Are Type R calipers over rated? I realize that they are bigger, however they are still sliding calipers. That doesn't exactly scream "racecar" level braking performance.

I was looking at a Type R conversion kit, and for only about $100 extra I can get a Wilwood kit. The Wilwood kit includes forged fixed calipers, and 2 piece rotors. It seems like a better deal.

 

show me the wilwood kit

 

What do specifically you mean by "overrated?" I've never really seen anyone claim that they'll do more than they do. Short answer is that they do the job, simply.

Bottom line:

- They are originally intended to stop a larger vehicle (Accord wagon, Prelude, etc) and therefore have more heat capacity than the 10.2/9.5 setups
- They are rock solid reliable factory parts with few moving parts
- They are easily replaceable/rebuildable and relatively inexpensive
- A vast selection of pads are available for them

Considering that most road racers in here are pretty budget minded (why else would they be building $2k, 20 year old econo boxes into race cars?), the last three traits in particular are highly desirable.

If we're talking about a street car though, big brakes aren't really going to make your braking any better. Get good pads, new rotors, and fresh fluid. Then get good tires and get it aligned. Brakes don't stop the car, just the tires... and stock brakes have enough heat capacity for a single street stop or three and typically for the end of the quarter mile unless you're making huge trap speeds.

 

This the Wilwood kit I was talking about. You can save $100 bucks if you opt for regular rotors instead of the 2 piece rotors. Many racing and high performance street pads are available for these calipers from a variety of brake pad manufacturers.

http://www.fastbrakes.com/product_p/...140%206163.htm

 

Who said a Hype R was a racecar?

 

Well nobody said that specifically. Except everybody talks about the Type R brakes as if they have killer stopping power, when they are just sliding caliper brakes.

 

That **** is $750! My ITR set-up was about $150 for calipers, rotors, pads, hardware and new hoses.

 

Seriously, one of the best parts about an itr version is that you can put it together with one trip each to the junkyard, parts counter, and machine shop.

Even then, do you even need to mill the brackets if using the mini rotors? I haven't read up on those completely.

 

In terms of braking force, they are 'up there' with the best aftermarket kits.

In terms of heat capacity, they are good enough for street use, even modest track work.

In terms of feel and weight, admittedly a set of aluminum 4 pots is going to be better.

 

There are 2 downsides to ITR brakes, sliding caliper and weight. That being said, you will spend close to triple the price for aftermarkets that are on par with them. Not all aftermarket brake kits are good, caliper flex is real and replacement parts can put you in debt. Also consider pad options.

 

Agreed. Also, tons of auto x guys run 9.5s with good pads and drums while giving more abuse than any real street driving will.

 

Id rather run s2000 calipers

 

And then what will you run for the rear? ITR front and rear combined are extremely well balanced.

 

^^Useless addition to the thread unless you want to tell the OP why.

 

The S2000 calipers are still a sliding caliper design, and in my opinion sliding calipers are weak. They're fine for street use, however for anything beyond that I would rather go with a fixed caliper.

I can't believe that on higher performance cars like the ITR and S2000 that fixed calipers weren't standard on the front brakes. Even the Cobalt SS had fixed calipers.

 

Ill have to digup my old convos with brake expert for the combo and reason he gave me.

 

S2000/EP3 CTR is a good setup as it is roughly the same 'power' as the ITR setup, but with better heat dissipation from the bigger rotor.

It uses the smaller 54mm piston from the 10.3" setup instead of the ITRs 57mm piston which cancels out the increased level arm of the bigger rotor, so you shouldn't change your bias if it was good with the ITR setup.

 

I think cost was the main factor in that even though it was said Honda lost money on ITR's sold but had to have a production car to dominate in the racing series. Then we look at the DC5R which comes with Brembo front brakes. I'd rather have seen a Nissin caliper like Spoon uses which is a fixed ITR caliper so to say. The size has proven itself very effective with proper pads. IIRC the DC2R is still the biggest piston Honda has used to date in their braking systems.

 

You do realize that the mugen active gate brake system consists of s2k calipers rebranded?

To quote epgonzalez, "I will dive bomb you in the braking zone!"

Itr calipers are worth every penny with a good set of race pads and rcompound tires.
Just make sure you have your brake ducting in order.

 

I know, and I wouldn't get those either because they are still sliding calipers. They are so over-priced for what you get.

For only a little more you could buy a Stop-Tech kit with 2-piece rotors and HUGE forged, fixed, 4 piston calipers.

 

I still don't see what we're getting at here...

For one thing, the Cobalt SS went with larger fixed calipers in like '08 or something. So now we're comparing to an eleven year newer car? Of course its going to have more technology. Newer also means heavier, and from a marketing standpoint (notably spawned by the tuning culture), we have been conditioned over the last few years to see a car and go "Oooh Brembo."

Well, they are (were) street cars, and both have more than ample braking for their applications. Honda up until that time had a reputation for doing things as simply and practically as they could.

OP, why don't you tell us what your intent with the car is and maybe someone can give you some guidance as to what might be the best option for you.

 

What exactly do you think you stand to gain with a set of fixed calipers?

 

The s2000 calipers are also suitable for a larger rotor. It's surprisingly similar to the ITR caliper, though the pad shape is a much more effective pad design.

S2000 > ITR in my opinion, both are great though. The s2000 caliper will require a little custom work to fit, but I love having 12" rotors.

 

How is the wheel fitment with the s2k caliper? Can you get a 15" over it?

 

I actually tried this over the weekend - 10.4" knuckles, 06+ Civic Si calipers, and 294mm MINI rotors. I bolted it all together, and it did fit under my 15x8 Slipstreams, but I am not sure if it would fit under all of my other 15" wheels. It was VERY close to the wheel, because of caliper height - maybe 3mm of clearance.

On a side note, the 294mm MINI rotors are not a perfect fit, and the 276mm MINI rotors were not a great fit with the EX knuckle/ITR calipers either. They were not the correct offset, and the rotors do need to be larger in diameter to not have the pad overhang.

I have decided to go with an 11" setup, instead of the 11.8s I could get if I re-drilled the S2000/Civic Si/RSX-S sized rotors (300mm). I just think it will fit more wheels, and I doubt I will run out of brakes with the 11" setup.