90 ef sedan d16a6 with zc head.

i've been posting alot about this recently, here is a re-cap of whats going on and what i've replaced.

The water pump started leaking so i changed it out with a new one. after i did that, i was blowing air into the overflow tank, my car started blowing white smoke and was getting hard to start, then stopped starting.

i took off the head to find water and a little oil in the cylinders sitting on the pistons. i flushed everything out and put on a ZC head along with a brand new head gasket which was NOT backwards.

i fired it up again and of course i still had the hard to start problem, once it started i was spitting out white smoke and i had to keep it revved so it wouldnt die. also it was stuttering very badly when i would give it gas.

so as of now, it starts after about 10 seconds of revving but i cannot drive it like this. i think i probably have a warped block, what are the odds that i have 2 bad heads? can places test the integrity of a block with it still in the car? i really dont want to take all that **** out if i dont have to.

 

bump....i've been doing a buttload of research on this and i've come across the possibility of a bad radiator. dont know how this would be the culprit but some other dude had bubbling in the overflow tank and he swapped rads and it went away!

but if my rad was bad, would that lead to water getting into the exhaust? i dont really see any relation there but who knows i could have a bad head/block AND a faulty rad.

when my waterpump was leaking out of the weep hole, it took me about a week to have the time to replace it. this is my only car so i HAD to drive it, just kept adding water/coolant. there is a strong chance my rad went bad since it would get dry very quickly.

oh a nother thing, i broke a bolt in the water pump, the bolt below the gear, so its only held on by 4 bolts instead of 5. i was told by the deal that its possibly to have a hairline opening between the seal and block on that part of the pump that would allow air to get pumped into the system.

 

i have a feeling i didnt tighten the head studs to spec. i dont have a torque wrench and i probably could have gotten them tighter than i did.

im gonna tighten the head studs tonight and see if that helps. another thing, if im running rough while all this is happening, is it safe to say i have water in the combustion chamber?

 

bump

 

Cracked sleeve possibly? If it's puffing white smoke, you have coolant in the chambers which is a bad sleeve, head, or headgasket. If you didn't torque them correctly, it may leak some, but i don't know that it's your problem. If it's hard to start, it's either got cylinders full of water or no compression. You usually cannot have the block checked by a shop while it's in the car. Try to retorque bolts, if it's still leaking, its got to all come back apart.

A bad radiator cannot cause coolant getting into the cylinders.

 

yea the bolts i dont think are torqued either enough, or in sequence...anyways this may sound noobish but the sleeve is the "piston housing" right?

anyways my gf is at home right now and she said the car fired right up. it was hard to start a few days ago cuz it was getting flooded with fuel for some reason but seems to start up fine now. BUT i still have white smoke!

i know its possible for this to be left over coolant from the bad headgasket. im thinking of taking it for a drive to see if it will burn itself out OR if i still have a continuous leak.

 

Yes, the sleeve is what is around the piston. You may still want to properly torque your headbolts down if they are not torqued enough. Do not take any of the bolts loose and run them back in though. Its usually important to follow the sequence, but it will not always cause an immediate problem if you dont. After you torque the bolts down, drive it for a half hour or so, if its still smoking, it needs to come back apart.

 

im using the "unknown condition" zc head i picked up off some dude on craigs list. im not sure if i want to restore my a6 head or mess around with this zc head. i dont think i warped my a6 head, then pick up another warped head. its gotta be a block problem.

since i have the a6 head off i think im gonna remove the valves and give them a nice cleaning.

 

Did u do a leak down test? That would tell u if u have a warped block. Or if u have the head off then u can get a trusted straight edge and a feeler gauge. Find the spec and go from there. I don't think the sleeve is cracked u would kno it. I've seen cracked sleeves where it's just a hairline crank and u could hear the rings scratchn against that crack

 

Did u have the head resurfaced?

 

Check the EFSS thread, i posted a torque sequence and specs for the d16a6.

 

update, check out the oil!

im gonna focus on my a6 head which is OUT of the car...this is the head that the car had the problems with. i have an unknown zc head on the car now. the oil did NOT look like this with the a6 head before i changed the headgasket.

the straight edge was good for the a6 head, that **** was straight, more than likely i just blew that gasket. but now with this zc head, who the hell knows.

