oem or remanufactured steering rack?
oem or remanufactured steering rack?
I am looking to get a new rack for my 97 cx non ps. One of the boots are torn and i feel better replacing everything instead of just the boot. My question is should i go with a new oem or a reman. one from like autozone or advance? i was also thinking about rebuilding it and getting the quaifie rack and pinion but i cant find it for a 96-00 civic. would one from a 92-95 work? or would i have to get a eg subframe and rack and install the quaifie then swap out my frame?
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,029
Likes: 59
From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Well I have a rebuilt rack on my car, but it's from an upstanding company that uses all OEM Honda parts when they rebuild racks. I bought it through a guy I know at a local shop.
But having said that, I had a torn rack boot on my car several years ago, so I just replaced both boots and both outer tie rods and was done with it. It worked fine for years after that. I only replaced my rack because I thought it was making a noise, but the noise ended up being something else. You should be fine just replacing the boots and outer tie rods.
But having said that, I had a torn rack boot on my car several years ago, so I just replaced both boots and both outer tie rods and was done with it. It worked fine for years after that. I only replaced my rack because I thought it was making a noise, but the noise ended up being something else. You should be fine just replacing the boots and outer tie rods.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
theres really nothing more to replace on a non power steering rack than the rack end bushing, and maybe the pinion bearing tho. thats it.
its kind of pointless to buy a "rebuilt" manual rack because theres nothing more to rebuild. you still would have to remove the rack anyway, which is most of the labor of "rebuilding" the rack.
i havent found any rebuilder of manual racks actually. whered you find yours patrick?
and yes, dont forget to adjust the gearbox. its 20% of the slop.
its kind of pointless to buy a "rebuilt" manual rack because theres nothing more to rebuild. you still would have to remove the rack anyway, which is most of the labor of "rebuilding" the rack.
i havent found any rebuilder of manual racks actually. whered you find yours patrick?
and yes, dont forget to adjust the gearbox. its 20% of the slop.
Trending Topics
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,029
Likes: 59
From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Yea I know, I was just mentioning that I opted for a rebuilt rack as opposed to brand new.
Also, the Quaife rack and pinion set is actually a slower ratio than a stock power steering rack. So if you want manual steering but a quicker ratio, you'd be better off just getting a power rack and doing a vented rack setup.
Also, the Quaife rack and pinion set is actually a slower ratio than a stock power steering rack. So if you want manual steering but a quicker ratio, you'd be better off just getting a power rack and doing a vented rack setup.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,029
Likes: 59
From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Well for 5th gen Civics and 3rd gen Integras, the Quaife unit is 3.25 turns LTL, vs. only 3 turns LTL for stock power racks. That means you have to turn the wheel more to make the front wheels steer the same amount - slower ratio.
But yeah I see the 4th gen Civic is only 2.8 turns LTL for the Quaife unit, quite a bit quicker than stock I'm sure.
But yeah I see the 4th gen Civic is only 2.8 turns LTL for the Quaife unit, quite a bit quicker than stock I'm sure.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,029
Likes: 59
From: Nowhere and Everywhere
well, whatever... you would still have to turn the steering wheel farther with the Quaife unit on a EG/DC than you would if you just did a vented power rack.
Now this is just my speculation, but for a non-power rack to have the same ratio as a power rack, but have more turns LTL, that would mean that either the rack gear is longer, or the rack gear is the same with a smaller pinion gear (with smaller/more teeth on the rack gear). I don't think the rack gear would be longer, because then the wheels would turn farther at full lock, and stock tires would probably rub.
I would be curious to compare the turning circle diameter for 4th gen and 5th gen Civics with both power and non-power racks.
Now this is just my speculation, but for a non-power rack to have the same ratio as a power rack, but have more turns LTL, that would mean that either the rack gear is longer, or the rack gear is the same with a smaller pinion gear (with smaller/more teeth on the rack gear). I don't think the rack gear would be longer, because then the wheels would turn farther at full lock, and stock tires would probably rub.
I would be curious to compare the turning circle diameter for 4th gen and 5th gen Civics with both power and non-power racks.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
you only turn the wheel the amount you need to go to make a turn.... despite the maximum range of available rotation, thats regardless quite frankly, unless youre making uturns...
i bought a factory civic ef service manual just to look this info up and put this to rest for EF's at least. funny, theres no public scans of any EF other than a CRX.
[edit]
Power rack is faster if the ratio is lower
i bought a factory civic ef service manual just to look this info up and put this to rest for EF's at least. funny, theres no public scans of any EF other than a CRX.
