1992 Accord LX -- F221A1 -- 140K miles -- Automatic --

My Accord hesitates during acceleration at low rpm's but smoothes out at around 2500+. Also at idle, it stutters badly and sometimes stalls. This does not occur when the car is cold (30-40º F here in Tennessee), but within 45 sec to 1 min, the problem manifests itself.

After much searching and reading, I have:

- Replaced the fuel filter
- Installed new spark plugs
- Installed a new PCV valve
- Installed a new front heated 02 sensor
- Installed a new air filter
- Cleaned IACV (very dirty screen)
- Cleaned and tightened FITV (ring only ½ turn loose but now tight)
- Cleaned TB
- Cleaned inside of distributor with contact cleaner
- Cleaned the EGR ports (They were completely clogged)
- Adjusted timing (jumped service port and set timing) vehicle has no VECI label so if there were other pre-timing steps I did not do them.
- Cleaned the EGR valve
- Checked the main relay and re-soldered a couple of points even though they really did not looked cracked only discolored.
- Removed the ECU and TCU and inspected both internally for burned resistors or leaky capacitors (Both looked pristine)
- No detectable vacuum leaks
- Charged battery (just in case)
- Bled coolant system with no bubbles detected (just in case)
- Filled with 89 Octane and Gumoutâ­ fuel injector cleaner

During all of the above mentioned repairs I had several CEL codes, but all are now cleared and I drove 75 miles stop and go today with no further CEL codes.

I purchased the car last week for $600 and was told that it had a new coil, distributor cap, rotor, and wires. From visual inspection, I believe this to be true. No stray arching or blue haze can be seen.

Per this thread:
https://honda-tech.com/forums/showthread.php?t=2393222&highlight=2500+rpm

Tonight I unplugged the EGR electrical connector, plugged the vacuum line and test-drove ~20 miles. The idle problem disappeared (did get CEL code 12 which was to be expected). With the EGR disabled, the car idles perfectly at about 700 rpm. I also noticed an increase in power, but the hesitation during acceleration still continues. If I depress the throttle more than ¼ way in any gear -- stuttering. Once the RPM's are above 2500+, I can feather the throttle a little and get full power.

I still need to diagnose and see whether the EGR valve is faulty or if the lift sensor is faulty and react accordingly.

My next planned step is to check the TPS voltage.




Does the idle being corrected by disconnecting the EGR valve tell me anything significant other than a bad EGR valve?

How can I check the MAP sensor?

Is there anything that I am missing?

What other things do I need to be checking?

I am a novice and on a non-existent budget so I must figure this out myself. I have read dozens of threads on this same type problem and cannot find a good answer. No one has followed up with a post if his or her problem was corrected.

Any help or advice would be deeply appreciated.

 

The EGR lift sensor will require a scanner to read the scan data to see where it is sitting at idle. I also believe that you need an ignition coil for the studder on accel, although I would change the plug wires first.

Try to accel very lightly through a higher speed, if its ok then I think its ignition related.

You can borrow a hand vacuum pump, pump up the EGR vacuum connector and see if the engine will completely die while idling.

Can you also let us know what the MAP sensor voltage is going back to the computer, it needs to be right at 1VDC, very close, fully warmed up with no accessories or fans on.

EGR valve pintle and its ports may just need cleaning, instructions are all over this site and the web. MAP sensor may be easiest to check at the ECU.

Your codes may take several drive cycles to make a code come back so be patient. Take the first line of your request, your car info, and incorperate it into your signature block.

 

you said the distributor components where changed. sounds like the ignitor wires may be loose. take the distributor cap, rotor, and the little plastic hood off. behind it you will see a little thingy with 4 wires hooked to it. this is the ignitor. have some pliers handy and get yourself some di-electric grease. auto parts stores have like a small package near the counter. disconnect the spade wires one by one. very slighty kinda bend the female end of the wire together to make it a bit tighter. put some of the grease on the male end of the ignitor. reinstall the wire back on the spade. it should be a pretty firm fit. if its too loose, take back off and retighten. repeat steps for remaining three wires. oh and dissconnect your battery first.

