im bout to buy a integra and i wanna build a poormans type r s/c what pistons should i use im buying the block separate so i might *** well change the pistons what pistons are hood and why

 

bump give me ahand

 

You should buy the bisimoto spec Arias pistons. That is what i have in my N/A B18c Ek swap.This race spec pistons feature aluminum wrist pin buttons, ceramic coated domes, moly coated skirts, flow bench designed high compression domes, and can be configured for 2 and 3 ring designs. That's why they are hood.

 

if im reading this right (poormans type r s/c) go with forged internals.

 

^^^^ nah yea i kno deff but what kind and what compression ratio should i be shooting for ?? i want it 2 be relaible and still make 250-300 whp?
plz excuse the spelling lol typing oon my phone

 

s/c as in supercharged?

 

9.0:1 CP pistons.

You cant go wrong with CPs. They are recommended by most engine builders, because they have great heat tolerance, not that noisy, and are very strong.

There are other brands, but CPs have been tested and have stood up to great amounts of pressure.

Because those are forged, and pin design, you will need some aftermarket rods as well. These can be anything from Eagle, to Manley, to Pauter. Its really up to you. All depends on your budget and power goals.

I would definitely keep it between 9.0:1 and 10.0:1.

9.0:1 would help you squeeze out more power from pump gas without the demand for higher octane fuel or race gas. Also, its better to run lower compression and higher boost to satisfy the power level that you want to be at, than to have higher compression with low boost.

 

i wanna wasit around 2 grand not including buying the block and head i might go turbo im not sure...
one thing is i keep looking around for cams and rods and pistons and stuff everything is like 500 dollars so ima wasit more than 2k...
not to mention i want it to be super reliable i wanna upgrade the oil pump the cams pistons crank bearing rings valves, springs , and retainers..
what do u recomend?

 

yea supercharged

 

If you turbo how much are you wanting to boost? If you turbo and get Eagle rods and SRP pistons you could boost 20 psi without blowing.
I don't know how good CP pistons are, if they're better than SRP pistons then you can probably boost more/get more power out of it.

 

SRP pistons are garbage.

2 grand for a full motor build is not gonna cut it sorry.

A good piston/rod combo with bearings will be around 700-900. That doesnt include the labor to pull the block apart and put all that stuff in/balance/etc. 2,000 is not a realistic budget, and if that all you have, then i suggest you buy it built already or save up some more.

The parts for the head and block alone will cost around that all together. I spent 2000 on my head alone, and that was for hottanking, disassembly, assembly, new ferrea valves, valve seals, new cam gears, new timing belt, new tensioner, 5 angle valve job, and head gasket. Not including intake manifold. Also that price was to put the head on the block with arp bolts and adjust everything properly. If you are going to do all of that, i can honesly say right now that 2 grand will NEVER cut it. The labor will kill you before the parts do.

 

You can do an all motor build N/A and still get 250 hp. You'll need a good fuel system.

Fuel - walbro fuel pump, I say 550cc RC fuel injectors, a 4 bar map sensor (hondata/omnipower)

Then you'll also need a skunk2 intake manifold with a throttle body of your choosing - I had skunk2 68 mm throttle body. (need good air flow to go along with your new fuel set up) Of course, intake, exhaust, header, and hi flow cat.

Don't get your block or head ported and polished, it's not needed and not worth the money. Just get them both hot tanked.

Engine internals - I had civic type r pistons bored .25 over in mines, very good for high revving. Or you could use mahle pistons, also great for revving. Mines performance in Japan uses Mahle on their builds. You can use your stock rods but I suggest getting them shot peened or else go with eagle or research for forged rods of your liking, but you need new rod bearings, I used king motorsports. ARP rod bolts, have your crank micropolished and balanced. Get ARP head bolts and a cosmetic head gasket.

