old motor left a lot of coolant residue in the exhaust. With the new motor, it would evaporate and get blown out within 15 minutes of driving though.
Burning oil = blue
White smoke is burning coolant, most common is a blown headgasket. Do a leakdown test to find out. I've done motor swaps on cars that had such bad headgaskets that the old motor left a lot of coolant residue in the exhaust. With the new motor, it would evaporate and get blown out within 15 minutes of driving though.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Too much fuel = black
Burning oil = blue
White smoke is burning coolant, most common is a blown headgasket. Do a leakdown test to find out. I've done motor swaps on cars that had such bad headgaskets that the old motor left a lot of coolant residue in the exhaust. With the new motor, it would evaporate and get blown out within 15 minutes of driving though.
Burning oil = blue
White smoke is burning coolant, most common is a blown headgasket. Do a leakdown test to find out. I've done motor swaps on cars that had such bad headgaskets that the old motor left a lot of coolant residue in the exhaust. With the new motor, it would evaporate and get blown out within 15 minutes of driving though.
If I need to relpace the head gasket on this motor, how difficult is that? My guess is it shouldn't be bad. Do I need new head studs if I replace the head gasket?
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
The PCV system connects to the black box on the back of the block, correct? Right next to the oil filter. If that isn't hooked up, could that be my problem?
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Here's a video I made of the symptoms, 3 minutes long
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKt5G...ature=youtu.be
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKt5G...ature=youtu.be
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Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Pulling off my exhaust pipe today, because it didn't smoke on just the header before. Even with the MAP hooked up wrong.
Could there just be excessive build up in the exhaust? Cat gone bad, muffler full of...
'mold'? The exhaust was unhooked and rained on quite a bit. I know there has to be something inside it. Would a seafoam drip through the vac hose clean out the exhaust?
Just read a bad cat can cause white smoke. Which may be my issue here. The exhaust sat out, lots of stuff probably got into the end that is usually attached to the headers.
Could there just be excessive build up in the exhaust? Cat gone bad, muffler full of...
'mold'? The exhaust was unhooked and rained on quite a bit. I know there has to be something inside it. Would a seafoam drip through the vac hose clean out the exhaust?
Just read a bad cat can cause white smoke. Which may be my issue here. The exhaust sat out, lots of stuff probably got into the end that is usually attached to the headers.
Last edited by Freemananana; Aug 13, 2013 at 05:26 AM.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Would a bad distributor cause this?
EDIT:
Looked it up. So I can unplug the injector plug and/or the spark plug wire to determine if the cylinder is firing. If there is no change in idle, it's that cylinder, right? Which could be as easy as a clogged injector or as bad as fried piston rings. Which would have shown on the compression test, right? Or do I need to do a leak down for that? I don't have the tool. But I have a compressor.
Last edited by Freemananana; Aug 13, 2013 at 09:26 AM.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Bad distributor might cause the misfire, but wouldn't cause the smoke.
I watched the video, yes there is smoke coming out but it isn't a whole lot. If it isn't overheating I would drive it. Pay close attention to your temp while driving and check your oil and coolant level and color before and after you drive. If you smell coolant while driving, pull over. I'd do that for a few days and then see if the smoke dies down.
I think unplugging the injector harness would work. I think those connectors are a bitch though, they're made to not come apart easily.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Either the video is making your exhaust sound funny or you're running on 3 cylinders. It's shouldn't sound like a Subaru unless you put an un-even length header on, which I'm not sure even exists for a Honda.
Bad distributor might cause the misfire, but wouldn't cause the smoke.
I watched the video, yes there is smoke coming out but it isn't a whole lot. If it isn't overheating I would drive it. Pay close attention to your temp while driving and check your oil and coolant level and color before and after you drive. If you smell coolant while driving, pull over. I'd do that for a few days and then see if the smoke dies down.
I think unplugging the injector harness would work. I think those connectors are a bitch though, they're made to not come apart easily.
Bad distributor might cause the misfire, but wouldn't cause the smoke.
I watched the video, yes there is smoke coming out but it isn't a whole lot. If it isn't overheating I would drive it. Pay close attention to your temp while driving and check your oil and coolant level and color before and after you drive. If you smell coolant while driving, pull over. I'd do that for a few days and then see if the smoke dies down.
I think unplugging the injector harness would work. I think those connectors are a bitch though, they're made to not come apart easily.
Distributor is probably good then. It's 'new' per say.
It looks like a lot of smoke to me. Maybe I'll get out and drive around on it for awhile and try and get the smoke to die down. And just watch the oil and temp. I hear coolant smells sweet, is that true? Or am I mistaken?
The injector harness isn't HARD to undo, just a flat head pops the retaining pin off. So i can take the pins off all of them, just connect then, then fire it up and check.
3 Cylinders is the conclusion though. I'll see what I've got going. It's got power, but maybe the change from 70 HP to a decent motor, even on 3 cylinders, is a big enough change for me to be fooled.
Thanks so far, glad I'm getting some ideas.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Cylinder 1 (closest to water pump) is NOT firing. Unplugged it from the distributor and saw no difference in performance. Causes of this? Could it be really bad timing? I will check my wiring. I hope I have something unhooked somewhere. Mechanically, what could be wrong with the cylinder to cause this? NO CEL codes.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Updates:
Original post has been updated. Wouldn't a bad piston cause oil to come out the tail pipe also? Is this a bad head gasket? I'm having trouble finding the source of the engine not firing. I will recheck the wiring more.
Original post has been updated. Wouldn't a bad piston cause oil to come out the tail pipe also? Is this a bad head gasket? I'm having trouble finding the source of the engine not firing. I will recheck the wiring more.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
What test did you perform to come the the conclusion that cylinder #1 is not firing?
