I know theyre nowhere near as accurate as a wideband, but I dont really plan on doing my own tuning or anything to that extent...I just want something that I can glance at to make sure Im not running lean. Will something like a narrowband Autometer a/f gauge get it done? Or are they as worthless as most people claim?

Will be running a 12:1 Vortech FMU for maybe a month or two while I save for some injectors and a tune. I really dont want to dish out the money for a wideband since Im getting it tuned by someone else. Would a EGT gauge be a better option instead of a narrowband a/f?

 

???

 

You should realy do some more research on how narrowband sensors work. They are basically just a switch. They are only acurate (I use this word sparingly) when the exhaust is very close to stoich (ideal) anything outside of that will indicate either lean or rich.

A wideband on the other hand is much more acurate and it has a much wider voltage to work with. Unlike the narrowband, a wideband usually has around 5v to give a reading with. This means greater accuracy in what's being displayed on the gauge.

IMO, if you're going to fork out $30 - $45 for a narroband gauge and spend another $150 - $300 for a wideband setup down the road, why not just save your money and go straight for the wideband?

If it's that much of an issue for you, just go easy on it, and don't let the turbo spool up until you have everything you're supposed to have in that car before you jump on the gas pedal?

EGT isn't going to help you with you A/F ratio.

Oh, BTW, Go Lakers!

 

i would suggest not buying any gauges (especially useless ones) and putting the money towards a chipped ecu and tune.

 

Im aware that theyre nowhere near as accurate as widebands, my question was moreso whether these narrowband a/f gauges are as completely worthless as people claim...I dont plan on using a narrowband to tune or anything like that, I simply want it as something to give me a general idea of whether Im running lean. People cant possibly dish out $40+ dollars for these if theyre absolutely worthless can they? lol

And Manu was injured bro, or else it'd be another Spurs title.
Nuggets are taking the Lakers.

The FMU is temporary...I got it for free, so I figured why not run it for a while on low boost while I save for some injectors and a tune.

 

[QUOTE=jpo20;38676679] are they as worthless as most people claim?

[QUOTE]

Yes.

 

ok look at this picture, this is the operating range of a narrowband sensor


as you can see, below 14 afr the gauge just reads rich and above 15 afr the gauge just reads lean. that isnt helpful especially on a boosted car. in boost you want to target 11.5-12 afr but with that gauge you could be hitting only 13.5 but still get a "rich" reading even though 13.5 isnt safe when boosting and would be considered too lean.

does that make sense? basically a "rich" reading on that gauge could still mean you blow your motor quickly and when people say what afr's were you getting? your answer would be "uh idk something below 14". not helpful!

 

EGT is for Exhaust Gas Temperature.

Wideband is far more useful, so save the $$ for wideband.

 

if you want a general idea if you are lean and on a boosted engine, the narrow band gauge is NOT the one you want. that graph nails it.

and they arent claims about how useless they are. it is fact.

 

I know the EGT is exhaust gas temperature, but Ive heard of people going off of it to determine wether your running lean...although not recommended some even use it for tuning if Im not mistake.There's a general temperature range were u should be at otherwise your running lean/rich, or something along those lines.

And yea Ive heard bad things about the narrowbands, just wanted to confirm...looks like they are indeed a waste of money.

 

an egt can show if you are lean or rich but timing also influences egt. and it is not as fast to spot as a wideband.

 

yes completly useless. Don't tell you anything. GARBAGE get a wideband for $200. Best investment for any modified car. It will save your engine and you can tune of it.

 

egt can help you. higher temps mean leaner cylinders. but no where as accurate as a wideband for datalogging.

 

There are too many other possible causes for egt to be high. You would be better off with a narrowband gauge than an egt to measure af ratio. Forget about egt and narrowband.

Best advice I ever got (which I decided not to follow and learned the hard way) was that it is always better and cheaper to spend more up front than to cut corners and save a few bucks. Because in the long run, you are goint to have to fix it again any way. Always buy top quality parts that way you only have to buy it once. Sure, it might take you longer to save up for it and you might not be running 10s in the 1/4 mile by next weekend, but at least you will always have peace of mind, and nothing beats peace of mind.

Good luck and let us know how it goes...

 

Narrowband gauges do have some utility, but they are not foolproof.

You can lean misfire and show up rich on a narrowband gauge. High EGT can also fool a narrowband O2. You cannot tune anything with one either.

A 12:1 FMU is *not* going to run lean as long as you have a decent fuel pump and are running <8psi boost. You will run very rich. Set your base timing to 14deg BTDC and leave it.

If you want the dancing lights, get the gauge, but don't rely on it.

In order of reliability, how to tell your car is running lean:

1) Wideband O2
2) Your car runs like ****, so you let off the accelerator.
3) Narrowand O2

Narrowband O2 sensors are really good at maintaining closed-loop operation (maintaining stoich). That is their purpose. This is why they come with your car. If you want anything useful, invest in a wideband O2, you will not regret it. You *will* still want one, even if someone else is tuning your car. When you're out doing your high-speed runs, you'll feel a lot better seeing that <12 AFR on your gauge as you wind into 5th gear.

 

I disagree. Higher temps can also mean severely-retarded ignition timing, so the intake charge is still burning on the way out the exhaust. EGT has a use, but it has to be used in conjunction with:

1) Wideband AFR
2) Ignition timing at the given load/rpm point
3) Basic knowledge of a 4-stroke engine
4) Logic

 

This should have been #1 on your list.

 

You can buy a Wideband O2, but you can't buy logic

 

good point. When all else fails, use the tools invented by those who have logic to spare in case you might be lacking. I suppose that following this logic, technically, logic can be purchased (indirectly)???

I digress.