So here is my problem, when I start the car (94 4dr 5spd) if I have the brake pedal depressed once the car starts the pedal will buzz you hear it it is short maybe 1-2 seconds but sounds like the fuel pump before start. I think it happened once or twice without the pedal depressed. I am kinda lost here never had a brake problem like this. Thanks for any help guys

 

Possibly a brake booster problem.

 

Thanks for the reply, and sorry for the late response work called so I was gone for a while. Now I am back did all of the checks and nothing was out of the ordinary pressures held and built as they should. I now have it happening all of the time when I start the car not just while pressing the brake. I also have a new problem as of yesterday where when I go around a corner to the right with the brake depressed there is a clicking noise almost like a tie rod, but it is only under bracking. So with the boost info would this possibly be a bad or leaky caliper on the right? I will go look for fluid and see if I can't figure out the problem, but any input is always appriciated.

Thanks guys

 

Do you have ABS?

 

yes, atleast I have the abs fuse box.
No fluids and the tie rod looks good to me

 

Sounds like the ABS control module under the hood may be causing the pedal vibration. Does the dash ABS light remain on while driving?

 

no abs light the srs light is the only one on. The vibration is only for a second at start up and it just clicks around a corner while braking but it doesn't effect driveability

 

I agree with RonJ. Its the abs module buzzing. Does your abs light even work? Like when you first turn the key to on position, does it light up for a few seconds?

 

Locate the ABS modulator unit under the hood and place your hand on it while a buddy turns the key from off to ON(II). Does it make the buzzing noise that you are hearing?

 

It only makes the sound when the engine actually starts. Were you meaning to have the buddy start the engine and see if that is the source of the buzzing. And yes the abs light does work but it is not staying on.

I also notice quite a big change 300 rpm or so when I push in the brake pedal, or let off. The revs go up for a second and then drop again which leads me back to vaccume.

 

Does the modulator buzz if you do the ON(II) test I suggested?

 

No just the fuel pump can be heared but I cant seem to feel anything from the modulator at just the onII position and you mean not started correct.

 

As you suggested here^, check whether the modulator produces the buzzing noise after the engine starts. Basically try to pinpoint the source of the buzzing sound.

A brake related vacuum issue should have been revealed by the brake booster tests. Did you test the check valve?

 

Ok so the check valve flows fine (Idle high then plugged back in and idle drops to normal) idle increases a little when I push down the brakes but increases twice as much when I release the pedal. Will have to wait for buddy to come back later to test the modulator, I want a buddy that I can keep in my tool box.

::EDIT::
Hooray neighbor kid. So the modulator didn't vibrate when the kid started the car both with the pedal out and pushed down. The brake pedal for me when I started the car with the pedal pushed after the buzz there was a deffinate clunk if you will and a slight loss of pressure just as it should minus ofcourse the clunk.

and thanks alot ronJ

 

Try to pinpoint the source of the buzzing noise at start up. Post a picture of where you think the noise is coming from.

This is abnormal. The brake booster may have a leak.

 

The idle is only increased for a second and the returns to normal but I have not had an issue like this previously so...... I will try to pinpoint the part making the noise more

Thanks for the input

 

Ok update time;
Clicking around right corners under braking I think is due to a bad front lower inner blah blah blah control arm bushing. Getting new part now.

Will find out more about the brakes when he gets here with part.

So can I remove the bushing cup with out removing the control arm or do I need to pull the part and put it on a press?

Sorry should say that I can't get the faq or search to work right now don't know why but I get the oops page.

Thanks

 

Update time; I can't get the new bushing shoved into the lca..... any tips? ( Am using my shop press have no burs....

And the brakes almost sound like they are priming much like the fuels pump does and the more I hear it the more it sounds like the brakes priming. Would this indicate a faulty booster or m/c?

Oh and I found that the idiot (not me this time) who put the brakes on forgot the centering screws on the passenger side disc got the driver just forgot the other side.

 

Sorry no pics but got the bushing installed, and really it is simple if you go slow. It took me about an hour to press in the bushing with my shop press (if you don't have a press get one even the HF cheapy works). Please don't follow the write ups that say to use a sawsall just use 2 hands and a hack saw; only took me 3 minutes to cut and punch the bushing cup. Lube and emry are key also for everything.

On to brakes; just drove the car to the store and it seems as though the buzz is from the abs. I say this because the abs kicked on pulling into my drive-way at 90 and the system did its abs thing (stop car befor garage door) and then went buzz just like at start up. So It buzzes when the abs system is used like during start up when it does a system check, and the idle changes when the pedal is pushed or released so booster and proportioning valve I would think but you really can't tell where the noise comes from.

 

Ok so I think it may be from the solenoid at the proportioning valve. Like I said in the last post the buzz happens after the abs system has done its thing, almost like it is represurizing the system. This would lead me to believe that there is a leak in the lines or valve somewhere. The only problem with that is if there was a leakage the abs system would have its light on and I would be needing more fluid, neither of which are happening. The fluid level has not changed +/-. There is no problem with how the brakes work other than the buzz sound, but opperation seems normal. Not a one of you has had this problem? Thanks for any help guys.

 

Just got off the phone with a buddy who is a brake tech. He looked at the problems that happen on systems from this era civic. He found that the system probably has a bad ground near the fuses or a bad fuse connection that is intermittant. He also said that if the problem was only intermittant that chances are it would not throw a code, the code would only happen if the system had a constant failure. This makes a little sense since I pulled the engine a few months ago which may have knocked something loose. So I will update when I figure it out

 

Can't seem to find a bad ground anywhere they test good and the I still cleaned them. Ther is no leak but the tech at Honda said that could be the only problem with that system. I tried to explain the service buliten about the ground to him and his "30 yrs exp" and he replied "you are getting to technical for me" and that I should pay them $200 to attempt at diagnosis but in the end he said they would probably just replace the whole system for $1350 totalt of $1550. That doesn't sound reasonable because it's a 20 yr old car. The parts alone from the factory at discount are $985 or so I believe.

So if you want to save Honda the time and build the car your self you can for $80,000 in parts cost. How does this make sense?

I am at a loss here because the system works, both the brakes and the abs but clearly there is a fault. And searching for info on this subject just returns abs removal threads which I don't want to do.

Any thoughts?