Hey H-T guys/gals,

So before i get bashed for using the whale ***** intake instead of a AEM or something cause "they make more power" I got it for $50 off a buddy, couldnt pass it up.

Anyways I have been pondering putting a BPi 3" velocity stack/filter kit on my passwordJDM intake for a bit now. I have been looking at dyno charts and they show gains in ALL comparisons i have come across, but those were all on 3" generic or aem units. My question is would increased air velocity into a larger tube create a better pressure number through and through in return making better HP numbers? Im looking for educated answers/opinions. I have thought this over ALOT and i dont see how it could hurt. higher velocity air from a larger volume area going into a smaller area hold has to create better numbers right?

Id like some input, and lets not flame... i think this is a legit question. Im a turbo guy, but until i get my motor built i wanna play around a bit.

 

Conservation of mass:

(mass flow rate in) = (mass flow rate out)

mass flow rate = (density)(velocity)(area)

Assume that density is constant.

(velocity out) = (velocity in) * (area in)/(area out)

So yes, in theory, the faster you can pull the air in at the filter, the faster it will move at the plenum.

Correct me if I'm wrong, but this is what I learned in fluid mechanics this semester .

 

haha glad someone with some schooling in this can help. I took some physics, but nothing too in depth. but seriously i think the larger plenum on the whale ***** intake w/ the increased velocity of air has potential to outperform the 3" pipes. more air+higher velocity has to be a power maker.

 

Well, you're only looking at one aspect of the system.

The formula I gave above is only looking at the inlet and outlet of the intake (control volume).

You also have to consider the intake manifold, valve job, header, etc. Engineering and research take a lot of time and money.

The time and money I'm paying for my education > cost of the stack, so just buy it and take it to the dyno .

 

it has nothing to do with the air speed. it is the length that creates resonant tuning. Thats where your power comes from with cold airs and why short rams dont make **** for power or torque. Moving the air faster will create better throttle response but thats it

 

Well yes and no. The reasonant tuning is correct but the air speed/velocity does have an effect on power. When the intake valve(s) close, the air will "stack" up on the back of the valve head, creating a positive pressure. When the valve opens, the cylinder will have a higher, more dense, fill rate, of air. The faster the air moves up that pipe, the more pressure it creates at the valve, the more air fills the cylinder and the more power it makes. Reasonant tuning is usually dictated by total length which includes intake pipe, manifold and port, to the valve and RPM range.

 

yes but having velocity alone will not gain you anything; basically the OPs situation. The PW intake has been proven not to do diddly for power. By adding the v-stack to it he is simply increasing velocity. Not having an optimal length/size intake is hurting him more than adding velocity will help him. Having a v-stack on a 3in cold air or tuned length will be the best bet for anyone giving good velocity and resonance tuning.

 

But i dont have a 3" pipe so thats not my question/issue. I am STRICTLY looking at the design of the PW intake and higher air velocity. From I have read and been told I should have nothing but an increase in power. even if its 3-5hp ts something, and i like popping the hood and having something to show off a bit. I have a magic arm for the track.

 

Well at the very least it would be an interesting test, so give it a try and let us know how you make out.

 

I definately plan on it. Im out of state in school right now and wont have the motor built and car on the road til mid june. I will probably do a small build thread and post up dyno sheets as well. Ill see if my tuner will do unadjusted pulls w/ the stack, w/o the stack, and stack+ filter and post what i get. It will be tuned open stack no filter cause ill run a similar setup on track days.

 

luckily, swapping the stack on and off doesn't usually require much if any tuning to see the difference so this is a test you can easily perform in a couple dyno pulls.

 

00Red_SiR what kind of numbers does you car put down on the dyno? Im doing a similar built w/o cams, they will be 00 ITR's on S2 gears done w/ cam timing. Im shooting for 200whp w/ all OEM parts in the motor.

 

It was 192whp, 126TQ SAE corrected (200whp/132tq STD) on a Dyno Jet. That's without having the cams dialed in/tuned or the maps (timing and fuel) fully tuned. I'll be doing both of those this spring and posting the final numbers.