Then your head is very important. This is where you'll spend the money and it'll be really worth it.
Get a 3 angle valve job on your head. You could choose to get type r Valve springs which is cheaper to find a set of used ones or go with skunk2 more costly but better if you wanna hit 250-300hp safely (do it right the first time), stainless steel valves, get titanium retainers. Replace your valve stem seals just to be safe, they're cheap.
And cams - type r if you wanna stay on a low budget, or else go with skunk2 pro series2 or 3 camshafts. Get the pro series, not the tuner series if you wanna hit high hp on a built motor. And you'll need cam gears.

Then get a chipped ecu and have it professionally tuned, you'll hit over 250hp on that set up. And it'll be wicked quick, motor will sound so sweet (don't get a annoying can muffler - I had a apex ws2 and sounded so sexy)

I had skunk2 valve train and pro series3 cams on skunk2 adj. cam gears with ctr pistons and my car dynoed at 273 hp and 169lb torque. It picked up real fast my turbo teg had turbo lag. But all motor will kick *** and the motor sounds real real real good. You can hit over 250hp without a turbo or supercharger. And N/A is safer too.

Oh a clutch, you'll need a clutch to handle the horses and LSD as well, or else you'll end up having to replace your drive shaft alot. I found that out the hard way. Well worth it though. You'll be happy with the all motor build. I did all the assembly myself, but machine shop costs were around 300, parts were about 1600 for the head and bottom. For the fuel and intake manny and TB were around 800. I already had intake, headers, exhaust and hi flow cat. New chipped ecu was 275 came with obd2 to obd1 harness and tune ran me 200.

for a tune john vega at phearable.net he is the best.

 

^^^Skunk2 Pro 3s are not considered to be streetable cams. If this is the OP's daily driver, i highly doubt he wants something that serious.

PLUS. To get that much hp out of an NA motor, you will need tons of money. Not cost effective at all. Especially when honda motors can hold about 300whp with the use of FI. And it cost wayy less.
The build you are telling him to do, he can just swap over a K20, intake, 3 inch, Kpro, and he will almost be at that, probably spending less money as well.


ONCE AGAIN:

The OP said he wants to waste 2k on motor, so please dont give him advice that hes not looking for. Stay within his budget to help him out. No 10k b series builds please...

 

On a turbo motor, the head is not the most important part, its the block. The head can be left, sometimes untouched and make very good power. Using a GSR block, which is what i assume you mean by Poormans type R...You can easily squeeze 300whp with just a 57trim, WITH A GOOD TUNE. No need to build the block for that power goal.

There have been numerous people on this forum that have pulled off about 350whp, reliably, for a quite some time. Sometimes even more than that. If you really DO insist on building it for boost, i would recommend at least some pistons/rods/bearings. New oil pump, water pump, timing belt, tensioner and head gasket.

Injectors are pretty easy to get, since for that power, DSMs are all you need. Most importantly, you will need to focus on Fuel Management and Tuning. That is key.

 

1. Uh you cant use stock rods on forged pistons. The pin setup has to changed which is not worth it.

2. Cometic headgaskets are garbage. OEM quality cannot be beaten, and all OEM headgaskets are able to fit up to 81.5 oversize bore.

3. 273hp with an Apexi WS2?!??!? 2 1/4 piping???

4. NA IS NOT SAFER! I dont know where you get your rationale, but anything that seriously built will encounter just as many problems are a boosted car. Please do not misinform the OP.

5. 300 for labor???? 1600 for parts TOP AND BOTTOM?????
Now i really dont believe you. lol. Skunk2 Valve train is over 500 alone, skunk2 cams are over 500 alone, Skunk2 Cam gears are about 200 alone. Thats already 1200. Then pistons, bearings, oil pump water pump, etc....

6. To the OP, please dont take this guys advice.

 

gotta ask what you wanna do with the motor. boost? n/a? if boost then stay with lower compression pistons, 10.1 or lower. all motor then 11.1 and up. 250hp is alot for an all motor b-series and will cost tons of money. as you stated before you dont want to spend over $2k so go the force induction route. factor in for a tune also. its a MUST!!!

