The setup is a Bone stock B20b low compression with a drag kit (turbo is a borg warner to4e, 55 trim spec III)

I am boosting 10psi, and made 250whp, and 220 torque on RLZ engineerings dyno (known to be low anyways) but I want more-



As you can see, it looks like the torque curve is really dropping off after 5000 RPMS-

I want to go back for a retune, and would like 325 or so at the wheels-


How much would I benefit from going with a top end oriented intake manifold such as a victor X?

 

i dont what wrong with those numbers. but you will need to change the MAP sensor in order to raise boost which may help you. or you could just try a t3/t4 57 trim ( keep it simple an common)

 

build the head if you want more power and also to keep ur tq curve up. get a set of Crower 404 cams w/ springs and retainers and also a Skunk2 IM. i dont think you will benefit much with the edlebrock manifold

 

definately look to some crower cams 403 or 404s and an aftermarket intake manifold.

as mentioned you will need upgraded map sensor

 

looks like a fun motor to drive, bet u roast the tires everytime u punch it.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by blackeg &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">definately look to some crower cams 403 or 404s and an aftermarket intake manifold.

as mentioned you will need upgraded map sensor</TD></TR></TABLE>

For the price of switching out to 403's and an aftermarket IM, im better of just swapping on a VTEC head no? I mean its going to cost me around 700 with retainers and springs to get upgraded cams- why not just get a vtec head?

Id much rather save the money and do somethign simple like just get a IM and up the boost would that help at all?

 

I would be weary of boosting too much on a stock bottom end b20. Why not go piston/rods and up the boost?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nytosc &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">For the price of switching out to 403's and an aftermarket IM, im better of just swapping on a VTEC head no? I mean its going to cost me around 700 with retainers and springs to get upgraded cams- why not just get a vtec head?

Id much rather save the money and do somethign simple like just get a IM and up the boost would that help at all? </TD></TR></TABLE>

that was what alot of people told me to do and guess what i ended up getting a vtec head anyway .

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by JoePSI &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I would be weary of boosting too much on a stock bottom end b20. Why not go piston/rods and up the boost?</TD></TR></TABLE>

because pistons and rods still wont help his tq curve unless he gets a bigger crank or longer length rods. and lowering his CR will allow him more boost but theres no point for that at the moment.

 

if you want a good power band in a non vtec motor you are going to half to work on the head so in short either go with what was said before or buy a vtec head and i would go with the 404s over the 403s the idle is not that bad

 

I guess im going to find a cheap GSR/ b16 head, deck it and do a valve job / valve seals and slap it on-
Should make 325+ on RLZ's dyno im assuming

 

I had a Built bottom end b20 on 11pounds it made 292whp and 218wtq
Then I did NOTHING else to the setup except change the head to a B16 head.
Went and dyno'd it after the tune and it made 355whp and 284wtq on 11 psi.

Vtec head is the best bang for the buck, cost me less than 700 in total.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by Boostedb20EH2 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">I had a Built bottom end b20 on 11pounds it made 292whp and 218wtq
Then I did NOTHING else to the setup except change the head to a B16 head.
Went and dyno'd it after the tune and it made 355whp and 284wtq on 11 psi.

Vtec head is the best bang for the buck, cost me less than 700 in total.</TD></TR></TABLE>

to OP you will need to switch your stock pistons to vtec pistons you dont wanna [freak] any valves

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">
because pistons and rods still wont help his tq curve unless he gets a bigger crank or longer length rods. and lowering his CR will allow him more boost but theres no point for that at the moment. </TD></TR></TABLE>

He has 250hp and 220tq, his torque curve may fall off, but hes building a lot of torque compared to his HP, which is what you would expect from this setup. He wants to hit 325, and pistons and rods are a definite requirement for this much HP (in regards to reliability). Piston/Rods + more boost will get his 325 goal. Best bang for buck + reliability.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

to OP you will need to switch your stock pistons to vtec pistons you dont wanna [freak] any valves</TD></TR></TABLE>
wat

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

to OP you will need to switch your stock pistons to vtec pistons you dont wanna [freak] any valves</TD></TR></TABLE>


sorry man but that makes no sense at all.

there are no such "vtec" pistons that would fit in this motor its 84mm....

and how would i mess up my valves?

