Hi, I am playing around with a z6 head I have laying. I will be putting it on my d16y8 in my beater this week end just for fun. Ran 15.3 and I'm trying to get in the 14's. I have ordered valve seals and full gasket kit and will be milling it 0.040" (I have an adjustable cam gear to compensate). I used my dremel to make division in the port sharp like a knife and will be slightly opening up the entry for anti-reversion.

I will be sending out the head for a milling and I am tempted to have a 3 angle valve job done at the same time. How much did you pay for yours and what angle cuts would you recommend for my pretty much stock setup?

I am also tempted to try the dimples, I mean, why not? This is not a very serious build. What do you guys think and how/where should I put them? anyone have pics?

Thanks for all the response!

 

i get mines done for $250 including resurface, 30-45-65 degree angles but on a b series head tho.

 

$225 CAD with what ever degrees you want.

plus $25 to resurface.

assembly included


if i was u i would try to lighten up the car first, and get more practice.... chances are getting your short track down will put you in the 14s.

 

I have been going to the track 2-3 nights a week for the past 6 years, here we have drag nights on tue-wed-thursday for 8$ a night about 15 mins away from where I live. I have removed p/s and AC and when I go to the track I remove the rear seats. What sucks is the car has power windows and power door lock. Its a 1991 civic Lx 4 door with a d16y8 thats been drinking coolant ever since I've had it. Ran 15.3@87mph with 2.27 0-60ft.

Thanks for all the responses, gives me a good idea of what I should pay.

what do you guys think about the dimples in the head?

 

Talk to Endyn about it im sure he's got couple of paragraphs to say about it lol.

 

ahh nice to see u got seat time.


i ran a 15.0 in my 1989 Si hatch (rear seats out) 2.1 60ft 87mph. its got a smoky A6 and a DX tranny. only made two passes this year and it ran 15.0 on the 2nd one!



what tranny you running?

 

whoa thats an amazing time!
It has an Si tranny.
those d16a6 seem to get faster as they get smokier :p

they charge me 260cad for the milling, installing valve seats and re-installing the valves.

 

That's a pretty standard rebuilder type VJ, not exactly "high performance". IIRC, OHC stuff usually likes a steeper top cut.

 

250 isnt bad price and for a 3 angle valve job its 30 46 60,the valve are 45

 

Is that a typo?

 

I said valve seats but its valve seals, I was in a hurry.
And I asked the machinist what was the price difference for valve resurfacing and 3 angle valve job. He said ''I always do 3 angle valve job when re-surfacing if it needs it, but if it doesnt need it I keep it 2 angle, otherwise its bad''
Don't know what the hell he meant but I know that for 260 cad, my valves will seat properly, my new seals will be installed, head will be cleaned and checked, the head will be milled 0.040'' and my valves will be re-installed, all in a 1 day delay.

For the port job I knife edged the valve seperation in the intake ports, enlarged a tiny bit the entry for anti-reversion, rubbed 80 grit sandpaper with my finger about 1 inch and made dimples (about 8 per port) where the injector sprays on the port roof. Will it work or do a difference? Only the track will tell!

For the parts I got OEM metal headgasket, 16 valve seals, cam seal, distributor seal and intake manifold gasket for 220$, what do you think?

 

kinda expensive for parts but if they are all OEM and give you no problems... well worth the money.

 

No, thats like 1950's tech that no one does anymore. Interference angle between the seat and valve face. In a couple seconds, that 46 deg. becomes 45.

 

^ I understand the concept, but with current materials & engineering, doesn't that put extra load on the seats or valve rim? I mean all this effort to keep the guides and valve stems true...do you find it still offers a measure of improvement?

Additionally, is this something that's applicable to race apps? I ask because even though the valve or seat may deform sufficiently to create a good interface, I wonder how it might affect heat transfer in a daily driven head (?)

To the OP, the standard 30/45/60 3-angle valve job in the Northern VA area runs from 250 to 300, including cleaning, resurface, valve reconditioning, valve seals (labor only) and valvetrain assembly (incl. setting spring heights). I've had two heads done at two different shops and both times I had removed the rocker shafts/arms myself. DOHC VTEC heads.

 

never had i said it was a "high performance" type vj. im just sharing what i use as far as seat angles. i kno steep cuts are what most head builders use.

 

45 is the normal angle regardless if its performance or factory rebuild

some high performance applications will benefit from 50 or 52 degrees depending on lift and cfm, but this is not the norm

as for the 3 angle vj, out with the old...

cnc radius vj ftw

 

radius vaginas are awesome.... hmmm

 

i paid $270 for hot tank cleaning , mill , 3 ANGLE valve job and reassemble on my b17 head

i thought it was a pretty good deal

 

car has been down since last friday because of wrong vtec solenoid. I have a solenoid that I removed from another d16z6 I had and it isnt the same, it wont fit. I have had 4 people sell/give me solenoids that they assured me was from a 92-95 civic ex, and they dont fit. wtf? I saw one on a b16 and it was the one that I needed, why??

 

can the 50-52 seat be cut on a factory seat, or new seats have to be use?

 

That's what I thought, I just heven't heard of anyone actually doing it in a loooong time.

It's what some of us call a "rebuilder's trick". From what I understand, the whole point of the two different angles is to help leakdown/compression test numbers. With the valve at 45 and the seat at 46, it leaves a very small surface area that the valves actually contact the seat. With the same spring pressure, it creates higher unit loading (more force per sq. in.) which helps seal.

This is not good in for an actual running enigne. You are correct that one of the jobs of the valve seat is to transmit heat out of the valve. With the reduction in actual surface area where the valve meets the seat, that job is severely hindered. This is not a procedure that should be done in competitive race engines.

I know, but I just added that in there since the OP is trying to run faster, so performance is the name of the game here.

I've never been a fan of a radius on the intake valvejobs except for under the bowl cut to blend in the throat diameter. The exhaust seems to like them though, more so when it's not just a single radius.

For us V8 guys, we really only run 50+ degree seats for larger throat diameters the steeper angle affords. A lot of times, we can't use a valve big enough to get the throat diameter we want, so a 50-55 seat is how we get around that. It beats up the seat a lot worse, so it's really only used in engines that are rebuilt regularly (race engines).

Is that why you guys run steeper seats too? I would think where we are valve limited because of bore sizes, you guys are valve limited by v2v clearance. Or am I way off here? lol

 

50-52-55 deg seats suck *** on 4V heads.

 

i do 3 angle VJ's (30-45-60 with a 44 degree cut on the valve) on my heads and on some turbo apps ill do a radius cut on the exhaust side.


mike

 

Why do the 45 degree seat and 44 degree valve? Why not just a 45 degree cut for both?

 

the angles intersect and seal. i think its safe to say that the 44 turns into a 45 in no time though.


mike