The engine is a stroked out B16a2 (as we dont get 18s in Brazil.....)

The CR is a little low, considering I will be running pure ethanol, but considering I got the stroker kit for 850usd shipped, it was a good deal...

Cams were degreed with a degree disk, all chambers are equalized, and the head got a little polish just to remove imperfections....


Head
-Polish
-BLOX Springs
-KMS Steel retainers
-BLOX tuner B spec cams
-Adjustable cam gears
-New guides and retainers
-OEM Head Gasket
-OEM head bolts


Block
-EAGLE crank 84.7mm
-EAGLE H Beam Rods
-Custom Arias pistons 81.5mm 11.3 CR
-ARIAS OEM rings
-Bronzinas ACL race .25 over
-ITR OEM Oil pump with mods
-New GMB water pump
-ARP studs


Intake and Fuel
-Stock IM
-62mm TBI
-750cc Siemens injectors
-MSD Fuel pump 286lph in tank
-AEM FPR


Exhaust
-Ebay 4x1 Inox header
-2,5" straight pipe


Ignition
-MSD spark cables
-Iridium IX sparks
-MSD Blaster SS coil
-MSD dist. cover
-MSD Rotor


Drivetrain
-Displato ceramic clutch (brazilian brand)
-New transmission retainers
-OEM flywheel lightened


Tune
-Chipped P08-010
-EcTune
-Wideband 24/7



Others
-Underdrive ebay crank pulley
-Eristic gaskets
-Gates radiator hoses
-Energy bushings
-Fremax rotors
-Powerbrakes pads (brazilian brand also)
-No AC
-No rear interior
-Gates t-belt




The engine just got started this week, and the car will run realy soon...


I will be going to USA in the end of the year so I am going to buy some stuff to the car... Ill probably bring a skunk2 coilover kit + some boltons to the engine, like a good header and a good IM.. But as my head is a little screwed, there is a chance i can get a full endyn head...



The engine took 2 months to be built, all clearances are exact bla bla, how much power should I expect from this setup? 180whp-ish?

Video of the engine's first start


Thank you so much

 

a couple of things:

when u come to the states get a b20 block so u can build an engine with a better rod ratio and mor capacity. i kno u hav pistons and rods already but if u git a B20 block u can use a longer rod and a bigger bore to produce a lot more horse power and torque. u can sell the pistons and rods later.

instead of the 1767cc u hav now u wood hav a 1899cc engine (with 84.5mm pistons) that can rev a lot higher and make better use of the mods u already hav.

the other thing is DO NOT use the stock intake manifold!!! it is good that u plan on picking up one when u get to the states.

one mor thing.... dont use that underdrive pulley u hav. a build like this wil need damping.

i think u can make 210-220HP and 150TQ wit the setup i suggested.

 

thanks for the reply.

I will think about gettina a B20 block when i go to US...


One think i could not understand is, why I shouldnt use the underdrive pulley?

It will not dump the vibration coming from the engine?

 

wait, how is he going to rev higher with a b20 than a b16? and make more power becasue of a longer rod? Neither of those make sense

 

rite, it wil not dampen the crank harmonics.

which will lead to spun bearings and maybe mor.

 

Seriously???

OK i'll bite.....

a B16 block is 203mm tall. even if he used pistons with a compression height of 26mm it would only allow for a rod ratio of 1.59, around the same as a GSR/Type R.

with a CRV block which is 211.8mm tall and 84mm bore the capacity is increased of course. with his 84.7mm crank in this block as opposed to the B16 block he can net
1899cc which is of course bigger than the 1767cc he has now. even if he used stock
30mm CH pistons his rod ratio would b 1.64. with 26mm CH pistons it would b 1.69

HENCE..... Better All Around

 

thanks guys about the infos

I did not know abou the pulley...

I will run the car a little, then I will remove the pulley and put the stock one...

 

RS has nothing to do with how high you can rev and a longer rod doesnt make more power. The CRANK is where your power is so ya Seriously

 

the factory pully has a damper built into it. Non-dampened aftermarket ones can lead to spun bearings and shattered oil pump gears. If you want a better damper, ATI is the way to go. Other than that stay with the factory piece. You will gain 1-2hp at most so the risk is not worth the reward

 

again, SERIOUSLY!!! ur jokin rite???

how many F1, Indy, Super Bikes/Moto GP, Formula Renault, ALMS, etc. do u see running rod ratios below 1.8???

all the above RACE engine layouts hav bigger bores than strokes

seriously dude if that were true then B20s/B18As, D16s, H22s, and F23s would be made to rev to 10,000 rpm. THEY DO NOT. the best of these has a rod ratio of 1.54.... which is PURE ****!!

why do u think Honda replaced the GSR/Type R with the K20 which has a BIGGER bore, REDUCED stroke and a LONGER rod!!!!!!!!!!!!!

STROKE HUH???? the two most powerful NA four cylinder engines EVER produced the Nissan SR16VE N1 and the F20C hav strokes of 68.7mm and 84mm respectively. wut else do these Juggernauts hav in common???? BIG *** BORES and LLOONNGG *** RODS!!!

