Had this car for a decent long time now. It's been street driven, drag raced (over 300 passes on it), SCCA solo, and track day play. Had a couple different engines in it, and tons of suspension related mods over the years. Our goal has always been to build one car that can do as many things as possible. What good is a drag car that can't corner or stop? Or a road racecar that is slow? or a street car that is undrivable and miserable on the street. It's a constant compromise. But it's been fun.

Time for a change. I think we're done street driving this car. and likely I see less drag racing in it's future (if ever), so I'm willing to give up a few tenths in the 1/4 mile to make a safer track day style car. Mostly this means adding weight to meet cage and class restrictions. and probably taking some motor out of it to meet these more restricted rules like H2 or H1.

I'm leaning toward a build for H2 or H1. If I'm honest with myself, It's likely we will never attend one of those kinds of races. BUT you never know. But you have to have a target and direction, so here we are. I found my first "track day" experience to be VERY humbling. I enjoyed it a lot, and the new found things to work on... Like BRAKES and cooling. Things that have never been an issue before, all crept up. This really fascinates me, and I want to pursue this more.

I dunno, I think we all have a certain amount of self confidence if you're willing to take a car to a race track. And we tease each other, of course. That's part of the fun. Although you would never say such a thing out loud, I can almost imagine myself saying, "alright boys, we're here, get your junk off the track so we can show you how it's done". It's just apexes and braking, nothing new there (but not with a manual). I've won national championships on television, tuned and built various race cars since I was 18, been in Legends, late models, bikes, offroad cars, 170mph drag cars. But not road, not at higher speeds more than an SCCA parking lot affair. I have a LOT to learn. And I'm grateful for the experience and monster stomping of my ego and kick to the nuts. And I enjoyed every second of it. It was fun, every missed apex, every missed braking point and fumbling with the heel toe action that I'd never had to worry about, but was confident it was going to be a no-brainer (wrong). VERY humbling. AND I CAN'T WAIT TO DO IT AGAIN!!!!

This whole making the car into a more targeted, track race car came about after I watched some in-car video from last weekend from this car. Things we did to keep the car light for drags, or that were acceptable for solo driving around a big parking lot were fine, legal, and par for the course. And fine for this event we attended too.

This whole "cheap seats from Summit" and a factory seat belt with no roll protection is done for me. I've been in enough real race cars to know the difference, and it's kind of starting to bother me. Mostly because I know I could have made a safer car, but didn't want to sacrifice the 150 pounds to put in a cage and safety precautions that were NOT required. ..(stooopid).. I want to take this particular chassis, not to the next level, but to the CORRECT level. We all understand the risks. I want to continue to enjoy racing, and want to improve my odds in the most important area, Safety. I don't need a bowling trophy or a $100 check to tell me I had a good weekend.

Just want to turn this car into something as safe as can be for SCCA solo stuff, the occasional drag race (car was capable of a 12.70@105) and the occasional, more high speed "track day" kinds of events. By targeting H1, I'm giving myself a direction, rather than speculation. Instead of looking like a drag car on a road track, the car is going to look like a proper road race car.

I am interested in hearing ANY advice on putting this car on the right track. I have a rough idea on the differences between H1 and H2, no need to tell me I'm gonna get waxed in H1. I get it. I'm just looking for advice from people that have been down the same road. Never hurts to ask or look at other peoples builds. It's how you learn.

quite a while ago. AH, the original car. *sniff* I've written a few tutorials on things I've done to the car over the years if you search the forums. Like how to lighten a door, or re-do your fuel system.

Ah, the ricey-ness of it all.

 

More evolution pics.





B16 engine


GSR engine (recently deceased, and kind of what started this whole thread. Gotta move on again).

 

 

 

Farewell ol' "EF-Bomb", you've been a good drag car.

Let's see what it does as a road race car. Build thread to start as we finalize the class for the car.

I like this picture a lot. It's from last weekend. I want to see more of this in my future.

 

I would also look into the ICSCC ( http://www.icscc.com/ ) since you don't mind traveling to WA. They have a good novice school, and some pretty awesome tracks. They use a different rule book than NASA so they don't use the Honda Challenge H4-H1 (wish they did).

 

ICSCC, appreciate that link.

I'm just not completely "up" on all the areas and sanctioning bodys. And I see those fellas have something going on in Spokane, which is closer to us than Miller is.

Spokane Country raceway, shows as 640 miles one way. make good sense to have a look at their schedule (spokane) and groups that race there.
Miller shows as about 886.
Pacific raceway is about 940
Bremerton 958

I also need to see what kind of racing is going on in, and around, Minneapolis. That's about 760 from here.

It's all about seat time. I don't mind a long weekend drive to get there if we get some long seat time to justify the trip. Right now, planning to race in and around Washington state seems to be the best plan.

 

selling those lenso's? pm me :-)

 

Start off simple and get something under the hood cheap and reliable.
Your gonna need a good amount of seat time to get the hang of driving on the road and what better way than to drive a close to stock car as possible.
The lower your hp while learning will decrease your learning curve VS what you are accustomed to.. Just plain insanity under the hood.
Once you can control the car near stock form and drive the hell out of it then start to look at higher hp engines.
The only thing a b16 or b18 will do is mask your bad driving for right now.
Id suggest a d16z6 to start off. good,cheap and reliable.
Just enough hp to teach you good driving skills you really want.
Dont turn your nose up at the lack of hp. I have seen many a great driver chase down H2 cars using this engine.
You have experience in building and branding so stick with the brands you have used before.
Just use RR applications for brakes, tires etc...
There is no one set up for all, so search this forum and see the infinate opinions for suspension, brakes etc.
Google search each topic using honda-tech in the search string and there will be tons of data to sift through.
Building a RR car is pretty similar to a drag in as much as you have to test your set ups and see what works for you and your driving style.
good luck!