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by nytosc &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">


sorry man but that makes no sense at all.

there are no such "vtec" pistons that would fit in this motor its 84mm....

and how would i mess up my valves? </TD></TR></TABLE>

the valves reliefs in the vtec pistons are larger than the valve reliefs in a non vtec piston. so just taking a vtec and putting them on a non vtec block just isnt going to work.
Vtec intake valves are 33mm
non-vtec valves are 31mm
if you dont want to buy new pistons clay the motor and check your clearances to see if your current pisotns will work

and since there arent any 84mm factory bseries pistons will need to buy arias or CP pistons.

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

the valves reliefs in the vtec pistons are larger than the valve reliefs in a non vtec piston. so just taking a vtec and putting them on a non vtec block just isnt going to work.
Vtec intake valves are 33mm
non-vtec valves are 31mm
if you dont want to buy new pistons clay the motor and check your clearances to see if your current pisotns will work

and since there arent any 84mm factory bseries pistons will need to buy arias or CP pistons. </TD></TR></TABLE>

While this is true, vtec INTAKE valves are larger, I wouldn't worry about it... you will have no clearance issue as long as you don't advance the intake cam more than 3 degrees.

Just make sure you take your car to a competent tuner and advise him of your setup.

 

a guy I used to know ran the same set up (b20/404s/skunk 2 IM) in an integra except with spray direct port 100 shot (I believe...couldve been a little lower). it ran very low 13's all day long.


Modified by EASY101 at 4:00 PM 7/28/2008

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by tony413 &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">

the valves reliefs in the vtec pistons are larger than the valve reliefs in a non vtec piston. so just taking a vtec and putting them on a non vtec block just isnt going to work.
Vtec intake valves are 33mm
non-vtec valves are 31mm
if you dont want to buy new pistons clay the motor and check your clearances to see if your current pisotns will work

and since there arent any 84mm factory bseries pistons will need to buy arias or CP pistons. </TD></TR></TABLE>

Actually not necessarily- I have a P8R head (33mm valves) on the vehicle right now-
Theres no reason why I wouldn't be able to bolt on a b series head onto a stock block bottom end

 

well in that case go buy a vtec and watch the power roll in

 

well if you do have the infamous p8r head, look into some cams and a new intake manifold to help it breathe a little bit better. stock bottom end i would take it easy and not get too deep powerwise. with a vtec head it will be tempting to start pushing that turbo bottom end wont be able to hang once you start moving some serious air.

 

O, and btw OP: You will never be satisfied with your current Hp/Tq #... I got bored of 380hp in less than 6 months... My three buddies got tired of 400 and went for 600. Its a viscous cycle

 

Turn up the boost controller SON!

 

<TABLE WIDTH="90%" CELLSPACING=0 CELLPADDING=0 ALIGN=CENTER><TR><TD>Quote, originally posted by extralargenog &raquo;</TD></TR><TR><TD CLASS="quote">Turn up the boost controller SON!</TD></TR></TABLE>

Thats a good idea, considering the b20 has as much meat between the cylinders as a slice of deli ham.

 

So increasing flow via more boost is worse than increasing flow with a better head? Both will lead to X amount more air in the cylinder, meaning higher peak cylinder pressure. THAT is what will kill the sleeves. The only issue with more boost over better head is that his IAT's will go up a few degrees, which isn't much to worry about.

Ideally he'd get controlled boost creep, since peak torque is where peak cylinder pressures usually occur. If I had a turbo B20, I'd spend ~$750 for 81.5mm pistons/rods before a vtec head, if you catch my drift...