so i have a 91 CRX that i use for track days. eventually i would like to get into competition, but for now, im just doing HPDEs. right now i have stock seats, stock seatbelts, and no kind of roll cage/bar whatsoever.

what i want to do is get rid of the stock belts altogether. being on the door they are really a pain. and i dont exactly trust them. since they only lock up when braking or in an impact. i would rather have a harness setup that will hold me in tight at all times.

while a full cage is ideal, i dont think im at a point where i can spend the required cash for a full cage built to spec. so what i was planning on doing is getting an autopower or similar, bolt-in roll bar (only behind the driver, not a cage), some bucket seats, and a couple 5-pt harnesses for me and passenger. but i have some questions:

1.will this be a safe(r) alternative to what im doing now? to me it seems like it will be fine, but im just looking for confirmation from the experienced.

2. what seat options do i have for the CRX? i dont really care/need having a seat that will recline, just a standard seat will do. but i would like something that will slide forward/back, and fit me. im a pretty average size guy. 6'0", 170lbs, 34in waist. i just dont know anything about seat sizing, or whats available.

appreciate the help
Ian

 

The rollbar is a fine first step. Dont do the harnesses until you have a fixed back seat, except maybe the lap belts for extra support if you can work it out.

The toughest part is going to be the seat, because the 91 floor is not flat like the 88 setup. That means its hard to get a seat that slides and is not higher than stock. I have Sparco Sprints, and they are just about 1" lower than stock with sliders. The bottom is a suspended "hammock" which is very comfy, though I did use a jack to widen out the hip area some.

If you get a Sparco or similar seat, you can get the floor mounts and brackets cheaper from Wedge Engineering, who happens to make them for Sparco and other brands.


I have pics of my bar and seats if you are interested...even an install writeup on the bar.

 

Pics and writeup would be a big help.

I'm not planning on using harnesses with stock seats. Sorry if that wasn't clear. I want to do all 3 at once, bar+seats+harness. Also I do still drive the car to the track, and other than some possible legality issues with non-DOT belts, is there any major issue?

 

Mostly depends on the area and the individual, but from what I've heard harnesses pass inspection. Pics will commence in a moment.

 

Sparco Sprint 2009's with sliders from Wedge:




They are just under 1" lower than stock. They are just about the cheapest FIA rated seat out there.

 

Today I installed my autopower 4-pt rollbar, which is was made narrower for 89+ CRX's with door-mounted seatbelts. You can get more details on the change autopower made, and on ordering one here. I got mine from SafeDrives.com, who has great prices and service, plus he knows all about this special sizing for 89+ CRXs.

Let's get started!

First I put the car up on jack stands and removed the rear wheels. I didnt need to take out the front seats... I just pushed them all the way forward.


Next, I took the 4 backing plates from Autopower and coated them with undercoating spray on the "top" sides that would be bolted flat onto the underside of the car. (pictured as before-and-after)


Next I removed the rear speaker covers and pulled out some sound-proofing matt I had crammed in there. Then I "mocked up" the bar and got it in position. It takes some jiggling, and bumping, but it goes in without removing seats or major interior panels.

 

After getting it positioned just right, I used a 3/8" drill bit to make one hole for each leg of the roll bar, and tightened one bolt down medium-tight in it. You'll be surprised how thin the sheet metal is... it takes just a few seconds to drill through.


You'll notice I left the carpet and sound padding in place. According to Autopower, it is perfectly fine to leave it there... it gets smashed flat in the process.

Each rear leg has three holes, but only one is really accessible for drilling from the top with the interior in place. I first used a nail to punch a dimple in the center of these hard-to-reach holes.


Rubbing the inside of the fender with your finger reveals the little dimple

 

Next I used a set-punch and hammer to punch the dimple back in, and turn it into a set spot for my drill bit.


Then drill, and repeat for the other hole.


With the holes done, I cleaned the chunks of dirt from inside the fender with an old toilet brush, because I plan to spray a fresh layer of undercoating there, too.

 

Here's the new layer of undercoating


Now I can install the backing plate with the bolts going IN from outside the car. This pic came out great for some reason.


Get them really really tight and double-nut them on the inside (or buy some nylocks for them)


Then re-coat the fender area again with more undercoating spray


WEAR GLOVES WITH THE UNDERCOATING STUFF UNLESS YOU LIKE TO WASH YOUR HANDS IN TURPENTINE. Keep it away from good clothes, tools, and exterior paint as well.

 

The front legs are much easier. Just drill:


Add the backing plates and bots:


Then tighten really hard and double-nut them:


And add undercoating to the bottom side (not pictured)

 

Finally I vacuumed out all the metal shavings, put my sound-foam back in, and enjoyed a good look at my handiwork:



There are two upper bolts to tighten too, where the uprights connect to the main hoop.


And done.

 

nice, thanks.

it looks like you didnt remove the stock belts. or maybe you just hadnt removed them yet when you took pics? im wanting to remove mine completely. my whole car is stripped out lol.

also what size are you? height/weight/waist. i came across your post about seats on crxcommunity, and saw one guy say they were pretty tight and he was a 31" waist.

is yours the sprint 5? saferacer has them for 320 shipped each. seems like a good price? and will this seat work with a 5+pt harness? im not sure if the seat has to have a hole in the middle for the crotch strap, or is it can just go over the outside of the seat.

 

I'm 5'6"/155/32". The seats are Sprint 2009's, and they are a pretty tight fit. I used a bottle jack to add 1" of width, which helps a lot. They were about 320 shipped too, and they have a hole for 5pt. They are FIA rated as well, meaning they pass a standard for fire and sturdiness, I suppose.