 

alright guys im in the market for a new engine! excited but kinda sad at the same time, im not looking forward to dishing out hundreds of bucks. Its either that or i can keep borrowing cars!

i wanted some opinions, i want to stay obd0, D series and i dont care if its vtaaak or not. i dont need a tranny or an ecu since the pm6 seems to play well with others. oh and my EX axles are compatible with all D series even zc right?

 

dude, just putting a straight edge on the block/head will not tell you jack... if the head is warped a couple thousands, it can leak. You need a straight edge (or parallel) with a feeler gauge.

It is HIGHLY likely that you have two warped heads. You know nothing about the heads you have... correct? one came with the leaky car, the other was bought from CL. The deck could be warped too.

When you take the head off, you can't simply swap in a new gasket. Here is a quick breakdown of the proper process to change a head gasket. *Check the Chilton manual for exact details*
•take off the head, reversing the bolts in the proper sequence. Do NOT tap a screwdriver between the head and block.
•clean both surfaces until there is no gasket material left. Do not use too coarse of a cleaning pad. Razor blade and some gasoline works well.
•Clean ALL bolts and nuts, just clean everything! seriously
•spec the head and deck WITH A FEELER GAUGE
•if it's not in spec, you have to have the head or deck sent out to be milled.
•if it's in spec, or once you get the motor back, then you can reassemble the head
•use the proper sequence and torque on the head bolts.
-I've been tipped off that you should clean the head bolts, blow all dirt out of the threaded holes, and then put a little oil on the threads of the bolt when you put them back in.

I would call a machine shop and see how much they charge to re-surface a head and or engine block. I know for me, it's cheaper than a new motor.
Good Luck

 

i was quoted $100 for the head examined including jetwash, resurfacing and hot tanked.

then i was told that the block has to be taken out of the car, STRIPPED down and then can be decked and checked out.

i can get a d16a6 for like 350-400. im not gonna spend at least 200 and then be told, "your head is bad." or "your block is bad.".

if im gutting the engine bay anyways, i might as well drop something else in.

 

but what shape is the $400 d16 in? there are no guarantees that it won't need a new head gasket as well.

If you take the head to the shop (BTW, those are good prices) they can tell you before you spend the money, whether or not the head is usable.

Why do you think they will tell you your head/block is bad?

 

acutally the place that i called that gave me those prices told me i'de have to pay before they could tell me anything. that discouraged me big time.

IF i do have a bad block, there is a lot of effort involved in removing it and taking it to a shop to get checked out. so for me its gut everything and replace with something entirely new to me.

 

check the block before you take it out. If it's with in spec, then it doesn't need the milling...

bummer that they make you pay before you get any work done.

 

i've heard that if i have a cracked sleeve, i'de PROBABLY be able to either hear it or feel it when turning the crank pulley. well i was turning the crank and it was as smooth as it "should" be i guess. no resistance, no noises and no hard spots. also my rings are good since water was sittin on the pistons and not sinking below them.

my father in law is a mechanic, he was telling me that once something major like this happens (water in oil) that the car will basically never run the same. now i would LOVE to salvage what i have, only because i've put in so much work i'de hate to pull the block and run into who knows how many problems, i dont have a hoist for the new motor so theres one!

like i said before, if i can salvage this, i'de focus on the a6 head since i know how that one ran. there are a couple of things i have NOT tried yet that may be worth a shot...

-3 layer metal gasket from an EG
-put a6 head back on and do the head studs in sequence.

this could be all it takes to make sure everything will run.

 

i would almost definitely have the head milled after an blown gasket.
Even if you go back to the a6 head, it's only aluminum.

but your plan seems like it could work well.

 

my only concern is to focus on the head, then to relize the block is at fault. but hey i wont know until i try!

i can get a sohc zc long block (ill use my pm6 and si tranny) for $499 from hmotorsonline.com. but im getting some confusion regarding the axles.

start up guarantee within 30 days of purchase, 30-50k miles.

 

oh something interesting...cylinder 3 (third from the dizzy side) was "smoking" when i took out the spark plug after revving it for a couple minutes. also cylinders 1 and 2 had a little bit of oild on the spark plug tips while cylinders 3 and 4 had bone dry plugs.

 

SOHC ZC = d16a6. just swap everything you have to the zc and call it a day. your ex axles will work on the sohc tranny. or better yet just re use your tranny.

 

yea my plan is to use the SI tranny i have. **** too bad i cant find a JDM short block ZC.

 

why? you can make money off of the long block. you could sell the intake manifold and all it's accessories and the dizzy that comes with the zc for like 150 or so