 

^^OP said he wanted a supercharger in his very first post...

 

I wasn't talking about the head being the most important part on a turbo build, I was talking if he wanted to go N/A. on a N/A, yes, the head is very important. And I had that build, which I built myself and had machine shop do some work, and look at the prices I posted up, not 10k. Maybe for 10k for someone who doesn't do it themselves. I had a budget of 2500 when I did mines, I went over it a little, but well worth it.

 

I don't think you need to change the pistions, keep the compression hwere it is spend money on tuning. you do not want high compression pistions in a FI setup as others have said

 

hahahhahahaha!!!! You're really good at being a dumbass!
1) I wasn't talking about using stock rods on forged pistons, I was talking if he used CTR piston, yes, he can use stock rods dumbass which I have used on one of my builds. On forged pistons no, but on ctr pistons, yes dumbass!

2)I do agree, oem are better than cosmetic.

3)yes, 273hp on with my ws2 with my 2/34 in. piping done at LHT performance with a high flow cat and DC headers. Skunk2 intake manny and TB, and AEM cold air intake and professionally tuned. Of course with the built internal on block and head I have listed.

And I had skunk2 pro3 cams, and ran great for my daily driver and kicks *** when vtec kicks in. Sounds really nice when revving too.

4)You are more likely to blow your motor on boost, depending on you drive. I have seen many and done it myself. It is you that probably only built one motor or not even and think you know everything.

5)For your info, Some of the parts I found used, I live in a area where parts are abundant, some were new, the bearings, CTR pistons, gaskets, RC injectors, I already had the oil pump and a new waterpump since I recently changed my timingbelt. I bought used but in very good condition from cars that were wrecked, mostly from behind. My intake manny and TB which you can find everywhere used, just look and search. My eagle rods and skunk2 valve train were used, I bought new valves and seals though. And my skunk2 pro3 cams, I bought it used on here Honda tech a while back. And were in very good condition.
And yes, $300 for machine shop costs, cause I had stripped everything prior to taking it to them, so they just hot tanked, decked the block, bored and honed my block. My head, they just hot tanked and did a 3 angle valve job. Some shops want alot, but I searched around my area and found one that did everything for 1/2 the price of the others and were pretty darn good, I use them all the time. Their shop wasn't spic and span clean but their work is well known in my area and hasn't failed me yet.

6) I was just giving my opinion, saying you can hit over 250hp on a N/A. You don't have to go turbo. I've done both turbo and N/A all motor already, personally, I like all motor.

 

civic_ferio, sorry if I trashed your thread a little by going at it with JdmTypeRdc2. But just voicing my opinion and experience. You don't use high compression unless your going all motor, if your going for boost, get low compression. On my turbo boosted motor, I used CP pistons with eagle rods and acl race bearings. I had a friend who used JE pistons and his outcome wasn't so good.

 

If you didnt want me to question you, you should have been SPECIFIC. And no, you are not more likely to blow a motor while boosting...that is a misconception.

In your initial post you mention to get a Cometic head gasket...but now you say "oem is better than cometic".
You say ws2...and thats it. ws2s come with 2 1/4 piping. Nowhere did you say that it had custom piping...and you get mad because people question you.

Its not my fault you dont know how to write out your thoughts clearly.


BTW no need for name calling...I never once referred to you as a dumbass, so please respect me in return...E-thugging is not allowed, so dont act tough cuz theres a monitor in front of you.

 

2 grand. You can can piece a turbo kit togather and boost it at 8lbs tuned on a stock motor. Your call.

If you have a steady income you can get a K24 motor and swap that in over time.

 

boost is the easiest way to get power, but needs to be well tuned. just cant slap on a turbo/sc and call it a day. i currently have an ek stock ls turbo pushing 247hp 225tq. feels great! spent alil over 2grand w/tune.

 

TUNE, TUNE, TUNE...is what i always say.

The motor can be very solid, but with a shitty tune, it will break just like any other.