 

Your probably right about the power. The car (in my minds eye) needs to be good at all disciplines to be a truly good car. I'm already thinking of going to a b20 that fits H1 rules. I'm confident It will have less power than the GSR I had. and the B20 means I have to add a LOT of weight. So I think I'll end up with a substantially slower car, all around. like 20-30% slower.

H1 with a b20 puts me at 2300 pounds and doing the additional welding on the a and b pillar to attach them to the cage is a 30 pound penalty. Puts me at 2330 (as I understand it). Car right now, with driver weighs 1975.

Gonna break my heart to put 355+ pounds back in the car. Somebody please tell me I'm reading all that weight stuff wrong.

I spent all these years getting the car to run in the 12's at l06, now to dump like 4 Lindsey Lohans worth of weight in the car.... makes me ill.

 

2330 with you in the car. eventually well placed lead on the passenger side will get you where you need to be. dont worry too much about weight until you are signed off and driving solo.

 

That is light!! I'm at around 2400 w/driver in the EK coupe.

 

Put the 4 lohans back in the car and drive it like you stole it.
Safety first!

 

Makes sense. I talked to my engine guys last night. They think B18 is the way to go for what I'd like to have happen. So that's the plan. Lightens the car up another 100.

Ek's are tough to get light, as I understand it. I was really trying to get the car under 1900, with driver, for a while. Ah, heck, got a drag car, let's make a better, safer, RR car.

Yea, but where do you find crack ****** in Montana?

 

<-really? lol. I bet Def T knows a few.

Are you building the cage setup yourself? If so, I don't know if you'd be interested but I have 2 EK's including mine that need cages built. Its hard around here. Everyone is into stock cars, and hates Honda's. Have to talk about it sometime.

 

Nothing is impossible. they all just take time. I've built my share of cages and bars. It's all "fiddly" work. And you REALLY need to make sure you are up on the rules. This Ef-bomb cage is going to be pretty fiddly. I want the nascar door bars on both sides. In addition to safety, it'll even the car out optically. I think stuff should look good too, pleasing to the eye, where possible.

I'm not 100% up on the road race rules side of it yet. but I think I'm getting comfortable with what I am reading about what goes where, and wall thickness. Aren't there some decent fab guys in Billings? Have you checked on the 406 thread here on HT? Lot's of knowledge on race car stuff in the Billings area, and who does what.

Some tubing related efforts.

This vintage dragster we built from scratch was my first efforts with the funny car cage area. That was an eye opener.

 

Let me know if there is anything I can do to help! Now if only we could get Kevin or some of the other SF crew to do some "real" driving!

 

Nasa has a 200 lb maximum ballast rule. Sounds like you've got to get creative. Good Luck.

 

maybe the cage will get REAL heavy, or i can gain a few pounds this winter.

 

Oh snap I didnt even realize you guys are kinda close. There are some montana peeps that come down to miller often, Is that where you plan to race?

 

Member of ICSCC here. The Spokane event is usually epic. They usually do a double or triple race weekend. This year I entered my car in 3 races and rented it for another 2. So in a matter of 3 days it did 5 races. While ICSCC doesn't have H1 or H2 it does have ST, SPU and other classes where a powerful Honda can go play.

Also, if you're going to drive 940 miles to Pacific Raceways, then you might also consider driving to Oregon Raceways Park which is arguably the best "drivers" track in the PacNW.

 

Cool.

Some guys from great falls always doing Miller. James Rowen, and some other dude named John I sold an engine to. Both from Great Falls.

I've since, over the last weeks, decided "MAYBE" that I don't need to worry about class stuff so much and just concentrate on a good track day car. stuff for lapbattle and less "stuffY" events. If were really honest about it, what are the odds we do it more than 3 times a year? Not very good. Better to build a car that makes you happy, than to build a car that's likely to be slower, but meets rules you don't need as you're not a part of a series.

That said... I picked up a wrecked s2000 this week... and I'm looking at the EF-Bomb... looking at the s2000, looking back at the Ef-bomb... I like how forgiving front wheel drive is. I'm still getting my jollies on a track, with less drama and risk. BUT, there's something to be said for the "you gotta be kidding me" factor of converting the EF to a full s2000 undercarriage. That's wild stuff. That kind of fabrication doesn't bother me, it's just time. I'm just worried about losing the fun of the car. You lean on the EF-bomb to hard and it develops a very comfortable, predictable push. Lean on RWD to hard and you introduce the rear of the car to the wall. ...lol...

I want a car that's relatively fast, say it runs 12.50 1/4 miles, but has good road racing manners. Right now with the GSR (now deceased) prolly was a 12.7-12.8 car. Excellent power.

If you have a good linke for the ICSCC, I'd love to have it. So I can read up. Spokane is close, as those kinds of things go.

 

http://www.icscc.com

If you care about 1/4 mile times and simple "power" then maybe road racing isn't the right direction anyway. If you care about competition and battling with other talented racers then I recommend reading a rule book first, finding a class that would be close to what you want to do with your car and look forward to racing in the future if/when track days have lost their appeal.

 

It's not that I care about drag racing this car as I was trying to quantify a basic feeling of speed that equates, on a simple level, to a car that's fast enough to have a good time in on a road course.

12.5 seems to be a spot that delivers good power (on the *** dyno) and feels "kinda" like a race car in both worlds. Drag and road. A good car should be able to both relatively well. As opposed to bogging my wifes 2.0L Beetle around the track. NO fun in that.

 

If you start doing ICSCC races, I'll keep an eye out for you. I'm usually in the flag stands flagging for the road races in Spokane. In a few years, I may make the move into club racing from Auto-X. Next year, I'll be taking on Chump Car.