[edit]
Power rack is faster if the ratio is lower
Last edited by Tyson; Dec 3, 2008 at 03:57 PM.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
look at how relatively much more complicated a power steering rack is compared to a non powered rack.
im not saying you can judge ratio's and lengths from these parts diagrams. im just making a point they are not made the same.
its apples and oranges and lock to lock is more than just a determination of steering ratio.
the actual steering ratio spec is listed in the helms manuals. i would refer to those numbers only.
im not saying you can judge ratio's and lengths from these parts diagrams. im just making a point they are not made the same.
its apples and oranges and lock to lock is more than just a determination of steering ratio.
the actual steering ratio spec is listed in the helms manuals. i would refer to those numbers only.
Last edited by Tyson; Dec 3, 2008 at 01:53 PM.
Joined: Jan 2002
Posts: 30,029
Likes: 59
From: Nowhere and Everywhere
Okay I checked the Helms manual specs, and the Quaife rack is indeed quicker than both manual and power 5th gen Civic racks, but slower than the Integra power rack.
Civic manual rack - 19.0 ratio, 3.88 turns LTL
Civic power rack - 17.5 ratio, 3.58 turns LTL
Integra power rack - 16.1 ratio, 2.98 turns LTL
The Quaife rack and pinion set didn't list its ratio, but it is 3.25 turns LTL.
Civic manual rack - 19.0 ratio, 3.88 turns LTL
Civic power rack - 17.5 ratio, 3.58 turns LTL
Integra power rack - 16.1 ratio, 2.98 turns LTL
The Quaife rack and pinion set didn't list its ratio, but it is 3.25 turns LTL.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
ahh crap! im wrong!
high ratio's mean slower turning.
fark, ive misread it this whole time...
sorry. carry on.
http://auto.howstuffworks.com/steering2.htm
high ratio's mean slower turning.
fark, ive misread it this whole time...
sorry. carry on.
The steering ratio is the ratio of how far you turn the steering wheel to how far the wheels turn. For instance, if one complete revolution (360 degrees) of the steering wheel results in the wheels of the car turning 20 degrees, then the steering ratio is 360 divided by 20, or 18:1. A higher ratio means that you have to turn the steering wheel more to get the wheels to turn a given distance. However, less effort is required because of the higher gear ratio.
Generally, lighter, sportier cars have lower steering ratios than larger cars and trucks. The lower ratio gives the steering a quicker response -- you don't have to turn the steering wheel as much to get the wheels to turn a given distance -- which is a desirable trait in sports cars. These smaller cars are light enough that even with the lower ratio, the effort required to turn the steering wheel is not excessive.
Generally, lighter, sportier cars have lower steering ratios than larger cars and trucks. The lower ratio gives the steering a quicker response -- you don't have to turn the steering wheel as much to get the wheels to turn a given distance -- which is a desirable trait in sports cars. These smaller cars are light enough that even with the lower ratio, the effort required to turn the steering wheel is not excessive.
ok guys so what i am gunna do is get 2 new boots and the 2 outer tie rods. is it wise to change the inners also? i was also going to get the energy suspension bushings what do you guys think of that? i also heard its good to change the #10 bushing in the manual rack diagram anything else i should replace?
so is there any upgrade in steering racks for the 96-00 civic? maybe a teg vented rack? or is there anyway to modify the quaifie stuff to fit on the 96-00 civic? i wanna know before i go freshening up my current rack
so is there any upgrade in steering racks for the 96-00 civic? maybe a teg vented rack? or is there anyway to modify the quaifie stuff to fit on the 96-00 civic? i wanna know before i go freshening up my current rack
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
replacing the #10 bushing is key.
if the boot is torn, then its likely the inner tie rod needs replacing. i would check at least.
i dont think changing #12 and #28 bushings to poly would matter much, but ive never tried. theyre cheap. but remember, #10 is much more important and thats only OEM replacement available.
if the boot is torn, then its likely the inner tie rod needs replacing. i would check at least.
i dont think changing #12 and #28 bushings to poly would matter much, but ive never tried. theyre cheap. but remember, #10 is much more important and thats only OEM replacement available.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
https://honda-tech.com/forums/honda-crx-ef-civic-1988-1991-3/crx-rack-end-bushing-1117870/
read thru the thread. links are in the posts.
read thru the thread. links are in the posts.
Honda-Tech Member
Joined: Apr 2002
Posts: 18,961
Likes: 76
From: I am Tyson