I'll probably keep the stock belts in even when I do the harnesses... I drive it often enough to want to keep them for convenience.

 

Sparco Evos or Pro2000s will fit you pretty well I'd guess. I'm almost exactly the same size as you, and they are comfy. The Corsa is a nice seat too, but the front of the leg bolsters were a bit tighter, and for my long legs (which I'm guessing you have as well) it got uncomfortable after awhile.

I had much less success with Wedge, but I dealt with them maybe 5 years ago? I wound up having mounts made by an OG here (who unfortunately has kind of disappeared). There are some nice things that can be done with OEM sliders.

BTW, nice write-up Fireant, thanks for doing that

 

The evo and pro2000 look like great seats, but are more than twice the price. I would like to stick to something around the cost of the sprint. It doesn't have to be sparco lol.

 

There are plenty of other options cheaper, but you can use their dimensions as a very rough idea of what else will fit you. On Sparco's site there are diagrams breaking down each dimension of each seat.

Sparco does also have some cheaper options. MOMO is another popular potentially FIA-approved manufacturer. Note also that not ALL seats, regardless of if they're a one-piece bucket or not, are FIA approved, and there are different organization rules regarding backbraces for non-FIA seats.

You can also keep an eye on the race-oriented forums for people selling used seats. I had a friend recently selling a pair of Evos for $500-700, as one example.

 

When I was getting the Sparco's I had originally ordered the least-expensive MOMO FIA seat (club-something I think?). When they arrived to the seller (ltbmotorsprots), he inspected them and found them to be of extrememely poor quality compared to what he was expecting, and then found that MOMO had found a different maker for those particular seats. Anyway, they were bad enough that he called me and offered to change them for the Sparcos at the same price.

 

If you plan on competition and Im assuming it would be NASA since you arent legal for anything in scca that you would have a chance in, I would not waste the money on the auto power. Im not a fan of the bolt to the wheel well thin sheet metal but thats just me. The auto power bar is what $500 or so? Find a local place and get a quote on a roll bar welded in with dom for which ever rules you are going to need to follow for when you eventually compete. There is a local in my area that does full cages for $1500 with dom that meet all requiremets for scca. The roll bar Im sure you could get done for around $500 or so local and have it actually welded in which I would feel better about even for hpde's (I have a weld in roll bar for hpde's). Dont cheapout on your safety equipment, I have seen your whole build and you havent cheaped out on anything yet.

I switched from Sparco to Racetech and personally think Racetech makes a much better seat. I have the cheap RT1000 with FIA approval and its comfortable as hell. The price is around the same as some of the higher Sparco models, $700 range. I went with Crow harnesses which is basically like going with a simpson (Fred Crow left Simpson) anyway good luck with the rest of your build. You dont want to have redo things if you decide to get more serious and compete.

 

bump. some have expressed safety concerns of this to me via PM. thoughts?

 

Wait, what?

Rollbar + bucket seat + harness = unsafe? It's fine, period. Am I missing something?

 

i guess that because its not a full cage with no support along the windshield they are saying its still dangerous in the event of a roll over.

ill post all the PMs
not sure why he doesnt just post in this thread. but thats what he said. to be honest, i am thinking about having someone custom fab a weld in roll bar, instead of buying the bolt in autopower. while bolt in is cetainly easier, it looking pretty hard to find one for sale used local, and i would rather have a bar that connects to the shock towers

something like this but only the stuff behind the drivers seat. and then i could just add on to it to make it a full cage

 

nice comments, they should post them up for all to see rather than hidden in PM's. Opinions are fine, but by all means, share.

 

Doods... Im impressed but pad those cages please... helmet to cage isnt safe, and almost as bad as smashing your head on the cage without a helmet.
Great job.

 

He (they?) has(have) a valid point. Mainly, if you don't fit properly with the rollbar, it won't work. That's the case with any piece of safety equipment. That being said, most people have a particular budget in mind/available, and have to work within that constraint. If you can afford a weld-in job and have no plans of returning the car to stock/selling it as stock, that is definitely the better option. However, BE SPECIFIC ABOUT WHAT YOU WANT THE SHOP TO DO. Have tubing diameters and wall thicknesses laid out, as well as how close you want the bars to the roof/pillars, how far back you want it set, how you want the harness bar laid out, etc.

Just because HE didn't fit with his rollbar (and still chose to use it) does not mean you won't. I fit fine, and was placed at the correct spot with respect to the main hoop. You also have SOME leeway as to where exactly on the floor you mount it, as well as where you put your seat.

On a personal note, I don't usually get into those details with responses here. Maybe I should, for clarification:
-You should have at least x" (2"?) between the top of your helmet and the bottom of the main hoop bar on a horizontal plane.
-You should be roughly within y" (6"?) of the vertical plane of the main hoop. (the measurement details used to be posted SOMEWHERE, but I can't find them now)
-You want to be close, but not too close to the main hoop. Too close = your head hitting the bar. Too far = the bar doesn't do it's job.

Based on the criteria above, I'd say the CRX guy was both too far (horizontal) and too close (vertical) [in other words, sitting too high up]. In an HPDE car, most likely you will be making compromises. Be aware of your options, and choose appropriately based on what you're comfortable with. If you don't have the money to "do it right" be AWARE that you are taking extra risk. Some are ok with this, others are not. It is your life at stake.

 

I think the red line in the picture above should go out to the top of the fender.

I agree about picking the lowest possible seat. Luckily my head is lower than my seat backs. Im thinking about also removing the sliders now.