B16As, B16Bs and F20Cs all hav bigger bores than strokes and they all rev MUCH higher and all hav rod ratios of at least 1.74

even NASCAR engines hav rod ratios of 1.9 or better.... they do 10K all day long

bore is where you make power

when u calculate displacement u multiply the bore twice not the stroke

damn yo, i cant believe u actually made that statement....WOW!!!

 

only thing RS effects is the amount of wear/stress on the engine parts, hence why the big race cars have them so they can last the entire race without issues. You can make a b20 rev to 10k without a hiccup if you have the right headwork and cams to support power up there. Why dont you go ask miller of NRG-Tech who is running mid-8s with his LS stroke motor revving to 11k. Bore is where you can make some power yes but the most power and torque is made with the crank. Ever wonder why alot of all motor guys stroke their race car engines? Again your stuck on the RS ratio. And the K20 only has a 1.62 RS ratio. A d15b has an RS of 1.62 but they dont rev to the same RPMs. Why is that if what your saying is true? Stroke makes torque and thats where your real power comes from. YOu can bore an engine to hell and back it doesn't matter. Take an engine, same bore sizes but one with a bigger stroke, which one is gonna make more power?

 

Rod ratio is so much talked about and never really completely understood by 99% of people on here or any other forum site,a 84.7 mm stroke B16a block will rev to 9k and make great power for a very long time some people need to start to build engines and top reading all this useless info on forums.I read for years that you cant rev a STD sleeved B20 because they will crack so I built one and it turns to 9600rpm everytime its on the track still runs fine and sets lap records a most events for its class hmm go figure but all the e-mechanic's said it will break.
Regards Uncle Dave

 

u and Uncle Dave win... i giv up.

jus keep reving yor 150mm stroke B20s to the moon... good luck, hav fun

 

i read for years also and did research and build engines. i was into Hondas back in 89 before they were even popular. that shood giv u some indication as to how old i am. so i do hav some knowledge about them and this subject.
u guys hav one tuning perspective i hav another.

BUT I DO KNO MY ENGINE WIL LAST LONGER THAN ANYTHING U OR 1.5Slowmatic BUILD....

thanx for the debate....PEACE

 

The rod ratio debate will never be over will it? in an ideal world we would all have engines with the PERFECT rod ratio and PERFECT piston speeds whatever they are but this is not a perfect world hey.
Regards Uncle Dave

 

so what...


car is running now, cams set at 0,0 street crap tuned in 15 minutes but the car does not feel that strong...

It has much more low end torque than before, but vtec crossover is not as strong as it should and high end power is not that great.



Idk if it will get better after dyno tune, of after I set the cams better...


but i am kinda disapointed... something is holding me back....



BTW, i had to pull the head off, as the machine shop made a mistake and the car is burning oil....






thx guys

 

i gaurantee u that IM and header are holding u back

 

The biggest "custom stroke for b series" is 95mm before u have to start welding deck plates on.
Reality wise, your right to a point, but I back uncle dave.. because well, he knows what he's talking about.. Not just because he's a good friend and very knowleagble but, its because its true.

Ya, Rod to stroke ratio plays a part.. But not nearly as important as mean piston speed.. generally you see alot of guys destroking ls and b20's so they can rev high, thats completely wrong.. a long rod combo with the 89mm crank will yield 10k revs all day. I would know. I have my b20vtec which i rap to the moon and i've built 4 other engines in the past 3 months that are running 92+mm cranks reving to 9.5k daily.. cause they are kids..Thats besides the point..

rod to stroke just shows how much angle pressure is applied to the sidewalls, and how much stress is put on the entire rotating assembly. In theory your rod to stroke should always play a part in your build.. but majority of the time, it doesn't.. and neither does piston speed.

Has it ever occured to you how long it takes you to cross the quartermile??

Say you run 12 seconds.. And your reving your engine to 9,000 rpms
whats rpm stand for ? Per minute right?

So in 12 seconds how many times have you reved your motor if your shifting at 9k rpms.. because its not 9000 rpms.. Just something to think about.

 

This is true

Get a nice header
And a well proven iintake manifold.. I recommend the PerformerX.

 

For the record and some more helpful information

piston speed has more to do with livibility than r/s to a certian point.
Realize that Piston Speed changes with stroke length, not Rod Lengh.
lower numerical rod/stroke ratio means greater piston acceleration rates and (i think) max piston velocity as it crosses center bore. the reciprocating mass will have more force that is required to be slowed down during the critical overlap stroke approaching TDC. therefore an increase in tensile stress on connecting rods, rod bolts, rod bearings, etc.

max piston velocity/acceleration dictates the level of tensile stress a bottom end undergoes, not rpm. if we knew how much stress the components could handle, and how much stress was generated for given r/s ratio@(X)rpm then we could factor in a safety factor and determine max safe rpm. unfortunately, it always seems trial and error are employed. most people arent happy to find out though.