And "not firing" meaning injector is not working, or not firing meaning fuel is not combusting?
Youtube a video of a Subaru with performance exhaust. It will sound "throaty" or like it's underwater. This is because of the unequal length on the runners for the exhaust manifold. It's normal for a Subaru, NOT normal for a Honda. If your Honda sounds like a Subaru, you're running on 3 cylinders.
I've had Hondas with blown head gaskets smoke out a 30 car parking lot just by revving in neutral for a minute or so. Its all about perspective, I guess.
And "not firing" meaning injector is not working, or not firing meaning fuel is not combusting?
Youtube a video of a Subaru with performance exhaust. It will sound "throaty" or like it's underwater. This is because of the unequal length on the runners for the exhaust manifold. It's normal for a Subaru, NOT normal for a Honda. If your Honda sounds like a Subaru, you're running on 3 cylinders.
I've had Hondas with blown head gaskets smoke out a 30 car parking lot just by revving in neutral for a minute or so. Its all about perspective, I guess.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
What test did you perform to come the the conclusion that cylinder #1 is not firing?
And "not firing" meaning injector is not working, or not firing meaning fuel is not combusting?
Youtube a video of a Subaru with performance exhaust. It will sound "throaty" or like it's underwater. This is because of the unequal length on the runners for the exhaust manifold. It's normal for a Subaru, NOT normal for a Honda. If your Honda sounds like a Subaru, you're running on 3 cylinders.
I've had Hondas with blown head gaskets smoke out a 30 car parking lot just by revving in neutral for a minute or so. Its all about perspective, I guess.
And "not firing" meaning injector is not working, or not firing meaning fuel is not combusting?
Youtube a video of a Subaru with performance exhaust. It will sound "throaty" or like it's underwater. This is because of the unequal length on the runners for the exhaust manifold. It's normal for a Subaru, NOT normal for a Honda. If your Honda sounds like a Subaru, you're running on 3 cylinders.
I've had Hondas with blown head gaskets smoke out a 30 car parking lot just by revving in neutral for a minute or so. Its all about perspective, I guess.
I believe the fuel is not combusting. There is fuel leaving the exhaust.
It doesn't smoke that much by any means. The smoke dissipates quickly. Gas vapors by the seem of it. But I haven't had any backfires yet.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
If no spark, then there's a problem that needs fixing.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
I would check to make sure #1 spark plug is firing. Pull plug out of the head and plug it back into the plug wire. Unplug the harnesses from the fuel injectors (this will eliminate the possibility of the motor starting up). Rest the threads of the plug on a part of the motor that is grounded. HOLD THE PLUG BY THE INSULATED PLUG WIRE and have another person give the key a quick crank. You should see the spark plug do it's thing.
If no spark, then there's a problem that needs fixing.
If no spark, then there's a problem that needs fixing.
Before that, I used a different set of wires to check that it wasn't a bad wire. Let me make sure I'm running my wires right
Motor:
Distributor 4 - 3 - 2 - 1 Water Pump
Distributor:
Rear 3 - 4 Front
of car 1 - 2 of car
Hope those 'pictures' make sense. If it has compression, has spark, and has fuel, it only needs air, right? Or maybe it's not getting enough fuel? Or the spark is getting blown out? I am hoping it is just a hook up error, and not mechanical. I don't have a leak down tester. I would pay for shipping both ways to borrow one, but I don't feel like spending the money on purchasing one to never use it after this (hopefully).
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Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
I had the same Subura sound on my hatch, I had white smoke, it was giving me a code 16.
I changed the spark plugs and wires and that didn't help, then I finally changed the fuel filter and it ran good.
I changed the spark plugs and wires and that didn't help, then I finally changed the fuel filter and it ran good.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Thanks for the input. I have no codes though (unfortunately)
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Also tried a different set of wires. Didn't get any different results.
THOUGH, It does sound like I'm getting spark as I put the wire down into the hole where the plug is. Is that bad? A short in the wire maybe? Or just close enough to finally hear the spark hit the plug?
Also, ran another compression test, still 180.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Going to redo all the timing. Remove the timing belt and replace it. Also check the cam gears again. And bust out the timing light to set ignition timing. That would fix mechanical and ignition timing, right? Will the mark on the pully ever line up with TDC outside of cylinder 1 at TDC? I know on motorcycles it can be out of sync even when lined up with TDC due to the cycles.
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
I've got an issue. Not sure if it's acceptable to set my timing with my idle at 1100 RPM instead of 850 (+/-50 RPM). I will try and unplug the IACV and TPS to get the idle to lower, or a combination of things like that. It's idling high due to the misfire (I believe) which may be caused by the timing being off (Spark and gas not getting there at the same time). So I'm trying to remedy that situation. After I do the timing, I'm going to see if I can seafoam the brake booster line to clean the TB. Possibly do a mixture and pressurize it to go through the fuel system too. Instead of pouring the stuff in the gas tank. (My tank is old, seafoam might break things off I don't want to go through the fuel system)
Regardless. I may have to pull the head to check it out. If I need to replace, say a piston, how much power would I lose if I put low comp pistons for boost in there but still ran N/A for now?
Regardless. I may have to pull the head to check it out. If I need to replace, say a piston, how much power would I lose if I put low comp pistons for boost in there but still ran N/A for now?
Re: White/Gray tailpipe smoke
Updated original post with a link to a 1 minute video of the cams.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
Could use some advice. Is this causing my misfire? Possibly?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
Could use some advice. Is this causing my misfire? Possibly?
Updated original post with a link to a 1 minute video of the cams.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
Could use some advice. Is this causing my misfire? Possibly?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=phVhu...ature=youtu.be
Could use some advice. Is this causing my misfire? Possibly?