Engine Management and Tuning Crome, NepTune, Hondata, AEM, MOTEC

running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old Sep 29, 2010 | 12:52 PM
  #1  
blackeg's Avatar
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,820
Likes: 12
From: schooling kids in ny, usa
Default running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

ok so im running neptune rtp on my 84mm boosted vtec motor. its making right around 400whp give or take. air fuel in 3,4,5 gears is smooth and consistant in the mid 11s. for whatever reason my afr in 1st and 2nd is leaner, mid 12s up to like 12.8. i have the gear corrections up around 4 in those gears. i noticed a little better afr but still in the mid 12s.

how bad is it, the car doesnt seem to break up, and with the higher gear ratios doesnt that effectively reduce load and heat that necessitate lower afr's?
Reply
Old Sep 29, 2010 | 03:24 PM
  #2  
unusual71's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,734
Likes: 2
From: Canada
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

adjust the gear correction some more. if you need to, lower 3, 4, 5 and then raise the values in the fuel map itself.
like you mentioned though, in the lower gears there is a little less load and as long as your running a good cool spark plug, i honestly wouldnt worry about it much. maybe try get the AFR to the low 12's and you should be fine.
i assume your running an intercooler what are your air intake temps?
Reply
Old Sep 29, 2010 | 04:39 PM
  #3  
blackeg's Avatar
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,820
Likes: 12
From: schooling kids in ny, usa
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

using a precision 600, iats are a little higher than id like (going to get my manifold coated over the winter) usually 110-130.

using bkr7e's gapped at .020. low boost is 12ish, high setting is 16 something psi. plugs look great, no det signs and the color change is right on the bend of the ground strap.



i guess im a little concerned because after years of procrastinating i got some 24.5" slicks and will actually hook it up at higher boost in 1st and second. ill keep messing with the gear calculator as soon as i get my mfactory lsd because my obx broke (go figure)
Reply
Old Oct 1, 2010 | 09:02 AM
  #4  
Gunmetal_B20_Hatch's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,825
Likes: 1
From: Georgia
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

Are you makeing the same amount of boost in 1st and 2nd gear? or using anti-lag?

Theres a good chance you arent building the same amount of boost in 1 & 2 because of the reduced load on the engine.
Reply
Old Oct 1, 2010 | 09:36 AM
  #5  
likwidchz's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 996
Likes: 1
From: Portland, OR, USA
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

Not to thread jack, but how in the world does the ecu know what gear your in? "in obd1 land"

--Aaron
Reply
Old Oct 1, 2010 | 10:15 AM
  #6  
unusual71's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 1,734
Likes: 2
From: Canada
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

it learns based on engine speed/ vehicle speed sensor.
Reply
Old Oct 1, 2010 | 10:20 AM
  #7  
GhostAccord's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 11,399
Likes: 69
From: East Coast 506, Canada
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

IIRC you actually have to teach it...lol

The software per gear tool usually has to be set to or calibrated to the transmission being used in your vehicle. IIRC it adjusts maps based on a formula that uses RPM, MAP (load) and VSS.


Wow am I to assume that you are referring to 12.5:1 as lean during wide open throttle operation in each gear? Or is 11.5:1 your overall AFR target?

Last edited by GhostAccord; Oct 1, 2010 at 10:45 AM.
Reply
Old Oct 1, 2010 | 10:39 AM
  #8  
Bizzle5OH3's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Sep 2010
Posts: 328
Likes: 1
From: Mountain home
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

If your at 12.5-1 you really dont have anything to worry about
Reply
Old Oct 2, 2010 | 06:42 AM
  #9  
blackeg's Avatar
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,820
Likes: 12
From: schooling kids in ny, usa
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

Originally Posted by GhostAccord
IIRC you actually have to teach it...lol

The software per gear tool usually has to be set to or calibrated to the transmission being used in your vehicle. IIRC it adjusts maps based on a formula that uses RPM, MAP (load) and VSS.