 

like i sed... u guys keep doin wut u do

i'll keep building my bigger bore, modestly stroked, decent rod ratioed, ultra reliable VTECS. side with those guys all u want.
rod ratios exist for a reason. auto manufactures and race engine builders employ them for a reason. we are all Honda tuners. we tune small capacity four cylinder engines. small capacity engines need to rev to make power. u can hav all the stroke on this earth, if u cant rev our beloved VTECS to produce power (torque * RPM) then u arent going to make any. u actually proved my point for me. because u sed u used a longer rod on yor 89mm engine. WHY DID YOU DO THAT!!!

u guys can choose to deny it or circumvent it for what ever reason u need to convince yourselves that how u go about building engines is OK or acceptable, but rod ratio is a VERY important factor when building an engine. i build with the "Whole Engine Optimization" perspective not the what can i do to make my small capacity four cylinder Honda a torque monster perspective.

i dont do the 1/4 mile BS. maybe thats the difference between u guys and myself.

P.S. piston velocity and mean piston speed is determined by your R/S.

for a given stroke the shorter the rod the greater both will be.

 

there are more posts and threads on this forum about "How to Build a Reliable CR/LS VTEC" than ANY other topic. how many threads have u seen on "How to Build a Reliable B16". NONE!!!!!!!

think about that.....

 

you provide no proof to back up your claims..at all.. search rod stroke ratio on here, plenty of good threads to learn from.. good night.
I can tell you Jesus said that i'm right.. would you believe me??

B20's already come with a 89mm crank .. wiseass. The stock one was removed and replaced with a forged, very much lighter version by eagle. Less weight = less stress, and since i rev my b20vtec to the sky, i wanted to put as less stress as i could.

Again..r/s is only one part of a 10 part equations.. your like one of those guys that goes around and says "if you dont have this amount of compression u can't run these cams and make power" you can have 9.0:1 Cr and run pro3's and make tons of power.. Its only one part of the equation..

"i dont do the 1/4 mile BS. maybe thats the difference between u guys and myself" Whats that mean anyway?

Half the **** your writing is your opinion.. not factual information that has been discussed and proven.. If you knew anything at all you'd realize that you saying a long rod combo doesn't work is wrong. I run a long rod combo so i can rev high and have a good long stroke..

The "power" stroke and depending on the rod ratio, after about 30 degrees crank angle from TDC the piston begins to travel faster then the flame front, so you lose force of the piston. The shorter the rod the quicker this occurs so a longer rod increase the duration of the "power" stroke. hence more power.


Ferrari has a engine called their 355, it makes as much power as the C1 gsr but its 200cc smaller. the C1 has a R/s 1.58 whil the b16 has a 1.74 they both are 81mm bores yet ones a 77mm stroke.
If you intend on making power on a ****en honda.. rod length, piston speed and stroke ratio are all clear and you USE a LONG rod to crank stroke ratio.

 

1. i made no claims on here at all- except that i build reliable engines

2. not trying to be a "wise ***"- u sed u used a longer rod with the 89mm crank not me- i was simply asking why u did that- if r/s wasnt important at all there would b no reason at all for u to use a longer rod was the point i was trying to make

3. my previous reply stated that i build using a "whole engine optimization" concept- this would mean that i already realize "r/s is only one part of a 10 part equations" as u put it

4. i am not one of those guys who says u cant do this and u cant do that

5. ok, 1/4 mile is not BS- i just dont do it- i sed that because i figured that was the reason u guys design engines the way u do- once again i wasnt trying to be a "wise ***"

6. u r rite, it iz my opinion- just like stroked monsters is yor opinion- i would never stroke an engine if it meant i had a r/s ratio under 1.7

7. not factual, discussed or proven??????????????? r u serious???????? ALL Motor this is your own quote "search rod stroke ratio on here, plenty of good threads to learn from.. "- really dude????

8. never sed a long rod combo is wrong- i sed **** rod ratios are not good- no matter how long yor stroke is, if u hav a decent r/s ratio its better- my opinion- apparently i am not the only one who thinks that

9. yor statement- "The "power" stroke and depending on the rod ratio, after about 30 degrees crank angle from TDC the piston begins to travel faster then the flame front, so you lose force of the piston. The shorter the rod the quicker this occurs so a longer rod increase the duration of the "power" stroke. hence more power".
-absolutely rite- u just proved my point for me again
which is why tuners like myself want a better rod ratio in order to OPTIMIZE (theres that O word again) power output- not for the piston to run away from the propagation of the flame front- which is not optimal-longer rods dont do that

10. the 355 is a 3.5 liter V8 with 5 valves per cylinder, compared to a 1.8 liter four cylinder......its basically twice the size of a C1- 200cc???
THE 355 IS 1700CC BIGGER!!!! wut the f&%k are u talking about???? why r u comparing it to a B18C1????

once again- when either of u guys (1.5 Slowmatic, ALL Motor or Uncle Dave) find a CRAZY STROKED, LOW R/S RATIO AND UNDER SQUARE race engine, u let me know

this is great stuff...lol

 

Oh Yeah... your Ferrari 355 has a 85mm bore and a 77mm stroke!!!!

IMAGINE THAT!!!!!! I WONDER WHAT KIND OF R/S RATIO IT HAS???