 

I read the replies to my thread and decided to follow the suggestions exactly and proceed further.

From first reply:

- I pulled a vacuum on the EGR valve and the car immediately died (engine warm at idle)
- I checked the MAP output voltage and as described by Duane, the output voltage was 1.02V. I did have to check this at the connector as I do not have a test harness and do not know the proper pin-outs of the ECU)

Additionally, I checked the following:

- MAP power to body GND -> 5.02 volts
- MAP power to MAP GND -> 5.02 volts
- MAP output power -> decreases as vacuum increases with 1.0 volts achieved at approx 20 in Hg
- EGR hose #16, no vacuum at warm idle
- Put 20 in Hg vacuum on EGR and the EGR lost approx 5 in Hg every 10 seconds

Second reply:

- Pulled distributor cap and crimped all the female connectors to the igniter to eliminate possible intermittent contact.
- Coated the igniter terminals with dielectric grease

Now the new developments:

- Since I had to get a loan-a-tool vacuum pump, I decided while I was at the parts store to go ahead and R&R the distributor cap, rotor, and wire set.

Somehow, either by tightening the igniter connectors, or by replacing the distributor cap, rotor, and wire set, all hesitation and idle problem were solved.

I am so used to everything being so complicated, I am surprised how simple this was.

NEW PROBLEM:

Immediately upon test-drive after replacing the parts mentioned above, I began getting a CEL #43.

I test drove approx 60 miles today and reset the ECU twice, but the code 43 popped up each time after about only one minute of driving.

QUESTION:

- What could be the root cause of the code 43?

I replaced the O2 sensor two days ago. The replacement was a Bosch brand.

I will check the sensor resistance and voltages tomorrow.

- If the sensor is OK, what does this mean?

- Could the sensor have fouled during my test driving with the hesitation and sputtering?

- If so, is there any way at all to clean the sensor, cold water, contact cleaner, etc?

- Does a clogged catalytic converter cause this?

Please advise and expound further if possible.

Thank you so very much for your help. I truly am grateful.

 

The only thing that i havent read about is vacuum line routing. There should be a sticker on the hood with the routing on it. misrouted vacuum lines can cause weird problems.

 

had the same problem with my 91 exr a long time ago..replaced the egr, fully cleaned the passage with a tooth brush.. yes a tooth brush, also, my buddy , a mechanic.. removed and cleaned the injectors idividually.. car ran perfect after filling her halfway with high octane and replaced the fast idle as well as the TPS , plugs wires and distributor.. the injectors may cause that hesitation. your getting bw 1500-2500rpms

 

This car that I purchased for only $600 does not have the VECI label under the hood. I am not sure if it was wrecked or not, but it is in great condition otherwise.

- Can anyone post a picture of the VECI label for a 1992 Accord 2.2 F221A1?

- From earlier, I did clean the EGR ports and the EGR valve; however, I did not clean the area from the EGR valve to the ports, could this be the problem?

- Is it possible to clean the O2 sensor in any way? I can get a can of compresed air for computer cleaning if that is an option. What about rinsing under cold running water?

Thanks for the help. You gentlemen are great!!!

 

You will need to find the How To in the upper section of the threads area to see the correct way to clean EGR and ports, its all over the internet also. Its a tough job and you need to be extra clean about it.

 

I have the exact problem with my 93 accord. l have been atempting several fixes as well as researching for months. My next fix it to replace the temperature sensor. My fans are not coming on and the symptoms show to be similar to what you described. I am hoping that will be the fix.

 

maybe need to set the air and gas mixture took it to a shop and told them about it did it and worked out for me. charged me 50 bucks.

 

I have considered that. From what I have read, the Temperature sensor contorls the air / fuel mixture. I changed the rotor and my gas mileage improved 20% from the dismal decline I experienced with the problem. I went from 30mpg to 24 as things worsened. I will replace the distributor cap and move to the sensor.

After all that, I will probably be taking your advice. I just don't know a mechanic I trust. Thank you for the response.

 

hey guys i know this post is old but ive seen many threads like this with hesitation under 2500 rpms when warm ect. well i had this problem and it turns out it was a bad coil pack. checkem!