Wow am I to assume that you are referring to 12.5:1 as lean during wide open throttle operation in each gear? Or is 11.5:1 your overall AFR target?
yeah i have the gsr s80 gearbox selected. yes my target is in the mid 11s this is a solid point leaner in the mid to upper 12's.

no antilag, still on stock valves

i just checked my last datalog from the track (on 225bfg's btw). launched at 5500 @3psi, 13:1 flat afr.

boost is steady in 1st and 2nd at 12.9psi. 8000 rpm in 1st gear afr is mid 12's @ 12.9 psi. 8400 rpm in 2nd afr is getting down just into the 11s @ 13.1 psi, so ive got .2 psi variance in there a tiny bit of creep plagues me even with the tial 44.

8200 rpm in 3rd gear afr is down 11.5-11.3 and it maintains that through 4th and in 5th too (dont ask how i know)15.7-16.2 psi was run in 3rd and 4th


so i guess its just about a point leaner in 1st and just about all of 2nd.



i am on 93 pump gas, using bkr7e's gapped at .020 to account for my higher settings of 16-17psi which should be a little over 400hp.

the run i just mentioned was first pass ever with the car, 12.3 @123 weighing 2400 2.05 60ft shitty track and no slicks
Reply
Old Oct 2, 2010 | 07:25 AM
  #10  
Gunmetal_B20_Hatch's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
iTrader: (9)
 
Joined: Apr 2005
Posts: 1,825
Likes: 1
From: Georgia
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

Originally Posted by blackeg
yeah i have the gsr s80 gearbox selected. yes my target is in the mid 11s this is a solid point leaner in the mid to upper 12's.

no antilag, still on stock valves

i just checked my last datalog from the track (on 225bfg's btw). launched at 5500 @3psi, 13:1 flat afr.

boost is steady in 1st and 2nd at 12.9psi. 8000 rpm in 1st gear afr is mid 12's @ 12.9 psi. 8400 rpm in 2nd afr is getting down just into the 11s @ 13.1 psi, so ive got .2 psi variance in there a tiny bit of creep plagues me even with the tial 44.

8200 rpm in 3rd gear afr is down 11.5-11.3 and it maintains that through 4th and in 5th too (dont ask how i know)15.7-16.2 psi was run in 3rd and 4th


so i guess its just about a point leaner in 1st and just about all of 2nd.



i am on 93 pump gas, using bkr7e's gapped at .020 to account for my higher settings of 16-17psi which should be a little over 400hp.

the run i just mentioned was first pass ever with the car, 12.3 @123 weighing 2400 2.05 60ft shitty track and no slicks

Sounds like you need to add some fuel in your 13PSI column to me because
1 & 2 = 13PSI
3, 4 & 5 = 16PSI
Reply
Old Oct 3, 2010 | 06:00 AM
  #11  
blackeg's Avatar
Thread Starter
Honda-Tech Member
20 Year Member
 
Joined: Feb 2003
Posts: 9,820
Likes: 12
From: schooling kids in ny, usa
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

yes i can see your conclusion but on the street i only run it at that low 13ish psi setting and its afr is also down nice in the 11s in 3rd and 4th gear. with the slicks sitting in my shed id like to turn it up and run that 16+ psi 1st through 4th gear

side note, i did break my obx differential so now im running the open diff stock spare transmission just takin it easy until my new mfactory diff shows up
Reply
Old Oct 5, 2010 | 06:53 PM
  #12  
bgdriver's Avatar
Honda-Tech Member
 
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 449
Likes: 0
From: chicagoland, illinois, US
Default Re: running a little leaner in 1st and 2nd gear, honestly how bad is it?

If it spins at all it will read lean and it should, load is a bitch.
Reply
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
booboo782
Engine Management and Tuning
7
Sep 2, 2015 12:35 PM
blackeg
Forced Induction
5
Aug 9, 2010 04:31 PM
5800vtec
Acura RSX DC5 & Honda Civic EP3
13
Jun 26, 2008 05:22 PM
Johnny_9
All Motor / Naturally Aspirated
3
Feb 2, 2008 08:29 PM




All times are GMT -8. The time now is 04:52 AM.