 

Very nice setup looking forward to your future numbers! How do you think running a cat, even though it's high flow effects your numbers? Fortunately I'm in FL and we don't have to run them, I just wanted to know the effects on hp running a "correct" exhaust setup.

 

I could get away without running a cat here as the only inspection we have is a visual one. I run a cat because it helps quiet the exhaust (allbeit not much) and I look at it as trying to be somewhat responsible environmentally. The cat I use is an SMSP 200 cell high flow cat which is their highest flowing cat that they sell. I've looked at their flow numbers and I would honestly be surprised if I were to gain even 1-2 hp if I ran a test pipe instead. To me, not running one isn't worth the little if any power I might gain in the top end, I would sooner remove my PS belt and gain 5hp from there.

 

Good to know! I appreciate the reply man.

 

Nice. Was that with the cams and everything and just not fully tuned or before you did the VT upgrade? Dynojets seem to read a bit lower on numbers as well, Im sure its a fun car. Ill be tuned on a dynopak at speedfactory here in WA which does GREAT work/tuning. Im sure on that dyno you would be well over 200whp. Have you tracked it at all? Im hoping to get 13's in the 1/4, at least that my goal... on slicks.

 

That was the way the car is now, only exception was that it was on my old Hondata S200. I have since upgraded to the S300. The car is very fun to drive but I haven't tracked it the way it is now, I will once I complete a few things this spring.

 

Right on. Cant wait to see the final numbers and track times. i bet low 13's are possible on slicks with the setup your running. your should be able to make 220whp with everything all in tune and synched up.

 

have you measured the entry of your whale *****? I think you will need a huge v-stack. Dunno about power and I'm anxious to see, but one thing's for sure this thing is gonna be crazy loud.

 

password make a stack for that intake

 

Yea the opening is 4.5" big. I plan on sliding the V-stack into the intake til its flush amd using a resin to hold it together by mating the v-stack to the edge of the intake. kind of a home-made thing but im sure i can make it work out well. I know its going to be loud, and i run the ws2 exhaust so it should be sweet.

I know PW made a CF stack for it but the opening to that is in the 4" range... and its 110 bucks. I can get the BPI stack w/ filter for 96. The smaller diameter inlet will allow for a higher velocity of airflow as well.

 

Decided to BUMP this older post.

I got the motor built and tuned over the summer so now Im looking at numbers and such hoping we can try to make a more educated opinion on whether this would work or not.

My setup is very mild, although Ill be building the head this summer w/ Skunk2 Pro 1 cams and throwing some RC 310's on it as well. This is all in my quest for 200whp on my current setup WITH my WS2 catback attached.

Heres my setup: 82mm GSR block w/ PR3 pistons (11.3:1-ish CR)
B16 head w/ 00' ITR cams on S2 gears
Stock P30 IM/TB
rmf narrow header
Yowaii SS intake
Apexi WS2 catback
Made 175whp and 130tq w/ the exhaust on

Now my idea would be to mate a 3" or 3.5" stack to my intake with adhesive in hope of creating faster air speeds in larger volume.

Open for ideas/interpretation. I WILL NOT GET A DIFFERENT INTAKE!!! I got this one for a steal and want to make 200whp with it.

 

b16 intake manifold is killing you. its designed for a 1.6 liter, not a 1.8 or higher.

i put a type r manifold on a stock lsvtec that had a b16 im and gained 12 whp.

and buy a s2000/itr throttle body while your at it. your making your 200whp quest way to hard for you with those not so 200whp parts. If you want to pick up another 25hp, you need to buy the best oem parts if u want to stay oem.

 

Meh the P30 and ITR manifolds are nearly identical. I saw a dyno test comparing the 2 on a 1.8 and the difference was like 3whp, but the P30 make better power up until about 8k where the ITR peaked it out. Not worth the headache of tracking down to me.

Besides this thread is discussing the use of a V-stack on a power chamber intake and making better power, not the IM/TB. Im looking for input on increased airflow with the added volume this intake offers.